Shocks

Remember in CoH when you could aim a nade at the enemy OR the ground...

2 volks with nade use will stop shocks.

2 sturmpios will obliterate shocks.

2 G43 panzerfusiliers will stop shocks(normal ones as well but you need nade).

And falls will win if you land a good nade. Falls cost is so high because of opportunity value that spawning them anywhere from neutral building gives.

Since i don't play OKW as much i'll not contradict u forcefully.However seeing the more costly fallschirmjager fail epicly made me comment in this thread.
Since u are a soviet player and i'm not a regular OKW player..i accept ur statements,even though i know ur biased towards soviet.

wooof is right on this one.



konigskubel with a squad of sturmpios will wreck on shocks.

And honestly, just kite them. Their long-mid range dps is abhorrent.

I can give you a good idea why. Fall's come in at 2CP, are cheap, 6 man squad, have A/T, and a G43 upgrade. They perform well at all ranges. Best used in blobs of 4 with attack move.

On the flip side. Shocks perform well at one range, have no A/T ability, and require constant micro.

IN MY OPINION (but only in MINE inb4 'l2p') shocks are brutally strong and viable. Especially OKW does not have much counters to them. Volks don't seem to do any damage on Shocks and they die like flies.
COVER DOES NOT MATTER. The Shocks will simply storm the cover to kill everything.
Even Obers have their problems against them. Shocks simply throw a smoke to get close and all the Obers die.
MY OPINION.

wooof is right on this one.



konigskubel with a squad of sturmpios will wreck on shocks.

And honestly, just kite them. Their long-mid range dps is abhorrent.

ALL HAIL TO THE KÖNIGSKUBEL!

I can give you a good idea why. Fall's come in at 2CP, are cheap, 6 man squad, have A/T, and a G43 upgrade. They perform well at all ranges. Best used in blobs of 4 with attack move.

On the flip side. Shocks perform well at one range, have no A/T ability, and require constant micro.

those are fusiliers.
falls are those squishy troops that spawn from buildings or form airstrikes and get killed on retreat

I can give you a good idea why. Fall's come in at 2CP, are cheap, 6 man squad, have A/T, and a G43 upgrade. They perform well at all ranges. Best used in blobs of 4 with attack move.

oops thats embarassing. dont look now, but your bias is showing

What if i told u i'd take that exchange any day..every day.
But i'm curious to the reasons behind ur decision.

Its simple-Guards are the only sov infantry that don't use clubs for killing.
Falls would make that 2 squads.

Quickly, better make a forum post about it.

I got the name of the unit incorrect. The rest is still true. I'd take fusiliers over shock troops for the above reasons.

inb4 kubel

The kubel is in no way a reliable means of dealing with shocks. It's only real use is in the first few minutes of the game, before shocks are even on the field, and shocks have smoke to nullify the suppression anyway.

I'm hoping there is a patch soon that deals with the call in structure. Relic has mentioned that they are aware of the issue. I'm also hoping for some sort of rework for the Soviets and Ostheer, because at the moment they feel a little uninspired compared to the OKW and USF.

Then, in short, shocks, isu-152 and maxims should be nerfed, right?

Luckily we still have sniper spam


Jokes aside, I can't believe you can't figure out a counter to a pure AI unit that doesn't do a shit of damage at a distance of 2 meters.

HMGs, kubel, ostwind, flameHT, flakHT, any fucking tank in the game, etc...

You can even take profit that Shocks must go towards your unit like zombies to plant some tricky mines in green cover.
Even 2 Sturmpios beat a single Shock unit.

And a last piece of advice. Smoke doesn't remove suppression inmediately, you can get close with any infantry unit and kill them while they are still suppressed.

flameHT

hahahah seriously?

Then, in short, shocks, isu-152 and maxims should be nerfed, right?

Luckily we still have sniper spam


Jokes aside, I can't believe you can't figure out a counter to a pure AI unit that doesn't do a shit of damage at a distance of 2 meters.

HMGs, kubel, ostwind, flameHT, flakHT, any fucking tank in the game, etc...

You can even take profit that Shocks must go towards your unit like zombies to plant some tricky mines in green cover.
Even 2 Sturmpios beat a single Shock unit.

And a last piece of advice. Smoke doesn't remove suppression inmediately, you can get close with any infantry unit and kill them while they are still suppressed.

No way dude? Smoke doesn't remove suppression immediately? I can use a T3 vehicle to counter an infantry unit!? You sir, have blown my mind.

hahahah seriously?

Technically is a hard counter. Another thing is that you could keep it alive from ZiS or T34s.

@FestiveLongJohns, sounds stupid, but bigger absurdities are written here.

I don't think that any top 500 player has any problem dealing with a pure AI unit only useful at close range. Only in urban maps like Ettelbruck Station Shocks could be difficult to deal with.

Shocks are amazing, but also have plenty of counters. Being a proper use of axis long range infantry one of them.

Obers are not always a sure way to stop shocks. Since shocks have smoke grenade they can eliminate the far advantage. You can move the obers, but ideally you want the obers to attack from long range in heavy cover. If you have to leave your cover position because of the smoke, then likely obers will lose. Shocks armor and dps is just better once mid range is acheived. Since obers can't fire behind them, they will lose precious milliseconds just turning around to face the lmg towards the shocks. Then there might even be a little dance first to delay the first burst.

I believe the infrared mp44 will beat shocks though, so that is 1 option if you have that commander. Seems fair though, considering shocks are commander specific too. That upgrade is a harsh 120mu too right?

Falls vs shocks is a joke. Falls are pretty good against other infantry, but man they are expensive to lose so hard against shocks. I don't think they should get a price decrease due to how they are deployed. Often times that is enough to justify the cost, sneaking up on katyushas, snipers, and other support units at the click of a button. I do think their reinforce cost can be reduced though, unless they are bugged, because they die fast like cons.

Technically is a hard counter. Another thing is that you could keep it alive from ZiS or T34s.

@FestiveLongJohns, sounds stupid, but bigger absurdities are written here.

I don't think that any top 500 player has any problem dealing with a pure AI unit only useful at close range. Only in urban maps like Ettelbruck Station Shocks could be difficult to deal with.

Shocks are amazing, but also have plenty of counters. Being a proper use of axis long range infantry one of them.

I think the OPs issue, despite the title, is more along the lines of the overall strength of the soviet faction from start to finish. Most factions have some sort of window of weakness that you can exploit, the soviets have insanely strong elite infantry and a number of extremely viable call in options.

IMO the main reason they are so strong is because they have the best call in heavies in the game. Their actual core army is pretty limited by the tech costs, but this isn't really unique to the Soviets. The Ostheer have the same issue, except their only real option in 1v1s is the Tiger. Against the USF there isn't really any reason to choose anything but the Stug E. It's always a better choice to forego tech'ing and save the fuel for more call ins. Without strong call-ins the Soviets would be pretty shit.

hahahah seriously?

Well, it does counter them.

It dies instantly to almost anything else, but still .

kubel works on shocks. Kubel works as a team though, so not a standalone hard counter. Yes it still does the same function in late game as early game. If you want to beat shocks with volks, it's actually your best bet.

The luchs is the hard counter to shocks. You can usually get a luchs a few minutes after shocks hit the field if you go medic truck to schwerer truck. During that time just use multiple squads to focus shocks and just retreat if they get close because you WILL lose squads if you dont