Any point to even bothering with OKW?

From what I'm seeing in the replays section, the forums, Propagandacast etc. OKW is not just underpowered, but subject to ton of shitty tactics, including but not limitted to Maxim-spam, Sniper-spam, Guards-spam, Riflemen+Easy Eight-spam, M8 Greyhound-spam...

So yeah, I'd like to hear the opinions.. Is it worth playing OKW in a "having fun and improving my skill"-way?

Having fun... only if your enemys don't maximspam. Yeah and Sniper are not very funny too.
Improving your skill level sure.

because in alot of these cases nothing else works effectively against them. Especially in the Soviet's case. Playing normally without any spam with the Sovs against the OKW is suicide. its impossible. Or Stupid.


I saw the M8 Greyhound spam game you're talking about on Danes Channel a couple days ago.. 9/10 times you spam greyhounds like that,ESPECIALLY against OKW you get your teeth kicked in by pumas,shreks,and other fun things. I dont know how in the world the OKW player got owned by that garbage doctrine.

Rifle Company is an EASIER less stressful way of playing the okw into the late game since you get the AT Power of jacksons with the AI of normal shermans. And the fozzy barrage is nice as well. Building anymore than 4 rifles+ Either officer is just begging to be MP drained,IMO.

I feel like im in control and that im playing an actually well designed faction when im playing OKW. As Allies im always ripping my face off trying to survive with gimmicky squishy tactics. I just feel like im running my head into a wall against the Axis ubensmench.

Talks of imbalance within the game are greatly overblown, i find it easier to win with OKW than USF and i do win a higher % of my games. its more up to each player than balance how much fun you have and how much you improve

because in alot of these cases nothing else works effectively against them. Especially in the Soviet's case. Playing normally without any spam with the Sovs against the OKW is suicide. its impossible. Or Stupid.

Its really not though, my friend WeWe plays a ton of soviets and never builds more than 1 sniper, and never spams maxims. In fact he gets really great use out of *gasp* penals. Its not easy to do, but to say that those are the only viable strats is just wrong and only furthers the idea that its the only option.

RedxWings is another soviet player ive noticed breaking the meta. ive only seen a few games of his, but both involved defensive tactics (yea thats right, no guards/shocks or call in tanks) with cons and penals.

What if we get these gents together and let them write a blog about their Soviet Meta? Would be intersted to see how they brake the current stalemate

On topic : when I play, I'm most comfortable with OBW, I can live with some spam strats but some of them just ruin the experience for me. Still, I'd recommend giving them a proper chance.

Edit : my ELO is low enough to pull it off I must add

People do realize cons beat volks right?

Its really not though, my friend WeWe plays a ton of soviets and never builds more than 1 sniper, and never spams maxims. In fact he gets really great use out of *gasp* penals. Its not easy to do, but to say that those are the only viable strats is just wrong and only furthers the idea that its the only option.

My friend Tech like using penals as well to fight OKW. He goes 1 sniper and bunch of penals with some scripts to merge with penals for that consistent level of dps dealt out on the enemy. Even the Sturmpio will lose to penals.

RedxWings is another soviet player ive noticed breaking the meta. ive only seen a few games of his, but both involved defensive tactics (yea thats right, no guards/shocks or call in tanks) with cons and penals.

Respect for them! I want try out/develop for myself new strats, and hate use the common meta, but for me, the conscript/penal builds most of time the hardest way, vs OKW, i feel the T1 M3 2/3 sniper with some(1-2) AT naded conscript open while i get 2 CP and elite inf, or Pure T2 maxim spam the only way, where i can stay the game, and i say that, who like the OKW in first place, not Soviets...

Maybe i dont know use really well penals, but with carbine dps profile, penal now simple the conscript with ppsh upgrade, plus a opportunity for a flamer... This all SVT+flamer effective on close range, but without the ST s or Assault grens armor, or PGs Obers Jager received accuracy bonus... Most of time, when i want use penals, if i used them defensive style, from cover, lmgs- gren or massed volks, Stormpios beat them, badly. IF i want charge, that would be a freaking massacre, but not the good way for me... Conscript is OK for me, a cheap, starter unit, with a lots cool abiltiy, but Penal, what is the BEST rus non docrinal unit, need a redesign, i think, if relic want cqc units, give them armor/rec. acc bonus, OR dont, but then give him good LONG range dps...

Opinions?

The odd thing is, in all of my german games where I faced soviets in the past couple days, every one of my opponents opened with penals (except symbiosis, who did con-maxim-guard)- even against wehrmacht (god knows why, 222s tear them open). Seems like the meta is turning.

