PIV is fine.
Jackson & E8 said, "PIV is fine."
Panzer 4 under preforming
31 Aug 2014, 18:39 PM
#21
Posts: 2779
31 Aug 2014, 18:46 PM
#22
Posts: 1225
The Jackson is a dedicated tank destroyer. The E8, granted, is a wildly OP generalist call-in.
31 Aug 2014, 18:54 PM
#23
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
Panzer 4
Veterancy 2
+30% Armor
+40% Turret Rotation
Veterancy 3
-30% Reload
+20% Rotation
+10% Acceleration
T-34-76
Veterancy 2
+10 Damage
+35% Turret Rotation
-20% Reload
Veterancy 3
+20% Max Speed
+20% Acceleration
+20% Rotation
-20% Reload
This are kinda old (i don't think that the +10dmg still applies) but this is what i saw on the changelog.
Veterancy 2
+30% Armor
+40% Turret Rotation
Veterancy 3
-30% Reload
+20% Rotation
+10% Acceleration
T-34-76
Veterancy 2
+10 Damage
+35% Turret Rotation
-20% Reload
Veterancy 3
+20% Max Speed
+20% Acceleration
+20% Rotation
-20% Reload
This are kinda old (i don't think that the +10dmg still applies) but this is what i saw on the changelog.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
31 Aug 2014, 18:58 PM
#24
Posts: 1439
vet0 armor 180
vet2 armor 1.3x 180 -> 234
if you include 4% armor increase bulleten 243.36
Thank you very much.
31 Aug 2014, 18:58 PM
#25
Posts: 542
I don't think there is a big balance issue between P4 and T34/76. Of course you can always argue a bit about details, maybe slight cost reducement here or there, it all depends on how high you rate the advantages of the one tank over the other, and it is difficult to put a value in here that everyone will be happy with.
Personally I find the balance between the P4, the T34/85 and the Easy-Eight a bit more interesting currently to be honest.
Personally I find the balance between the P4, the T34/85 and the Easy-Eight a bit more interesting currently to be honest.
31 Aug 2014, 18:59 PM
#26
Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1
Compared to other non-doctrinal tanks they are fine.
Compared to doctrinal armor they fall short. But then again, so does every other tank.
Compared to doctrinal armor they fall short. But then again, so does every other tank.
31 Aug 2014, 19:13 PM
#27
Posts: 2779
The Jackson is a dedicated tank destroyer. The E8, granted, is a wildly OP generalist call-in.
And those two wtfownbbq any panzer smaller than a Tiger, sure they are fine
31 Aug 2014, 20:00 PM
#28
Posts: 971
I don't think PiV underperforms at all. Well used, and if RNG Gods don't hate you, a T34 shouldn't be able to destroy one.
And personally, I think that currently PzIV does better against infantry than T34. Yes, T34 does lucky shots that almost wipe full squads, but that is after shooting 6 times doing nothing.
PzIV does AI damage more consistently.
And personally, I think that currently PzIV does better against infantry than T34. Yes, T34 does lucky shots that almost wipe full squads, but that is after shooting 6 times doing nothing.
PzIV does AI damage more consistently.
31 Aug 2014, 20:01 PM
#29
Posts: 1705
Its a pretty good tank in itself and a beast at vet 2,but the difference in price and performance between it and t-34 and it and t-85 and e8 are contrasting.The unit itself is good,nothing wrong with it...its a tad overpriced comapared to t-34 and the call-ins at dirt cheap 130 and 135 fuel.
So it doesn't underperform,its overpriced..or its competition is underpriced.
So it doesn't underperform,its overpriced..or its competition is underpriced.
31 Aug 2014, 20:40 PM
#30
Posts: 36
quick aside here what state is the stug 3 in? is it performing well right now? I'm starting to use them more but im not sure its worth it.
31 Aug 2014, 21:04 PM
#31
Posts: 2070
Its a pretty good tank in itself and a beast at vet 2,but the difference in price and performance between it and t-34 and it and t-85 and e8 are contrasting.The unit itself is good,nothing wrong with it...its a tad overpriced comapared to t-34 and the call-ins at dirt cheap 130 and 135 fuel.Nah, i wouldnt say T34 is underpriced. It seems okay where it is. If Panzer 4 was cheaper, it would wreck even harder
So it doesn't underperform,its overpriced..or its competition is underpriced.
Axis doesn't have the best AT options in the game
31 Aug 2014, 21:20 PM
#32
Posts: 68
The PIV is fine. I dont know why you think the t34-76 is a better tank.
Its main gun worse than the PIVs one and it has less MGs.
Also it doesnt have to face such anti-tank infantery like Volksgrenadiere with Panzerschrecks.
For direct fights the T34 only penetrats the PIVs armor to 55% at mid range and 44% at max range. The PIV4 penetrats the T34 armor at max range to 75% so normaly the PIV will win the engagment just dont charg in and use him at distance.
I think if a tank underperformce its the t34. Its just average in against Infantery and Tanks and for 35 fuel more i can have a t34-85. Welcome to the call in meta.
