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COH2 into the E-sport - Casting mode -

29 Apr 2013, 20:50 PM
#21
avatar of WiFiDi
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Posts: 3293

jump backJump back to quoted post29 Apr 2013, 20:37 PMRiggs

There's a mod atm called Eastern Front btw. Have you ever tried it while recommending a COH2 fix mod?



ive played all the mods...
30 Apr 2013, 01:55 AM
#22
avatar of TychoCelchuuu
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Posts: 1620 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post29 Apr 2013, 20:19 PMWiFiDi
the question is why are you guys waiting on relic to do somthing when relic has said it isn't happening might ahppen after release. instead of planning on doing somthing about it yourself. the game will have mod tools so whats stopping you from making a new hud or perhaps a adding in stuff that would make it easier to cast.

Mod tools are not going to let us make a new HUD or add in ways to see each player's resources during a replay.
30 Apr 2013, 02:31 AM
#23
avatar of DanielD

Posts: 783 | Subs: 3


Mod tools are not going to let us make a new HUD or add in ways to see each player's resources during a replay.


How are you familiar with the limitations of the mod tools?
30 Apr 2013, 02:32 AM
#24
avatar of Rogers

Posts: 1210 | Subs: 1

Blizzard doesn't "get it" - Blizzard has a ton of money. Spectator mode is costly because you need dedicated servers and you need to allow people to connect to them on the fly and so on. Dota 2 can also do this. Why? Valve has a ton of money. Relic is poor.


This.
30 Apr 2013, 02:40 AM
#25
avatar of TychoCelchuuu
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Apr 2013, 02:31 AMDanielD
How are you familiar with the limitations of the mod tools?

Educated guess.
30 Apr 2013, 09:14 AM
#26
avatar of ItsBill

Posts: 15

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Apr 2013, 02:32 AMRogers


This.


We are not talking about dedicated servers, they are not needed for casting mode. I am guessing you did not read the entire thread before you replied.

MODS are restricted when it comes to HUD from what ive experienced with other games. We will need a DLC to be able to make a casting mode, or add features for that matter.
30 Apr 2013, 14:51 PM
#27
avatar of TychoCelchuuu
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Apr 2013, 09:14 AMItsBill
We are not talking about dedicated servers, they are not needed for casting mode. I am guessing you did not read the entire thread before you replied.

Dedicated servers aren't the only things that cost money buddy. Adding anything to the game costs money. Blizzard can afford to hire one person just to work on replays so we can fast forward and rewind and jump into SC2 replays at any point and play them and watch replays together and bring up unit counts and stuff. If Relic had that stuff that would be resources taken away from something else.
30 Apr 2013, 15:04 PM
#28
avatar of kafrion

Posts: 371


Dedicated servers aren't the only things that cost money buddy. Adding anything to the game costs money. Blizzard can afford to hire one person just to work on replays so we can fast forward and rewind and jump into SC2 replays at any point and play them and watch replays together and bring up unit counts and stuff. If Relic had that stuff that would be resources taken away from something else.


I d be very happy if they traded the resources used to make the new UI to make a spectator mod , i could very well do with the old UI + spectator mod , but the new UI + no spectator mod is a bad combination :(
Only Relic postRelic 30 Apr 2013, 16:15 PM
#29
avatar of Noun

Posts: 454 | Subs: 9

jump backJump back to quoted post29 Apr 2013, 10:59 AMStalker

Keep in mind that Relic was still with THQ back then and chances are that their vision has probably changed considerably since. THQ may have had less funds to provide, but they were far more PC-centric than SEGA.


THQ was not a PC centric publisher. By the end we were definitely feeling as though they didn't quite know what to do with us. Read any of the interviews with people like Danny Bilson a few years before THQ went bust and it's clear that Relic wasn't fitting in with THQ's plans.

They wanted only homeruns, 8-15 million unit selling games that would save the company and make them all look like geniuses. That's why we made Space Marine, rather than CoH 2 at that point because it had more potential because the action adventure market on console was far larger than the RTS market.

SEGA has a few fairly significant PC franchises that they're fine with making a good amount of money, but not being the new Gears of War. They've got the Football Manager game, Total War series and now Relic. (There might be some I missed.)

That all is probably off-topic, but from what I see SEGA seems more aware of what it takes to succeed in PC gaming than THQ did. What that means for e-sports I don't know at this point.
30 Apr 2013, 17:25 PM
#30
avatar of Rogers

Posts: 1210 | Subs: 1

Good to hear Noun.
30 Apr 2013, 17:33 PM
#31
avatar of CombatMuffin

Posts: 642

Lets hope for the best. Whats done is done, but Sega can make good use of Relic's prowess for the future
30 Apr 2013, 21:46 PM
#32
avatar of ItsBill

Posts: 15


Dedicated servers aren't the only things that cost money buddy. Adding anything to the game costs money. Blizzard can afford to hire one person just to work on replays so we can fast forward and rewind and jump into SC2 replays at any point and play them and watch replays together and bring up unit counts and stuff. If Relic had that stuff that would be resources taken away from something else.

Its obvious that adding something to the game cost money, doest take a genius to figure that out. There is a difference between a spectator mode witch requires a dedicated server and spectator mode where u simply join the as caster in the beginning of a match. I can bet you a million something that some freelane coder that is a fan would kill for a chance to develope those functions for free, as long as he gets his name in the production crew. i my self know the value of such a spot, having had my exp with the gaming industry. This could be such an important function, and comprimising part of the game to add this might be the difference between big in e-sport and dead as coh1 is. Spectator mode might be added later on, but only if ppl show interest, and esports, tournies on witch will be the free advertisement SAGA will need.
30 Apr 2013, 23:03 PM
#33
avatar of CombatMuffin

Posts: 642

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Apr 2013, 21:46 PMItsBill

Its obvious that adding something to the game cost money, doest take a genius to figure that out. There is a difference between a spectator mode witch requires a dedicated server for an a spectator mode where u simply join the as caster in the beginning of a match. I can bet you a million something that some freelane coder that is a fan would kill for a chance to develope those functions for free, as long as he gets his name in the production crew. i my self know the value of such a spot, having had my exp with the gaming industry. This could be such an important function, and comprimising part of the game to add this might be the difference between big in e-sport and dead as coh1 is. Spectator mode might be added later on, but only if ppl show interest, and esports, tournies on witch will be the free advertisement SAGA will need.


