I need help to finish OKW

I cannot understand how to win vs OKW. Generally i push hard in the early and mid game, giving him only the territories where it put Flak HQ. I get 2 shermans to kill shrek infantry, but it never end! First at all all OKW infantry almost never die when in retreat even if there is only 1 man left. Second, obertroops kill my infantry like flies. Slowly the OKW gains spaces till the win (generally ends when OKW had only 10-20 victory point left.)

It's clear that i do some mistakes because i'm at around 1000 in ladder (i was 200, before, but now it seems that players are more better), but my enemies are around that level too.

I link the last replay...

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  VS

  Kersal

  ShowMeTheGame

  same old story

  by: kersal map: La Gleize Breakout

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I struggle with this as well. Maybe it comes to killing the trucks? I'm not sure though. need halp.

ill give you my notes as i watch
Early Game

OKW made a mistake going for Kubel on a map with so many buildings.
You did a great job with micro and flanking at beginning. Rush a sherman from there. END IT.

Build order is where it starts to bite you

You got 5 RIFLES!!! 50 cal and an M20 which KILLS YOUR MANPOWER AND UPKEEP. NEVER GET MORE THAN 4 RIFLES AT A TIME. You also sacrificed healing and forward reinforcement when you get this many rifles. Just not a good idea at all. And when you do this it opens you up for comebacks.

You then lose one of these rifles,which is even more manpower bleed. your fuel income is also sliced and cut off at one point

You got good mileage out of your 50 cal(I applaud you) but then you lose it to a mob of inf when you left it unsupported in building. That hurt. it was vet 2.

You didnt upgrade your rifles with bars or flames to truly capitilize on your great advantage.

you get out a somewhat late sherman (if you used fuel caches instead of spamming and reinforcing so many rifles,you wouldve had that sherman even earlier)

By midgame map control is totally flipped and your infantry heavy army is completely countered. OKW resisted your rifle spam and now you're about to pay. T4 is being set up ,and OKW has most of his inf pulled back. I know its easy to see this in hindsight,but still you couldve scouted ahead and killed it while its setting up. At around 8 mins always look for that quiet part of the map where a truck will be setting up.

A bit of an unfortunate squad lost to incendiary Mg34 in a building.

now you're mp drained and youre down to 3 rifles and an LT with NO healing vs a bunch of falls,vetted volks,and mg34,and soon obers.

Wasted 140 muni on major barrage. Come on. get some bars. Plant some mines.

You also get ANOTHER 50 cal. just put up some Caches and roll him with your shermans.

Game gets a little crazy when his panther comes out and hits the M20 mine. You did good here,you both take heavy casualties,but that favors OKW. You're also starting to float manpower, and it this point I HIGHLY recommend some caches. "

He still has most of the map while this is all going on.

Youre floating 1000 manpower,and theres 50 cals laying around. get some Re's,recrew those guns,and get up some caches.

OKW is just spamming obers and MGs. Ill say it one more time you needed some caches badly. very badly.

you lose some MORE rifles. Still floating. OKW steals 50 cal from you as you take the Mg34 instead of 50. cal.

You're seemingly getting frustrated and having concentration lapses,and now OKW has a good shrek blob going. You're losing more and more squads.

Still no healing. Still no forward reinfrocement. Still no caches. Still floating MP. Vet 3 m20 and vet 3 sherman though,nice.

You research nades for some reason(with no rifles to really throw them) and then lose a vet 3 LT in a game where VPs are starting to matter.

You do catch a bunch of breaks in a row though,wiping 3 shrek squads,mainly because this guy didnt know how to retreat in front of two vetted HE shermans. at this point you shouldve rushed his base with your shermans and just ended the game right there,but you wait. no aggression.

Another panther is queueing for OKW palyer. You dont have your jackson ready to react. One of your shermans is low on health nad you only have one m20 mine placed and its not anywhere near ur two shermans.
This isnt gonna end well.
Lose vet 3 m20 to sillyness. POP SMOKE man! M20 is fast enough at vet 3 to get away from a panther.

You get very unlucky and he doesnt hit the M20 mine,and kils one of your shermans. however i honestly say you had it coming with all the floating and lack of aggression. You're clearly better than this guy and he makes very questionable decisions,but so have you. You then dont chase with your jackson.

Very unlucky bounce from your jackson when you DO try to chase momentarily. But again you stop chasing him :/ go win the game man its right there for you.

YOU PARK YOUR OWN JACKSON ON YOUR OWN MINE THEN A SHREK SQUAD IMMOBILZES AND KILLS UR JACKSON. Im sorry but that was failtastic.


You're still floating 600 manpower,and the panther is now almost vet 2. You also have nothing but unequipped vanilla vet rifles running around,opponent has nothing but obers and a panther. you dont harass left VP enough. Win the game man. You never use your sherm and jackson to take out T4 flak and secure fuel point. Bad.

