Over nerfed Obers

31.03.15 was a good patch in many terms.
This patch however, was a typical overnerf on especially one unit.
I'm not any axis-fanboy but let's be realistic here. The squads reinforcement cost is 50...FIFTY!! The highest reinforcement cost in the game? Yes.
In order to payoff for a single model it has to actually kill ~2 models. This was also the usual trade in my experience.
Now they're underperforming worse than I bet any unit in the game. I bet even fusilers with G43s outperform an Ober squad at this point. Paratroopers will have no issues dealing with them with upgraded M1919A6s. And what are their cost compared to the obers? 360? 28 for reinforcement? Less reinforcment cost than a grenadier squad. Fun fact: Paras doesn't even require teching!
Too much nerf in my opinion. They needed a nerf, but not this much.

You don't know yet how they perform because => youd didn't play them yet because = > you didn't install the patch yet. Patience FFS.

You don't know yet how they perform because => youd didn't play them yet because = > you didn't install the patch yet. Patience FFS.

Why do I need to play them when I have their stats right in front of me which describes them 100 %?

well stats wise They still out preform any small arms fire unit on the field. They only real difference is you have to pay for the ability to slaughter infantry and make a decision as to whether or not you want mines or shrecks.

Welcome to Soviet side where you have to make decisions where you tech and spend your resources

Sorry, but i dont think this is the case. Obers with no LMG still out DPS rifles by 441% at long range.


Durability wise, they are almost as durable as 6 grens againts small arms.

Considering 4 gren models cost 240, 6 grens would cost 360.

Surely the best LMG in the game + booby traps + 2 very strong grenades makes up for that 40mp cost right?

Lol no just no

Squad almost twice as good as grens cost almost twice as much and still can upgrade with much better weapon.

God forbid obers are not brainless move and you actually have to think if you want them now!

They have high reinforcement cost, because they are most durable in game long range infantry. Also their reinforce cost matches perfectly universal reinforce cost formula(reinforcing from 1 entity to full squad= ~40% of squad value), so there is no problem here.

Also of course M1919 paras will beat them. What did you expected if you put 380mp+120mun vs 400mp unit? The resource difference alone makes it quite clear which one should end on top. Even with 60 muni LMG it makes perfect sense from balance perspective for them to loose a fight on equal footing.

Now, lets use another argument axis players used recently:
You pay additional costs for UTILITY as you can place BOOBY TRAPS with them without the need for doctrine.

Now, lets do some basic math:
150 is 37% of 400.
5x 28 is 140 and 140 is 37% of 380.

OH MY GOD! THE UNITS REINFORCE FOR EXACTLY HOW MUCH THEY SHOULD HAVE! IN FACT IT MAKES SENSE FOR OBERS TO REINFORCE FOR SLIGHTLY MORE THEN NOW AS WELL AS PARAS!
BURN THIS MATHEMATICAL WHICH FOR PROVING THAT EVERYTHING IS FINE!

Why do I need to play them when I have their stats right in front of me which describes them 100 %?

Because you have no slightest clue on how to read them correctly.
You see forest but not trees.

Why do I need to play them when I have their stats right in front of me which describes them 100 %?

Shit, why even play the game ever? Just read your spreadsheets.

Keep making DerpThreads.

Sorry, but i dont think this is the case. Obers with no LMG still out DPS rifles by 441% at long range. (Sorry no idea what i was saying here) they out DPS by almost 2x at range with base rifles)


Durability wise, they are almost as durable as 6 grens againts small arms.

Considering 4 gren models cost 240, 6 grens would cost 360.

Surely the best LMG in the game + booby traps + 2 very strong grenades makes up for that 40mp cost right?

Also of course M1919 paras will beat them. What did you expected if you put 380mp+120mun vs 400mp unit? The resource difference alone makes it quite clear which one should end on top. Even with 60 muni LMG it makes perfect sense from balance perspective for them to loose a fight on equal footing.

