Higher Rank = Awful gameplay

I was not long ago rank 211 as usf in 1v1, and am now rank 577 in 2v2 as usf.

Ive notice that in 1v1 (and 2v2's) i face opponents that win using cheese strats. Blobbing i see alot, Heavy sniper spam.

Truck-pushing, camping, tiger ace winning games that i would have other wise have won.

I feel the higher I rank up the the less fun i have.

Why does this game reward players that don't micro, camp, and use cheese strats to win? Allied players do this also.

Honestly, should i start blobbing to win now? It seems to be working well for my OKW and Wehrmacht opponents.

Welcome to CoH2, here is your Stalhelm, Kar98, and Potato Masher.

I'm gonna say it again.

High rank with new factions =/= high skill or comparable with old factions.

Of course you will fight harder opponents as you rank up. That's the whole point.

It's easy to blame losses on imbalance, or 'cheese', but if you want to reach higher ranks you have to change your attitude and look for ways that you can improve. Your losses are your biggest learning opportunities.

I can assure you that 'blobbing' will not work against proper counters. As USF, I have almost never lost a game due to truck pushing, camping, or snipers.

All of the things you've listed here are counterable. It's simply a matter of improving your skills.

Truck pushing makes the game look terrible and should be removed somehow, but when I see it in high level games on propagandacast, it usually isn't that decisive.

There are lots of counters to blobs but sometimes creating your own blobs does work. Like if the OKW is sending hordes of SO Pfuzes, m1919 counter-blobs work well enough depending on what else the OKW has.

Of course you will fight harder opponents as you rank up. That's the whole point.

It's easy to blame losses on imbalance, or 'cheese', but if you want to reach higher ranks you have to change your attitude and look for ways that you can improve. Your losses are your biggest learning opportunities.

I can assure you that 'blobbing' will not work against proper counters. As USF, I have almost never lost a game due to truck pushing, camping, or snipers.

All of the things you've listed here are counterable. It's simply a matter of improving your skills.

Yes. i blobbed 2 games and won. i am improving( if u consider blobbing improvement )

My point is that if i wanted to play a blobbing or camping game. i can just play starcraft. my issue is the the games is rewarding people who use (what i would consider) unskilled tactics.

Yes. i blobbed 2 games and won. i am improving( if u consider blobbing improvement )

My point is that if i wanted to play a blobbing or camping game. i can just play starcraft. my issue is the the games is rewarding people who use (what i would consider) unskilled tactics.

But there are counters to blobs... why not use those?

Also, trust me, it's worse at low levels.

About the star craft comment - this game isn't a sim. It's somewhere in between games like star craft and games like Men of War. That's not a good thing or a bad thing, it's just a matter of preference. Blobs are part of the game, and some times they're the effective tool for a situation. Obviously marching 30 dudes directly into a machine gun barrel isn't a good idea in real life, but again, it's an RTS game, not a simulator.

Cover's important, but it's not designed so that using cover better will always let you win an engagement.

This has been the case since vCOH. Higher rank often equates to more abusive and less creative strategies to get there. COH does not reward you for playing "fair", you either fight fire with fire or you'll lose more often.

Normal game rewards you when you are more skilled than your opponent.
In this game this isn't the case. "Noobs" can easily win because of abusing strats (med supply drops, Luftwaffe, ..)

It's the thing that is so frustrating in this game, it's the outcome that can't be predicted, it's all so highly RNG depending.

Anyway, that's my opinion.

Lower rank=playing for shits and giggles, everything goes.

Higher rank=using everything that nets wins with least amount of effort, can indicate a balance problem, but doesn't have to.

That pretty much goes for.... every other game as well.
There are things that work, there are things that doesn't work, high ranks will use any and all cheeze they can, because they usually know the faction and can exploit it to greatest potential.

Normal game rewards you when you are more skilled than your opponent.
In this game this isn't the case. "Noobs" can easily win because of abusing strats (med supply drops, Luftwaffe, ..)

It's the thing that is so frustrating in this game, it's the outcome that can't be predicted, it's all so highly RNG depending.

Anyway, that's my opinion.

Kreatiir is right, This game has been riddled down to who is the best at abusing the units the best. It takes no skill to blob your way to victory while dropping med crates to turn grenadiers into super soldiers. RNG is weighted to the extent it doesn't matter what level you are it can just make sure you dont win at all.

Kreatiir is right, This game has been riddled down to who is the best at abusing the units the best.

Thats what distinguishes one player from the other. Who can use and exploit their units better than the other guy can. That is the "skill gap" as it were.

You guys can embellish it all you want with buzz words who can "spam" better or who can "blob" better, at the end of the day they are doing it better than you. There is nothing stopping you from doing the same. There are optimal strats/builds and there are sub-optimal ones. More often than not the higher ranked players are using the most optimal strat unless they are messing around with some underperforming units/commanders.

The only real extreme cheese that comes to mind at the moment is doctrinal arty abilities on both sides, mechanized USF arty that can bring down HQs to 10% and be finished off with a few shots of AT, as well as the OKW scavenger doctrine that can 2 shot a USF base. Tactics like truck pushing or strats that involve spamming snipers all have counters and work arounds. Luftwaffe medcrates that you refer to can be picked up by the enemy now, trust me I was on the receiving end of this commander when they were bugged and couldn't be picked up by the opponnent. This is also counterable and manageable.

I guess what I'm really trying to say is, you guys need to have a cup of concrete and harden up. Its a game with a set of rules, rules that can be exploited and abused equally by anyone and all players who isn't using some 3rd party cheat.