YOU DO GET THE 2nd PANTHER THOUGH! he finnally hits a mine and his luck runs out. he has nothing left. BASE RAPE HIM or cap the vps!

By the way he still has most of the map at this point,you're winning strategically but not economically. Still no caches. He has 155 fuel and yet another panther is soon to come. WIN NOW!! or kill that HQ truck!!!

unsupported MGs in church will never hold back late game OKW infantry. Bad. You lose yet anohter 50 cal,and yet another rifle squad. BUILD. SOME . Caches.!!!

You lose a vet 3 sherman to pure sillyness. Use smoke and repiar that critical F,and youve lost most of the advantage you gained only a few short minutes ago.
You finally get medics. 50 minutes in, Bad.. And his infantry is still stomping yours Still no upgrades, no bars,plenty of muni wasted.


and that loss was entirely on you. OKW is not OP in this case. You werent aggressive enough when you wiped most of his Anti tank assets. You never killed the T4 truck,and it was unguarded and unmined for 50 minutes. I put your biggest failures in BOLD

Ok, man. Thanks a lot.
I will build more caches.
I will never do more than 4 rifles
I will try to destroy his flak HQ (but how?? 2 shermans are enough?)

Ok, man. Thanks a lot.
I will build more caches.
I will never do more than 4 rifles
I will try to destroy his flak HQ (but how?? 2 shermans are enough?)

2 shermans are more than enough but the more you have the better, if you have sth else like at gun, shreck, zooks, pack howitzer and so on, add it to the attack. Remember that once flak hq aims at a target it cannot change it so if you go with shermans first and then at guns, zooks, infantry, stuart, whatever you have and is squishy you can move around freely as long as your sherman is showing frontal armour to the flak hq. It's best to be done when enemy sends his shreck blob to harras your fuel or munitions as you will be able to kill the truck before he comes back even with 2 shermans. If you can see him coming you can use whatever arty ability your doctrine has to keep it away from shermans (only airborn has no anti infantry artilery) and if it's impossible to kill just back of, repair shermans and attack again. If your attacks are constant he will loose ability to harass your territory becouse of constant need to defend.

Was Cookiezncreem's input thorough enough? Or would you like another perspective?

Ok, man. Thanks a lot.
I will build more caches.
I will never do more than 4 rifles
I will try to destroy his flak HQ (but how?? 2 shermans are enough?)

Make sure you know when to build caches. dont just build them just because,but build them when youve just pushed him off the map and you have spare MP. Thats how you prevent comebacks.


IF you ever get 4 rifles go capt instead of LT or go AA HT and try to win outright,at least against OKW.

You had a wipe open run to his HQ the entire game,and honestly that guy was horrible,so dont be surprised if the next time you play against OKW its even more painful.

Use rifle flares to spot HQ,and then hit it with jackson,using all our rifles and 50 cals to hold back a counterattack

Was Cookiezncreem's input thorough enough? Or would you like another perspective?

I've agreed almost everything Cookiezncreem said. But if you want to add some other thought you are welcome. I can only improve.

ill give you my notes as i watch

Snip

Less bold stuff when mentoring, thanks? I appreciate your input, but we want new players to be confident enough to post their losses ---------------------> Emboldened comments can be counterproductive.

Less bold stuff when mentoring, thanks? I appreciate your input, but we want new players to be confident enough to post their losses ---------------------> Emboldened comments can be counterproductive.

Got it, i guess I did that so he could skim through the notes and find what was most important quickly.

But I'm sure he knows I care about his well being since I took over an hour breaking down his replay xD

Less bold stuff when mentoring, thanks? I appreciate your input, but we want new players to be confident enough to post their losses ---------------------> Emboldened comments can be counterproductive.

CookiezNcreem was perfect on his review....and sadly i have to say that i'm not a new player, just old and noob...

Two more questions:
1) which is the best way to deal with Fallschirmjäger?
2) which is the best way to deal with Jagdpanzer IV ?

Bloodnok over-moderating as usual

As for your questions, Kersal:

1. The Jagdpanzer IV is a tough unit to take down as USF, especially since it can come out pretty early depending on the circumstances. The best way is to try and solo it out with a Sherman, and park behind it to prevent it from getting away, but this is risky if a shreck blob is nearby. I don't recommend engaging it with a Jackson since the JP4 will usually beat it 1v1. Otherwise, the only way to destroy it is to rely on inf-based AT (57mm, bazookas, AT nades, etc).

2. Fallschrimjaegers aren't nearly as strong as Obers in terms of DPS, but vs USF they hold decent infiltration capability, i.e. they can spawn in buildings that your vehicles are nearby repairing, to kill the crew and even steal; they can spawn in a building near your Major, and if a lot of infantry has just retreated to him, one of their grenades can be devastating. The best ways to avoid these types of attacks is to simply be mindful of what buildings you position your units nearby, and once you have tanks I recommended destroying with attack-ground any buildings that aren't important to your defense, so Fallschrimjaegers can't spawn from them. Otherwise, Fallshrimjaegers are pretty flimsy troops that don't deal much damage at long range, and can be beaten with just good Rifle play. Un-upgraded Paratroopers will always win vs Fallshrimjaegers at long range, as long as cover is equal.

