PPSH upgrade for conscripts is a downgrade

So, vannila conscripts are actually very good.

They easily beat grens and volks in a 1v1 situation, and with a little micro beat sturmpios with ease. With good micro and molotovs they can even beat LMG grens.


However, the PPSH upgrade is supposed to make conscripts even more epic....

Except that it makes them worse. The PPSH has the lowest damage out of all smgs (except vehicle crews and pioneer SMG) and due to the high fragility of concripts which means that they need to be in cover 100% of the time, makes this upgrade a complete downgrade.

Now i do not want the PPSH to be insane, but when looking at its german equivalent, the G43 , which increases your close range DPS just slightly less than PPSH conscripts, but considerably increases your mid range and slightly increases your long range DPS, while PPSH conscripts only increase the DPS at close range, and drastically decreases and mid and long range.


My proposed change is to give PPSH upgrade conscripts some kind of armor, say 1.1 or maybe 1.15 armor to make it slightly easier for them to close in.

They easily beat grens and volks in a 1v1 situation, and with a little micro beat sturmpios with ease. With good micro and molotovs they can even beat LMG grens.


However, the PPSH upgrade is supposed to make conscripts even more epic....

Don't know if sarcastic or not.

Don't know if sarcastic or not.

Not at all, as a proud conscript spammer and having beat many good players with my bulletproof 6 conscript strat, i can say this is true.

I think, designer thought that Cons will use Huuurah! get close to enemy and wipe with Ppsh.

The problem is before they will reach target, they will be dead

The PPSH has the lowest damage out of all smgs (except vehicle crews and pioneer SMG) and due to the high fragility of concripts which means that they need to be in cover 100% of the time, makes this upgrade a complete downgrade.

Partisan PPSh (not that it's useful either!)

G43 increases your close range DPS just slightly less than PPSH conscripts, but considerably increases your mid range and slightly increases your long range DPS, while PPSH conscripts only increase the DPS at close range, and drastically decreases and mid and long range.

G43 costs 60 munitions on a reletively munitions hungry faction though, the PPSh only costs 30 on one that usually has munitions to waste. Usually I have to wait to upgrade my Grenadiers, but it rarely feels that way with Conscripts, due to less sinks and cheaper guns.

My proposed change is to give PPSH upgrade conscripts some kind of armor, say 1.1 or maybe 1.15 armor to make it slightly easier for them to close in.

Personally I'd just make the PPSh do about Mosin damage at mid-long ranges, anything more than that (such as Shock PPSh's) would warrant a price increase.

So, vannila conscripts are actually very good.

...and with a little micro beat sturmpios with ease. With good micro and molotovs they can even beat LMG grens.

Uhhhm... I don't know man...

Partisan PPSh (not that it's useful either!)



G43 costs 60 munitions on a reletively munitions hungry faction though, the PPSh only costs 30 on one that usually has munitions to waste. Usually I have to wait to upgrade my Grenadiers, but it rarely feels that way with Conscripts, due to less sinks and cheaper guns.



Personally I'd just make the PPSh do about Mosin damage at mid-long ranges, anything more than that (such as Shock PPSh's) would warrant a price increase.

G43 costs 45 munitions, PPSH upgrade costs 40.

G43 costs 45 munitions, PPSH upgrade costs 40.

Huh, guess you're right, my mistake. I still think the PPSh should just be increased to Mosin level over range.

Yeah PPSH cons need some love, considering you have to close in anyways.

Not sure if the upgrade is just meh or cons in general feel really fragile. They are good early, and mid game, but seem to drop off drastically in the late game, even with vet 3

Well, now that i have talked to some people about it , perhaps i am just using them wrong. Ill have to do some further testing with them.

Still think they could use a small buff tho.

I'm under same impression as you. Scripts get murdered before they can even close the distance into effective PPSH range. Maybe I'm using them wrong too but few times I've tried them I feel like game started going bad once I upgraded my scripts.

I remember in the old days when the ppsh was basically a assault rifle upgrade

I remember in the old days when the ppsh was basically a assault rifle upgrade

At that time everything had same profile so it bears little relevance.

I think generally Cons need a little armor boost, but PPSH upgrade is fine. You just have to move cover to cover, hoorah or flank from a blind spot to come in close.

It is not fine, especially for current cost in comparison with other upgrades. Best solution, imo, would be to replace ppsh with svt, but most simple solution is to add some armor to scripts with ppsh upgrade.

Or global buff for all close-range weapons, coz both g43 pgrens stgs and scripts ppshs suck badly.

It is not fine, especially for current cost in comparison with other upgrades. Best solution, imo, would be to replace ppsh with svt, but most simple solution is to add some armor to scripts with ppsh upgrade.

You realise the SVT does less damage than the PPSh and has only marginally longer range, right?

Replace ppsh with svt and make those svt actually useful at middle range.

Fixed?

And i also think their bonus on the move are worst.

Regarding G43 PGs...
But you also get utility with G43. Interrogation!!

/s

Not joking now, they could just replace the normal G43 for scoped G43 for the PGs.

Replace ppsh with svt and make those svt actually useful at middle range.

Fixed?

If you're going to replace the PPSh with an SVT and then modify the SVT to perform a close-mid range role, why don't you just cut out the middle-man and make the PPSh do the close-mid range role?

Thinking about it, it's actually kind of ironic that the PPSh is worse than the MP 40 at mid range, because large numbers of PPSh were used to make up for a lack of LMG's, while the MP 40 was solely for CQB.

And i also think their bonus on the move are worst.

Regarding G43 PGs...

I can't tell if you mean the G43 or the PPSh. The Conscript PPSh movement penalty is about average, the G43's is better than other semi-autos and even SMG's.

As for the PG G43, they do less DPS at every range compared to the StG's they replace, I'm not sure why you would want them!

I can't tell if you mean the G43 or the PPSh. The Conscript PPSh movement penalty is about average, the G43's is better than other semi-autos and even SMG's.

It was on response of the SVT vs PPSH comparison. Thing is i waited to reply since i found a game.

As for the PG G43, they do less DPS at every range compared to the StG's they replace, I'm not sure why you would want them!

They have almost double DPS at far range. In comparison, a bit better than a Kar. Nevertheless theres little point on upgrading them unless you float munition, you want "cool" G43 and you use nonstop interrogation.