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Comparison of Kat & Stuka after heavy usage

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wayward516
30 Jul 2014, 17:31 PM
#61
avatar of wayward516

Posts: 229

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Jul 2014, 16:59 PMPorygon
I don't care if it was totally worthless in previous patch, it is NOT the reason buffing it into current insane level.

The Kat in early stage of vCOH2, was perfectly fine.


Response to me? If so...

I never remember the katyusha feeling worth it, though I only played in the stress tests and not general beta.

Might be OP now, I cannot day and will defer. I definitely see how getting a ton of them out fast with Industry Tactics could be uber nasty. I've only used it once since the patch (just got a new PC) and for the first time, it felt worthwhile.

I think an AoE (splash) and\or damage reduction are probably warranted. I just hope they don't over Nerf it again and send it back to the dustbin of history.
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CptEend
30 Jul 2014, 17:36 PM
#63
avatar of CptEend
Patrion 14

Posts: 369

Kat is strong and probably needs a slight (a word Relic never understood) nerf, but to say the Stuka is weak is ridiculous. A Stuka will have a hard time hitting conscripts and riflemen, but you can't possibly miss Maxims/AT guns/Mortars, and when they hit its an almost guaranteed squad wipe. Also, don't forget that even small arms fire kills a Kat in seconds.

But yes, the Kat is a too strong and needs a nerf. Just don't exaggerate things.
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/eend
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Cannonade
30 Jul 2014, 17:55 PM
#64
avatar of Cannonade

Posts: 752

Nerf all 3 of them.

They are making field artillery look like popguns :(
"You are competitive if play to win and make efforts to improve." -Basilone
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Greeb
30 Jul 2014, 17:58 PM
#65
avatar of Greeb

Posts: 971

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Jul 2014, 17:55 PMCannonade
Nerf all 3 of them.

They are making field artillery look like popguns :(


+1

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Tetley
30 Jul 2014, 18:05 PM
#66
avatar of Tetley

Posts: 187

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Jul 2014, 17:55 PMCannonade
Nerf all 3 of them.

They are making field artillery look like popguns :(


I think i built one of them once..... :(
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GustavGans
30 Jul 2014, 18:35 PM
#67
avatar of GustavGans

Posts: 747

The katusha in its current state can win you the game single handedly even if you are a terrible player. It's an absolute nobrainer, I mean I managed to get 20(!) Kills in one barrage! If a unit gets targeted there is no way to get out unharmed, even if you hit retreat instantly. On maps like Minsk, Charkov or Semoski there's no way to flank it and take it out.

The Katusha is just flat out broken. Period.

About the Walking Stuka;

I understand that some people have trouble with it in it's current state so I wouldn't mind a slight nerf even though I don't think it needs one. It is by far not as terrible as the Katusha is and here is why;

-long cooldown
-high price
-narrow firing area

If you only shift your units a little once you hear it firing, you won't suffer any squad wipes.


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I<3CoH
30 Jul 2014, 18:37 PM
#68
avatar of I<3CoH

Posts: 177

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Who the hell would even compare the Katyusha to the stuka? oO

Katyusha is obviously too strong at the moment. It was a bit too weak before the patch, Sledgehammer Relic came and overbuffed it.

Next patch will reduce the effectiveness again. Question is: When will that patch be released? =/

Stuka is of course fine balance-wise. I still dont like the design. Less devastating barrage, less cooldown would be better imo.
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CptEend
30 Jul 2014, 18:50 PM
#69
avatar of CptEend
Patrion 14

Posts: 369

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Jul 2014, 18:35 PMGustavGans
The katusha in its current state can win you the game single handedly even if you are a terrible player. It's an absolute nobrainer, I mean I managed to get 20(!) Kills in one barrage!