Two more questions:
1) which is the best way to deal with Fallschirmjäger?
2) which is the best way to deal with Jagdpanzer IV ?

1 Fallshs are very bad at close range, rifles with flames or paratroopers with tompsons can easily deal with them. But paratroopers with m1919 can wipe Fallshs at long range too. Sherman, halftrak, m20 with upgrade, m8 is a big problem for Fallshs, but you need to save distance, because they have panzerfausts. Just remember, you need to get close with your squads to kill Fallschirmjägers.
2 Flanking is a key to destroy this tank. A single Sherman can destroy it, if it get to rear or right and left side of Jagdpanzer IV. Just remember, stand out of Jagdpanzer's range with your tanks. This tank is doing zero damage for infantry. Cpt and at gun can easily destroy it.

Another thing to remember about Falls is that, IIRC, they are completely useless when they are moving.

Getting close is risky, unless they spawn relatively close to begin with usually just stay at range and focus fire will take care of fallschrimjager


Regarding jagd Panzer, don't build what it counters it's the best TD in the game.. If he has a JP4 he won't have flak hq though unless you really screwed up. Which means you can afford to hold off on tanks since you'll only be fighting volks strums and mg,or falls and you already got advice on that.. So just drop/build An AT gun, and hold off on tanks till you truly need them. Trying to flank a good jp4 user that has shrieks with it is suicide with a tank

Regarding jagd Panzer, don't build what it counters it's the best TD in the game.. If he has a JP4 he won't have flak hq though unless you really screwed up. Which means you can afford to hold off on tanks since you'll only be fighting volks strums and mg,or falls and you already got advice on that.. So just drop/build An AT gun, and hold off on tanks till you truly need them. Trying to flank a good jp4 user that has shrieks with it is suicide with a tank

In my last match He used the JP4 to destroy my base defence and then he comes with 2 JP4 and a lot of infantry. My troops were around the maps capturing and i had 2 shermans that dead very fast. I had no AT.

In my last match He used the JP4 to destroy my base defence and then he comes with 2 JP4 and a lot of infantry. My troops were around the maps capturing and i had 2 shermans that dead very fast. I had no AT.

never heard of that one before, but in this case, If he builds two JP4s,then a build I'd recommend is

Rifle Company

3-4 Rifles
LT
2 50 Cals,or 1 50 cal and an M20.

Captain,2 AT guns. Upgrade bazookas and give one bazooka,one flamethrower(Or BAR if its a more open map) for each squad of riflemen.

f he has two JP4 as his first two vehicles early on then he wont have obers or panthers,or a KT.

which means your riflemen with all their upgrades,50 cals for insurance,and AT Guns should be a counter to this, since all he has is AT based volks,Fussiliers,and sturms. unless you really screwed up.

If Game continues to drag along call in easy 8s,which are the best medium tanks along with T34-85s if you just HAVE to engage a JP4,since they have better penetration and armor/hp. Use smoke to close the distance,come from different angles,and follow up with all your infantry and AT guns so when the Jp4's turn to engage ur shermans they are exposed to the AT guns I If thats not good enough of an explanation go ahead and post the replay if you have it, so I can see whats actually up.

You can play USF in different ways besides LT M20 rush for a sherman. When you come across a unique strategy you have to be unique as a counter.

yeah, but the problem is that first JD4 appears when i was producing my first sherman! Maybe my big mistake was to produce a second sherman. Better a captain and AT gun maybe...

yeah, but the problem is that first JD4 appears when i was producing my first sherman! Maybe my big mistake was to produce a second sherman. Better a captain and AT gun maybe...

Yeah...If you need a better explanation like I said just post the replay. Im actually interested in it..base raped by early Jp4. hm

In that case he has no obers,or flak HQ,and wont for a while. Just Airdrop an ATG if you're airborne or go captain until the game develops further into you requiring a tank to make pushes. If you KNOW theres a Jp4 dont continue teching major/getting shermans unless you absoulutely have to.(Dont Build units your opponent has built his army around countering. This is the Golden RULE. If you see a Jp4 dont build anymore tanks. Get more infantry. If you see a bunch of panzerfusiliers and volks,dont build more riflemen,rush a sherman,

USF is more flexible than the soviets,who are mostly gardened if they want to countertech the enemies choice.

Get an AT gun or two so you dont get baseraped,upgrade your rifles(dont waste muni on barrages like phosphorus or Major artillery at your level of play people will dodge this stuff),and go to town on his Infantry. Jp4 has nothing to kill,nothing to supprt,and all he's gonna be able to do is reverse away and give up map control,(unless he's really good of course and uses MGs and volks and sturms well,in that case theres nothing you can do besides simply improving and playing more)