Biggest Flaw In Coh2

Apart from the many talked about issues this is one of the biggest flaws if addressed would add more to the game than anything else.

In reality its more than one issue but it is all related

[list][list]
Infantry movement speed - when compared to coh coh2 is like infantry movement, is all done under water. This stops any meaningful manevures in the field and there is less flanking, less cover seeking and less strategic play.

Reaction to orders for tanks and infantry - as above, this is so slow that it stops any meangingul vehicle micro and makes the game painful to watch and play.

Animation sluggishiness/ glitches - overall the snap animations for both inf and vehicles is not there resulting in units getting stuck, things happening in slow time and not allowing truly superior micro to show as every good command order is watered down due to all these factors


P.S Also the infantry retreat speed is too low which allows infantry to die where it really should be able to get away. Not too mention how long it actuall takes them to being retreating and all the horrific pathing issues

If relic was to polish up all these the the game would start opening up and units that are now less than useful would stull have a place in the game. Just look at what great vehicle micro allowed you to do in coh or how skillfully flanks and other manevures were pulled off by superior players to get the upper hand in a match.

Animation sluggishiness/ glitches - overall the snap animations for both inf and vehicles is not there resulting in units getting stuck, things happening in slow time and not allowing truly superior micro to show as every good command order is watered down due to all these factors

Animation don't stall actions.

The command delay is atrocious...but we have lived with it for a year so oh well...

The command delay is atrocious...but we have lived with it for a year so oh well...

YEah but we shouldn't have to - especially since COH was all about really fluid movement and extreme micro ( which only happens if units do exactly what you ask)

I also thing the actual movement speed of infantry is much too slow and should be increased by 50% to allow for proper maneuvering and back peddeling - this would give units that are now deemed useless a proper role, because they could actually move into the right position.

Retreat speed needs to be 2x that of movement speed as currently infantry cannot outrun a k8 when retreating.. making the retreat option a lot less useful when it comes to conserving man power and making proper decisions.

I also think that slow infantry roation and the smaller firing arcs of infantry need to be changed as its just sloppy right now and detracts from the game - I do think animations and glitchiness of the infantry movement is ruining the game.

Vehicles also need to be much more responsive to allow for proper control - this is why its very very rare to see trul high level maneuvering that COH was famous for.

If Relic is about creating high qulity games then these sort of issues should definately be addressed - I have no doubt in my mind that the team that made COH2 had never been fans of the original or even have a concept of what made it a good game.

It really shows in the final product - they just dont get it.

The two biggest flaws as I see it:

1. The spamfest. As soviets, spam conscripts + one unit of shocks or guards. Spam maxims. ZZZzzzzz.

2. I miss the old doctrine trees from Coh1. Someone suggested in another thread that commanders should work more like the doctrine trees in Coh1 where one can choose a path to go down and u have a set amount points that you can use. I'm thinking kind of like talent trees in role playing games.

The command delay is atrocious...but we have lived with it for a year so oh well...

Glad someone points this out... I was already thinking I'm just getting old...

For an RTS-Game, unit response time is unbelievably bad on the brink of gamebreaking. Just shows how good the game is besides that, since we're still playing it.

Glad someone points this out... I was already thinking I'm just getting old...

For an RTS-Game, unit response time is unbelievably bad on the brink of gamebreaking. Just shows how good the game is besides that, since we're still playing it.

Why are we still playing it exactly? I think we all think it's better than it is because vCoH

Why are we still playing it exactly? I think we all think it's better than it is because vCoH

'

Beacuse it can be fun, but its mostly due to the COH name and the fact that COH is old now and even though its the best RTS ever made you cant play it forever.

I still cant believe that relic has not addressed just how sloppy the game is. Units are too slow, the response is terrible and animations are glitchy and not smooth it all really detracts from the game.

I have tried to bring up command latency many times here, but every time my thread gets shut down by apologists who wouldn't be able to tell the difference between RTS and turn-based games. Latency IS a genuine problem, but every thread on this gets filled up with posts from 4v4 players simply dismisses it saying "nah I think it's ok, I love big tanks durr".