You get 20 kills in one barrage if your opponent is a terrible player. That's just ridiculous blobbing.
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/eend
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I<3CoH
30 Jul 2014, 18:52 PM
#70
avatar of I<3CoH

Posts: 177

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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Jul 2014, 18:50 PMCptEend


You get 20 kills in one barrage if your opponent is a terrible player. That's just ridiculous blobbing.


Or if he is using combined arms in a tight space, or if he is playing OKW and has his truck not in his base. You dont have to blob to get totally annihilated by this unit
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GustavGans
30 Jul 2014, 19:18 PM
#71
avatar of GustavGans

Posts: 747

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Jul 2014, 18:50 PMCptEend


You get 20 kills in one barrage if your opponent is a terrible player. That's just ridiculous blobbing.



Nope. Forced him off the map, causing a mass retreat, katusha--> point click base = gg

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Aerohank
30 Jul 2014, 19:28 PM
#72
avatar of Aerohank

Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Jul 2014, 19:18 PMGustavGans



Nope. Forced him off the map, causing a mass retreat, katusha--> point click base = gg


Yes because that is relevant for balancing discussion right?
All arties can get ridiculous kills when all the enemy units are stacked around 1 point.
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Katitof
30 Jul 2014, 19:34 PM
#73
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Jul 2014, 19:18 PMGustavGans



Nope. Forced him off the map, causing a mass retreat, katusha--> point click base = gg


I can do that with:

-light arty barrage
-panzerwerfer
-any off map
-wehr howi
-both sov howis
-priest
-stuka

Did I forgot about something important?
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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Arclyte
30 Jul 2014, 19:47 PM
#74
avatar of Arclyte

Posts: 692

If the first barrage wipes a squad, that's some really bad RNG

If the second barrage wipes a squad, you deserve it for standing in the same spot for 6 seconds after hearing/seeing where it's firing
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GustavGans
30 Jul 2014, 20:14 PM
#75
avatar of GustavGans

Posts: 747

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Jul 2014, 19:34 PMKatitof


I can do that with:

-light arty barrage
-panzerwerfer
-any off map
-wehr howi
-both sov howis
-priest
-stuka

Did I forgot about something important?


Yes you forgot quite a few things, offmaps need los, fixed arty needs to be built within range of the enemy base and all of the arty pieces you listed deliver less damage per barrage and affect a smaller area.

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_underscore
30 Jul 2014, 20:34 PM
#76
avatar of _underscore
Donator 33

Posts: 322

First barrage squad wipes aren't uncommon at all in my experience. Apart from that it's fun facing a unit with strong area decimation. But squad wipes are too punishing since reacting quickly doesn't reliably save units.
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Katitof
30 Jul 2014, 20:56 PM
#77
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Jul 2014, 20:14 PMGustavGans


Yes you forgot quite a few things, offmaps need los, fixed arty needs to be built within range of the enemy base and all of the arty pieces you listed deliver less damage per barrage and affect a smaller area.


Because reckon overflights are uncommon within the same doctrine and for 2v2 there should be always someone with it.
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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Von Sturm
30 Jul 2014, 21:11 PM
#78
avatar of Von Sturm

Posts: 50

The kat buff was the last utter relic BS. Seriously WHY THE HELL SOVIET NEEDS THAT BUFF ? They have heavy mortar, best off map arty, best on map arty, ZIS/SU76 bombing ability ... and now that shit. I dont get the point ... I dont get why they gave them the ability to RIP OFF units before retreat and rape base. WHAT THE HELL RELIC THINKED ???

Seriously, Im fucking disapointed. The matchup is soooo stupid now. Mine/Zis-MG Spam/ Go for T4 > GG ...
Schanck !
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Katitof
30 Jul 2014, 21:16 PM
#80
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Jul 2014, 21:11 PMVon Sturm
The kat buff was the last utter relic BS. Seriously WHY THE HELL SOVIET NEEDS THAT BUFF ?


Pre patch katiusha:



Do you see now why? It desperately needed buff.

If they overdid it is a whole different topic.
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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