I wouldn't recommend OKW unless you are top 300 or something.
I rather see OKW like a trap for a player.

At first, it looks nice and shiny with its powerfull infantry units. Strong opening, but... no real sniper counter! And its infantry units are expensive especially if we talk about sturmpios....
Then, as game evolves you will find yourself happy if you succeed to build a Panther or a jagdpanzer. For lucky ones, let's say one jagdpanther and a Puma. In the meantime, the opponent, knowing your weakness, may have several tanks on the battlefield and will try to storm you with them. He knows you have a strong AT infantry based on volks with schrecks, so he builds balistic weapons (especially mortars) and mgs. Due to your lack of vehicles you won't be able to force into their positions and take out the ballistics and mgs. not without loosing your vehicle(s) that will be replaced with difficulty due to fuel shortage, not counting the lack of build caches ability. Of course you can try to exchange amo forfuel from T3, but this won't help you much and will force you to build your strategies around T3 which is not inantry supportive as T2 is.
So slowly, you will fall into an uncertain defensive, you will loose the initiative, your infantry will be smashed by ballistics, (american self propelled or katiushas and mortars from russians) and eventualy you will be defeated, after heroicly killing 3 T70s and 2 T34s for instance, but this won't matter as your adversary can continue building lots of them. Using the wurframen won't save you, he will make a quick attack, chasing it and killing it. Okay, so he will loose 1-2 tanks by doing it, but there is no problem, he can build more. YOU CAN'T.

In 2v2s same rules as above will apply adding this: don't even try to place a truck forward. (In 1v1 you can still do it, it's safer). The other team will spot it's location and in most of cases it will erase it in a matter of minutes no matter how much support you will receive from your partner. If you make your opponents lose verry much infantry by doing it, then maybe you have a chance. In middle game, any sort of ballistic weapons will constantly bomb your advanced truck until you lose it - even if you place it behind a house, trees or bushes. Of course I'm talking about T2 or T3, T4 you have to place it forward, that's its purpose.

OKW it's broken I guess, and it was from the beginning, but people didn't figure it out how to defeat it before. But now, they did, and there are several tactics that guarantees victory against it.
As soviets, I didn't see yet a tactic that could fail: con spam with ppsh into balistics and T34s(76 or 85) works, sniper spam + M3 into T34s (76 or 85) and guards works, maxim spam into ISU 152 works, shock spam + IS2 works, etc etc.

Hey just play OKW in 3v3 or 4v4. Survive for twenty minutes and then build a KT.... then PROFIT!!!

If you see T1 be it penals, snipers or M3's rush a puma, even if they get guards or conscripts, you just have to micro it and play smart.

Hell I'd even argue a fast Puma vs T2 can work too if you can get behind Maxims before Zis hits.

If you can slow the Soviets fuel income and cap and hold at least 1 fuel, you might even be able to rush a Luchs but it's really map dependant and very micro heavy.

What if we get these gents together and let them write a blog about their Soviet Meta? Would be intersted to see how they brake the current stalemate

On topic : when I play, I'm most comfortable with OBW, I can live with some spam strats but some of them just ruin the experience for me. Still, I'd recommend giving them a proper chance.

Edit : my ELO is low enough to pull it off I must add

"I'm most comfortable with OBW"

With what?

Sorry but sort of makes it look bad when you misname the faction, especially in this context

"I'm most comfortable with OBW"

With what?

Sorry but sort of makes it look bad when you misname the faction, especially in this context

If he is an history geek, i think he is using the correct name for the faction.

OberBefehlshaber West:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OB_West

I can clearly understand why Relic decided to use Oberkommando, which sounds more non-history geeks friendly, though.
There was no Oberkommando West (with that name), and OKW would refer to Oberkommando der Wehrmacht, which was something completely different that what it is in CoH2.

Oberkommando des Wehrmacht:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oberkommando_der_Wehrmacht

Touche, and well explained.

OP. No, there is no point in playing OKW in 3v3 or 4v4. Please play as Allies in this game mode so we can find games faster. Thank you!

People are just keep talking about 3v3 and 4v4. What is so great about these game modes anyway? Impossible to balance, not very tactical/technical eather.
Let me give you a quote from a top vCoh player (Sepha I guess?! I may be wrong...)

4v4 - it doesn't matter;
3v3 - it's at most entertaining;
2v2 - it's technical;
1v1 - it's glorious.

I am inclined to agree with Napalm, though I love my Germans more people need to play allies in 3v3 4v4 so there are more games and more fun. (BTW its not hard to beat axis in big games, just hold the fuel and deny big tanks bam meta crushed.)