Also if you compare the anti Infantery of the t34 to the Sherman, i would take the Sherman all day.
Its main gun worse than the PIVs one and it has less MGs.
Also it doesnt have to face such anti-tank infantery like Volksgrenadiere with Panzerschrecks.
For direct fights the T34 only penetrats the PIVs armor to 55% at mid range and 44% at max range. The PIV4 penetrats the T34 armor at max range to 75% so normaly the PIV will win the engagment just dont charg in and use him at distance.
I think if a tank underperformce its the t34. Its just average in against Infantery and Tanks and for 35 fuel more i can have a t34-85. Welcome to the call in meta.
Also if you compare the anti Infantery of the t34 to the Sherman, i would take the Sherman all day.
31 Aug 2014, 21:24 PM
#33
Posts: 2070
yeah T34 is pretty lacking... midgame it is okay if you can force your opponent into a corner, but after that, call-in time.
T34 is just very average. Perhaps that was intended, but PZ4 definitely not underperforming. It does a lot of things well for a medium tank
T34 is just very average. Perhaps that was intended, but PZ4 definitely not underperforming. It does a lot of things well for a medium tank
Axis doesn't have the best AT options in the game
31 Aug 2014, 21:26 PM
#34
Posts: 1130
as some people already said its not the p4 underperforming its the e8 85 over performing.
horrida flamma bella
31 Aug 2014, 21:47 PM
#35
1 
Posts: 889 | Subs: 1
P4 is a great tank, has amazing AI with the three MGs, excellent at surviving to get Vet and the lovely bonuses.
In team games the P4 is perfectly timed, and perfectly suited to provide support to combined OKW and Wehrmacht armies.
As others said, E8 is crazy beastly and T34/85 still very good (which I am mostly OK with), which is mostly what eclipses this tank. A P4 and a Pak40 together can kill almost any enemy tank. Blitzkrieg helps circle strafe tank destroyers or heavy tanks, target weak point (and just the sheer damage) from Pak40 ensures dead tanks.
In team games the P4 is perfectly timed, and perfectly suited to provide support to combined OKW and Wehrmacht armies.
As others said, E8 is crazy beastly and T34/85 still very good (which I am mostly OK with), which is mostly what eclipses this tank. A P4 and a Pak40 together can kill almost any enemy tank. Blitzkrieg helps circle strafe tank destroyers or heavy tanks, target weak point (and just the sheer damage) from Pak40 ensures dead tanks.
31 Aug 2014, 22:18 PM
#36
Posts: 1701
P4 is a great tank, has amazing AI with the three MGs, excellent at surviving to get Vet and the lovely bonuses.
In team games the P4 is perfectly timed, and perfectly suited to provide support to combined OKW and Wehrmacht armies.
As others said, E8 is crazy beastly and T34/85 still very good (which I am mostly OK with), which is mostly what eclipses this tank. A P4 and a Pak40 together can kill almost any enemy tank. Blitzkrieg helps circle strafe tank destroyers or heavy tanks, target weak point (and just the sheer damage) from Pak40 ensures dead tanks.
Dont you know TWP is bugged yet? XD
Blaue Division - The best corp
BPX - Black Phoenix, Clan leader.
BPX - Black Phoenix, Clan leader.
31 Aug 2014, 22:21 PM
#37
Posts: 365
I think the P4s problem is more to do with the meta than with being underpowered. The unit itself is pretty strong, especially once it gains Vet 2, but its cost (including tech cost) makes it a little unattractive in a meta where people prefer to save for expensive call-ins that can outperform and counter the P4 (E8s, T34-85s, ISU, IS2 e.t.c.). I predict that once Relic changes the call-in system, the P4 will become a better option since it will have a larger timing window to exploit before those call-ins hit the field.
im crossing my fingers for call ins to require tech upgrades on the next patch.
31 Aug 2014, 22:25 PM
#38
Posts: 209
The problem is not in the tank but in the mind of a player. Why use a medium tank that requires micro and positioning to be effective if you can save for a heavy tank that requires less micro and is more forgiving if you micro bad.
I play mostly 2vs2 and 3vs3. Couple of times an Osther player used their PIV before we had any anti tank capability (both US players) and dominated the map thanks to them then the OKW panthers came to seal the deal. But most of the time they save for a Tiger that comes to late and gets destroyed.
I play mostly 2vs2 and 3vs3. Couple of times an Osther player used their PIV before we had any anti tank capability (both US players) and dominated the map thanks to them then the OKW panthers came to seal the deal. But most of the time they save for a Tiger that comes to late and gets destroyed.
31 Aug 2014, 23:38 PM
#39
1 Posts: 889 | Subs: 1
Dont you know TWP is bugged yet? XD
It works the same way it has always worked, by targetting the ground. With TWP you can kill an unsuspecting American tank before it even realizes its being hit.
31 Aug 2014, 23:40 PM
#40
4 Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2
Dont you know TWP is bugged yet? XD
then use it when tank's not moving.
it is still very useful ability
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