[Request] - How to calculate time to pinned

Hey team,

I want to do up a comparison of the 5 support team HMG's and would like to know how to calculate time to pinned (suppressed) units. Is this possible? If so, how?

Some steps to get suppression values for each HMG:

1. Calculate how many "in-game" bullets that HMG is shooting at desired range - per second with reload, per second without reload, per burst (whatever you're interested in). You can use formulas from the CoH2 Stats spreadsheet to help you understand how it's done.
2. Multiply the number of bullets by the suppression value of the HMG (for example, Ostheer MG42 generates 0.012 suppression per bullet)
3. Now you can easily calculate how much time or how many bursts it'll take for the HMG to suppress or pin a squad. For most squads (if not all, haven't checked) suppression threshold is 0.2 and pin threshold is 0.6. You just need to divide the threshold value by what you got in number 2 to get the time or number of bursts (depending on what you're calculating).
Keep in mind that after the squad gets suppressed, most of HMGs (again, haven't checked all of them) apply only half of their suppression values to the squad - unless I remember that stats wrong.
Another thing to keep in mind is that some HMGs have better AoE suppression than others (like MG42 has it better than Maxim).

On my site www.coh2-stats.com you have "per burst" graphs for HMG suppression, just under the DPS graph (for example this), as well as some basic suppression raw stats (under Raw Stats -> Suppression section).

I wouldn't say its possible to do it in any precise way.

Probably best thing you can do is just set up MGs and rush with some weaksaunce infantry and keep it out of any cover at max sight range, repeat 3x times per mg to get anything resembling accurate conclusions.

That is what I would do.

I wouldn't say its possible to do it in any precise way.

Probably best thing you can do is just set up MGs and rush with some weaksaunce infantry and keep it out of any cover at max sight range, repeat 3x times per mg to get anything resembling accurate conclusions.

That is what I would do.

Seems like the best way to get it - experimentation! If you are going to do it that way, use the CheatCommands Mod - easy way to test it, just spawn squads at your leisure.

Remember also that suppression is dependent on range-specifically for maxim, which shoots faster the closer targets are.

math op

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1J8eWu0XRL4I8H37Z2TAt9twjrY3E-9J5ovHF_J42sxk/edit#gid=0

testing in game would have way too many variables.

And that's why maths just won't cut it - there are too many variables, especially during a live game, that will get in the way of getting accurate results. Experimentation.

The calculation is good for getting a general ballpark estimation of how long it takes to suppress / pin - but things like soldier position, available cover, etc. will get in the way.

Thanks much w0000f. Going to attempt to make sense of this all now.

math op

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1J8eWu0XRL4I8H37Z2TAt9twjrY3E-9J5ovHF_J42sxk/edit#gid=0

testing in game would have way too many variables.

This. 100 times this.

math op

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1J8eWu0XRL4I8H37Z2TAt9twjrY3E-9J5ovHF_J42sxk/edit#gid=0

testing in game would have way too many variables.

and here we have the reason why relic likes to fuck up units every patch........

What really is needed is the area suppression effect. Because thats what distinguishes the maxim from the Mg42 for example.

I constantly get frontally rushed by blobs and my maxim wont suppress more than one squad before they are all over the maxim.

It would be nice to have some numbers to compare the mgs in that department.

greetz

and here we have the reason why relic likes to fuck up units every patch........

im not sure what youre getting at. relying math is why relic fucks up? im not sure you realize this, but the whole game is just math.

And that's why maths just won't cut it - there are too many variables, especially during a live game, that will get in the way of getting accurate results. Experimentation.

The calculation is good for getting a general ballpark estimation of how long it takes to suppress / pin - but things like soldier position, available cover, etc. will get in the way.

of course these numbers cant accurately predict in game situations. these numbers assume you are shooting at an entity at a fixed distance for the entire time, something that rarely happens in game.

experimentation wont be any more accurate. first you have human error (starting/stopping a stopwatch), then you have variation in burst/cooldown durations (changing the amount of time they shoot/pause every single time), entities move around when getting shot at (if the entity thats being targeted gets closer, the time to suppress will go up slightly), etc. the number of experiments you would have to run would be huge for 6 mgs. even then, i would trust math more.

math holds all of those variables constant, even if its not realistic, which makes the numbers comparable.

What really is needed is the area suppression effect. Because thats what distinguishes the maxim from the Mg42 for example.

ah shit, youre the guy who was asking for an explanation on aoe suppression before. sorry i never got around to that. ill try to add aoe suppression to the spreadsheet but its a bit more complicated. the german mg accuracy is dependent on how many entities (not squads) are around the entity its actually targeting. accuracy affects aoe suppression, so bigger blobs suppress faster.

i guess ill just do the calculation for mgs shooting at 6 entities and shooting at 12

im not sure what youre getting at. relying math is why relic fucks up? im not sure you realize this, but the whole game is just math.

no not because of math but because relic tends to look at the numbers only and not at how they ACTUALLY perform in the game. thus not listeniing to the community because you know, the numbers are right

Skinless: This might be news to you, but do you understand what computer games are built out of?

(Protip: Its not mud, concrete or bricks. It has to do with code and numbers)

finally got around to writing up splash suppression in rows 42-51.

the m2hb has the best splash suppression at about 20m or less.

german mgs are better at longer ranges thanks to having better incremental accuracy.