Your "math" deliberately doesn't take into account the OKW tier costs. Ummm.... let's say T2 and T4. Or T3 and T4 if you like. Of course you know without them there are no Obers, do you? Now add the tiering costs and remake the calculations and post the results. Maybe I will give you an A after all, though currently you deserve a C (if I am indulgent).

It also doesn't take into account that fact Fuss, JLI and Fallsch will be cheaper, unnerfed, and I don't need to pay munitions to get my full DPS out of them.

This just changed the meta, I expect a whine thread on those 3 infantry by 10 oclock on the marrow, don't disappoint me!

Your "math" deliberately doesn't take into account the OKW tier costs. Ummm.... let's say T2 and T4. Or T3 and T4 if you like. Of course you know without them there are no Obers, do you? Now add the tiering costs and remake the calculations and post the results. Maybe I will give you an A after all, though currently you deserve a C (if I am indulgent).

Unless you are using tier building directly in combat, the tier costs mean jack shit. Moreover you don't dismantle all previous tiers after getting single obers and put them all back again to get another one.

Tech costs are just that-an indicator of WHEN unit should arrive. Units cost itself is one of indicators of its performance.

My math included every mandatory stat. Its simply your comprehension which can't go over it as you simply lack the understanding of what is what in the game.

@Alexzandvar
No one holds you back and about every single person on these boards expects you to be the author of that thread(how UP everything is now).

Again; nobody is going to get them when you can use call in infantry. Cheaper, come out earlier, and I don't need to pay munitions to make them worth my time.

EDIT: lol I have not make a single balance thread ever in my 2000 posts here, try harder Katitof.

Obers Kars are still good, dont forget that Obers LMG still fires at move

Then what is the problem?
No longer no brainer choice, another choices became valid now that single overperforming unit was put in line with them.
You can now make a decision instead of training a dog to press button sequence, a-move and win.

Squad almost twice as good as grens cost almost twice as much and still can upgrade with much better weapon.

God forbid obers are not brainless move and you actually have to think if you want them now!

They have high reinforcement cost, because they are most durable in game long range infantry. Also their reinforce cost matches perfectly universal reinforce cost formula(reinforcing from 1 entity to full squad= ~40% of squad value), so there is no problem here.

Also of course M1919 paras will beat them. What did you expected if you put 380mp+120mun vs 400mp unit? The resource difference alone makes it quite clear which one should end on top. Even with 60 muni LMG it makes perfect sense from balance perspective for them to loose a fight on equal footing.

Now, lets use another argument axis players used recently:
You pay additional costs for UTILITY as you can place BOOBY TRAPS with them without the need for doctrine.

Now, lets do some basic math:
150 is 37% of 400.
5x 28 is 140 and 140 is 37% of 380.

OH MY GOD! THE UNITS REINFORCE FOR EXACTLY HOW MUCH THEY SHOULD HAVE! IN FACT IT MAKES SENSE FOR OBERS TO REINFORCE FOR SLIGHTLY MORE THEN NOW AS WELL AS PARAS!
BURN THIS MATHEMATICAL WHICH FOR PROVING THAT EVERYTHING IS FINE!


Because you have no slightest clue on how to read them correctly.
You see forest but not trees.

You should quit your game store job and become a politician, seriously.

It's started already?
We didn't even have a chance to play the new patch...

It wasn't an overnerf at all. I think maybe we should just wait and play the game to see. If someone likes to play with spreadsheets, MAYBE you are playing the wrong game - I'd recommend playing Blackjack or Pocker with a scientific calculator, or perhaps a good'ole tabletop RPG.

It's started already?
We didn't even have a chance to play the new patch...

a few calculations shows them to be brutally cost ineffective compared to the other infantry. fuck it even volks will outperform them now.

You should quit your game store job and become a politician, seriously.

I'm actually closer to game designer then to game seller
And if anything, I'd make a good diplomat, not politician