That takes a lot of risk and effort. The truth is, its far more straightforward to create single player content and DLCs that bring back quick buck. Its a painful truth.

Also, its not only the fact that they need to implement the code for free. Im sure a bored programmer at Relic could pull it off. It is also the fact that they'd have to provide support for it in the future, fix glitches, bugs, netcode, etc.

Its not as simple as "putting it in" (no pun intended)
30 Apr 2013, 23:14 PM
#34
avatar of ItsBill

Posts: 15



That takes a lot of risk and effort. The truth is, its far more straightforward to create single player content and DLCs that bring back quick buck. Its a painful truth.

Also, its not only the fact that they need to implement the code for free. Im sure a bored programmer at Relic could pull it off. It is also the fact that they'd have to provide support for it in the future, fix glitches, bugs, netcode, etc.

Its not as simple as "putting it in" (no pun intended)


I am aware it will need some up-keeping, so will every part of the game. But in the end it might be worth it since it will cause money to pore in. Its as your saying, its a huge risk, the entire thing is a huge risk. They invested loads of money into this game, so they are already taking a risk.
1 May 2013, 03:43 AM
#35
avatar of TychoCelchuuu
Senior Caster Badge

Posts: 1620 | Subs: 2

How many explanations can you think of for why Relic isn't including this stuff? My explanation is "it costs money." Other options are "they don't care" or "they don't understand what shoutcasters want" or "they hate shoutcasters." They have straight up said they do care, people like Ami have told them to their face that we want this stuff, and I don't think they hate shoutcasters. I guess another explanation is "they don't know how" but I don't think that's true - like you point out, it's not exactly the most difficult thing in the world.

So if you want to keep calling me, Rogers, Inverse, Stalker, etc. wrong, come up with an alternative explanation that makes more sense than ours.
1 May 2013, 09:38 AM
#36
avatar of ItsBill

Posts: 15

First off, i am not "calling" you, matter of fact, i don't like your attitude since post one, best thing would for you to simply not engage in the debate. We are having a discussion about this. Its a forum, that's the point of these forums, debate. Cant believe the idiocy of this kid. Flame after flame.

1 May 2013, 15:26 PM
#37
avatar of TychoCelchuuu
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Posts: 1620 | Subs: 2

Look, I'm sorry you're butthurt about all the awful things I've done to you in a past life or whatever, but all I'm saying (and all that Rogers, Inverse, Stalker, etc. are saying) is that Relic isn't adding this stuff because it costs money and they want to spend money on stuff like Theater of War which is more attractive to the average player.
1 May 2013, 16:00 PM
#38
avatar of CombatMuffin

Posts: 642

Cant believe the idiocy of this kid. Flame after flame.


He is not flaming, although he is using a cynical tone. The reason? You keep discussing without any substantial evidence. You are just syaing: "put a random freelancer to do it" as if Relic DIDN'T want to put it into the game. If you had been tracking development at all, Quinn stated their intention was to put it in the game, but their resources had to be prioritized elsewhere.

You say you have experience in the game industry, but it sounds like you are talking out of thin air. A spectator mode, by itself, will NOT bring money, it will simply keep the game alive longer, and ONLY if there's interesting stuff to watch. right now, Relic is focusing on developing something interesting to play, and hopefully watch.


Look, I'm sorry you're butthurt about all the awful things I've done to you in a past life or whatever, but all I'm saying...


Genius.

Theatre of War is a way to expand the DLC options they can deliver. I am not psyched about it, but Im not negative either. If it can bring extra cash for future patches and fixes, then I'm game.
1 May 2013, 20:02 PM
#39
avatar of TexasRanger

Posts: 43



He is not flaming, although he is using a cynical tone. The reason? You keep discussing without any substantial evidence. You are just saying: "put a random freelancer to do it" as if Relic DIDN'T want to put it into the game. If you had been tracking development at all, Quinn stated their intention was to put it in the game, but their resources had to be prioritized elsewhere.


Yes, Relic has said that they want a spectator mode and that they want Coh2 to be competitive. Unfortunately actions speak louder than words, and now that they've 'prioritized' casual modes over competitive features, those words hold no water.

A game does not venture into the world of e-sports post-release as they trickle in features, it must be designed for competitive play from the start.
1 May 2013, 20:38 PM
#40
avatar of kafrion

Posts: 371



Yes, Relic has said that they want a spectator mode and that they want Coh2 to be competitive. Unfortunately actions speak louder than words, and now that they've 'prioritized' casual modes over competitive features, those words hold no water.

A game does not venture into the world of e-sports post-release as they trickle in features, it must be designed for competitive play from the start.


it is a competitive game , just not as competitive as its predecessor , or a lot less competitive if you will , anyway , games become competitive and get in to the esports club only after they attain golden status which in relic terms is about lots of months post release vcoh got awsome after 6 yrs . They dont have the resources needed dude so they have to prioritise which means they ll have to cater to the broader audience first and if people like the game and they score the numbers of sales they want , they will give us spectator mod and more cool shit later , otherwise it wont be worth it . Its the responsible thing to do in the current situation , they are a company y know not a charity organisation
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