While I agree with the general #ADAPT sentiment in the thread (the only option currently is to counter cheeze with cheeze or accept more losses), I agree with OP (and strongly disagree with Lucas Troy) that CoH shouldn't be about that.

At the moment it's all about the blob and finding units that overperform (how come no-one mentioned ISU yet!?). So for the moment, yes, do what is necessary to win if you want to win. Or play your favourite strats but expect more losses. Also - What Romeo said. Watch your replays, find your weaknesses, improve your game.


In the meantime, check any replays vs VonIvan & Siberian if you want to see the sad side of CoH2 and learn the latest cheese:

http://www.coh2.org/replay/22896/vs.-von-and-sib
http://www.coh2.org/replay/23376/vs-von-and-sib
(They lose these but they win the other 95% of the time. Couldn't bring myself to post a link of them cheezing a win)


And thus we await the new patch...

While I agree with the general #ADAPT sentiment in the thread (the only option currently is to counter cheeze with cheeze or accept more losses), I agree with OP (and strongly disagree with Lucas Troy) that CoH shouldn't be about that.

I agree with you and the OP, actually. I'd like the game better with no blobbing at all.

Just saying, that's not how the game works, and it's not what Relic is going for, so hoping for it is futile. It's like complaining about the lack of cover in SC2. I'd like SC2 better if it had a cover system but I'm not going to bother asking for one.

The game is designed to allow for blobbing in some situations. They wouldn't have added the US leaders or the Sturm Officer if they didn't want to make blobbing sometimes viable.

This thread is invalid. Watched the match between Jesulin and Barton and it did not contain any of your suggestions.

This thread is invalid. Watched the match between Jesulin and Barton and it did not contain any of your suggestions.

What doe that mean?..

Oh, and thanks for contribution to this thread /sarcasm

While I agree with the general #ADAPT sentiment in the thread (the only option currently is to counter cheeze with cheeze or accept more losses), I agree with OP (and strongly disagree with Lucas Troy) that CoH shouldn't be about that.

At the moment it's all about the blob and finding units that overperform (how come no-one mentioned ISU yet!?). So for the moment, yes, do what is necessary to win if you want to win. Or play your favourite strats but expect more losses. Also - What Romeo said. Watch your replays, find your weaknesses, improve your game.


In the meantime, check any replays vs VonIvan & Siberian if you want to see the sad side of CoH2 and learn the latest cheese:

http://www.coh2.org/replay/22896/vs.-von-and-sib
http://www.coh2.org/replay/23376/vs-von-and-sib
(They lose these but they win the other 95% of the time. Couldn't bring myself to post a link of them cheezing a win)


And thus we await the new patch...

Maybe because we don't use "cheese" all the time Bulgakov my fanboi raging name-calling friend. Yes certain effective units are seen more often then not on the higher levels mostly because they are the best counters available to the higher ranked players unfortunately. As a troll and high level player myself I've honestly reached a point where I have to use these strategies in order to beat other people at the same level who I might add also use these strategies like yourself Bulgakov. The funny thing is, as I've said before, I don't always use these type of strategies, in fact I enjoy using more creative-type strategies, however when playing higher levels I know are going to use more effective units against me, my only option is to find units that they, themselves, have a hard time dealing with(not countering, because honestly it's not that hard to counter an ISU[Just requires more planning]). Anyway another thing that factors into my daily playing is the fact that I don't honestly give a hoot what I do nowadays since basically everyone does their own thing.

Anyway since I know you'll just resort to dumb reasoning's and name-callings like you always do Bulgakov I'll just end the conversation here
Here's a replay of my current soviet strategy of using irregulars, t-34s, and howitizers vs higher levels. It's actually quite effective against most people I've found.

•  
  

  6

  VS

  VonIvan

  PanzerGrenadierAngreifen

  Most trollolololo game I've ever had.

  by: VonIvan map: Faymonville Approach

  4

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This has been the case since vCOH. Higher rank often equates to more abusive and less creative strategies to get there. COH does not reward you for playing "fair", you either fight fire with fire or you'll lose more often.

Mmmm, that's not always true, I mean, it happens sometimes unfortunately, but not everyone who's high ranked does this shit, trust me I know, I've played tons of automatch games, the majority of people I play, and lose to at times do not normally use abuse against me. So, you can play fair in this game, only problem is people equate non-meta use as "fair play" which is quite ironic. Everything is fair play in this game(unless ofc you're using OP units, which, I honestly believe in this stage of balance we don't really have anymore OP units to deal with(just effective units). The leaderboards are another indication of the current balance(for 1v1 mostly), pretty much all are in the green department, and very high as well, so I think balance has been improved with more ways to counter things and hold out in-game.(Though that's not to say balance is perfect)

Everything is fair play in this game

I really couldn't agree more. There's nothing noble about breaking meta, nor is there anything abusive about adhering to it. Adapting your own style is part of the fun of the game, and the player's skill is far more important than the strategy chosen. Just watch even a small handful of replays on this site. There's plenty of people still using penal battalions, m20 utility cars, armor company, forward HQ, etc. There's even a popular one going around featuring rear echelon spam.

These aren't noob matches either, these are highly ranked, highly skilled people.

There's nothing noble about breaking meta, nor is there anything abusive about adhering to it. Adapting your own style is part of the fun of the game, and the player's skill is far more important than the strategy chosen.

QFT

Mmmm, that's not always true, I mean, it happens sometimes unfortunately, but not everyone who's high ranked does this shit,

Thats why I said often, not always

There are always great players at the top but there are also very marginal players at the top as well and vCOH and COH2 share this trait equally. The community is small enough though that people usually know the difference though.