The problem is that the majority people here only play COH2 and nothing else. If people here had played their fair share of high level SC2 or even DOTA they would realise how horrible the latency is in COH2.

I did the following test:

SC2: Connect to the US East SC2 server, play a 1v1, record command latency with fraps.
COH2: Connect to the US battle server, play a 1v1, record command latency with fraps.

By counting frames, from a command is given until your unit reacts, you can calculate the command latency in milliseconds.

First observation: Both games have higher latency than the actual server ping.

Second observation: COH2 command latency is the double of the SC2 latency. This is for equivalent pings to US servers.

(SC2/COH2 pings: 150ms, SC2 latency: 250ms, COH2 latency: 500ms)

Conclusion: There is something in Relic's net code that provides a less than optimal command latency, far higher than what should be possible under exact same conditions and server structure (SC2). To sum up, Relic needs to take a look at their net code. Of course, local servers would also be likely to help, but might be too expensive given the popularity of the game.

(note 1: I did the tests from Europe, but I am sure that this should even affect US players. SEA/AUS players should be even worse off.)

(note 2: In case you're wondering about singleplayer, I recorded less than 10ms of command latency)

I did the following test:

SC2: Connect to the US East SC2 server, play a 1v1, record command latency with fraps.
COH2: Connect to the US battle server, play a 1v1, record command latency with fraps.

By counting frames, from a command is given until your unit reacts, you can calculate the command latency in milliseconds.

First observation: Both games have higher latency than the actual server ping.

Second observation: COH2 command latency is the double of the SC2 latency. This is for equivalent pings to US servers.

(SC2/COH2 pings: 150ms, SC2 latency: 250ms, COH2 latency: 500ms)

Conclusion: There is something in Relic's net code that provides a less than optimal command latency, far higher than what should be possible under exact same conditions and server structure (SC2). To sum up, Relic needs to take a look at their net code. Of course, local servers would also be likely to help, but might be too expensive given the popularity of the game.

(note 1: I did the tests from Europe, but I am sure that this should even affect US players. SEA/AUS players should be even worse off.)

(note 2: In case you're wondering about singleplayer, I recorded less than 10ms of command latency)

Thats pretty interesting - but I think it goes beyond net code. even in singleplayer the way units handle in coh2 is just plain bad. Go turn on coh play for a few mins, and then go straight to coh2 and see for yourself.

Not only are there delays in commands, but infantry and vehicles are very unresponsive. Add bad animations and the fact that it takes considerable time for infantry to target and fire and the whole game becomes a sloppy mess.

I have seen 0 games of coh2 where there level of maneuvering has come anywhere near the levels of a good COH match - even the pro players look hardly better than an average automatcher.

If you look at a pro COH game you can see how incredibly good they are at micro

I dunno, my basic observation from singleplayer is that units start moving the frame after you issued the command. That seems alright to me. I'm mostly annoyed by the large latency that is added in multiplayer. Of course, in both singleplayer and multiplayer, you have to wait for your tanks to accelerate.

The worst part is the glitch where if a unit is in a fight and you order it to move into cover. Some models will stop firing for a second when arriving at the cover and it looks so stupid, this is really gamebreaking and the game punishes you for trying to micro and the game just looks unfinished.

This is clearly visible in relics own US tutorial video at 1:06, look how 2 models from the paratrooper squad goes totally braindead when arriving at the cover, this problem is also affecting AT gun crews and Machineguns when redeployed AND NEEDS FIXING

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpS7jiUeSQY&list=UUXgK_BvNF2j7qH_NZcNlSeQ <--- 1:06 FIX IT RELIC!!

Wow, never noticed something that bad. Nice video spajn, they really need to look at that.

Biggest Flaw of Coh2 is its price.

To me its how positioning feels less vital. Blobbing is a bit easier, not using cover can be OK, artillery might massacre a certain unit or do nothing at all depending on RNG (only that shiny OKW artillery is consistent) and thus doesnt care much for positioning either.

It kinda bothers me since cover and positioning are my favourite parts of the game, next to the point capping that games like SC sorely lacks.