New commanders not OP and Free?

Jump back to quoted post18 Feb 2014, 17:47 PMImagelessbean

I have to disagree that Ost commander is useful. I have listed the reasons below:

1) Icons are identical with icons already in game, although the abilities are not actually those abilities

2) Commander has two useful abilities and three that are bad
a) Recon fly by is fine for cost, but with lag input it is almost useless since arty abilities rarely trigger as it flies by
b) Fuel to munitions is good for Ost so this one is ok
c) One strafe pass is not very useful since it only pins one squad or two and yet comes out at 6 cp's, so you could have regular strafe at same time. Also soviets can just wait it out since it does not come back.
d) Stuka 37mm strafe is one of the worst abilities in game right now. It comes late, does not track, and does minimal damage unless it is right on top of a unit. It also flies in so its timing is uncertain. Combine this with the fact that in this commander it is a single pass and you get a 90 munitions burn for literally nothing.
e) Stuka dive bomb is good, same as original

3) Abilities have timers like original abilities but do not operate in same fashion, looks very amateur.

4) Forces Ost to rely on munitions heavy strats, within an extremely munitions limited faction


Soviet commander by contrast is quite good.

1) Arguably allows either T1 or T2 opening or simple conscript spam
2) Works synergistically with late game to give excellent medium tank and tank destroyer
3) Provides excellent balance of abilities to round out play style

TLDR: The Soviet commander is not OP, it is just a good commander. I foresee it replacing many other options. The Ost commander is not good and will be relegated to comp stomp games at best.

I am so tired of commanders at this point, I do not want to see one more commander added to this game.

Jump back to quoted post18 Feb 2014, 17:30 PMWilliG

All the abilities are not completely recycled, the strafe runs are all only one pass for both, which is a difference from the old abilities. Also the t34 call in, as mentioned by others. Not COMPLETELY different, but different enough to change how they play.

Jump back to quoted post18 Feb 2014, 18:34 PMKatitof

Why do you think icon look have an impact on usefulness of the ability?


Not an issue nor an excuse, unless you play on 7 year old rig and 1mb radio net.



You contradict yourself.

1 pass is enough to explit the advantage it gives. If you can't, it means you have used it and done absolutely nothing.


This is pretty much the only issue you are right about.





Because the two factions function completely differently.

Soviets need to rely on a doctrine, while for germans its just a supplemental thing.

Moreover the two doctrines have completely different functions, one is specialist support, other is general purpose, you can't compare them at all only because you got them at the same time.

Jump back to quoted post18 Feb 2014, 20:18 PMImagelessbean

The appearance of the icon gives the player a statement of what they are getting, in this case they are misrepresented. I would not put a picture of an mg in place of the panther's image.

I said that munitions for fuel is fine, but that this is not a good excuse to provide munitions heavy call ins in a munitions limited doctrine. If you think even with munitions exchange a Ost player can not worry about munitions you are very wrong. By sacrificing fuel they must now use munitions to kill tanks and heavier equipment. It is a strategy change not a solution to the underlying problem.

Strafe is good because it loiters and therefore forces infantry off the field. Because of larger soviet squad size you can just ignore single pass strafes. Both strafes appear on the field at exactly the same time. Why?

Ost does not need to rely as heavily on its doctrine as the Soviets do, but if you think that Ost does not need to worry about the doctrine it picks you need to play more Ost.

Jump back to quoted post18 Feb 2014, 18:34 PMKatitof

Because the two factions function completely differently.

Soviets need to rely on a doctrine, while for germans its just a supplemental thing.

Jump back to quoted post18 Feb 2014, 18:24 PMAurgelwulf

Why do relic keep giving Ost munition heavy doctrines and abilities? 30 munitions for an anti-inf upgrade for conscripts but for grens it's 60 munitions. The problem with the IL2 wasn't just it's damage, it was the fact that soviets can amass that much munitions in the first place.

Jump back to quoted post18 Feb 2014, 18:50 PMBartonPL

Germans planes in this doc are half cost compared to their full versions, and i like strafe more than it's full version because you can pin squads that you want instantly, and it's harder to avoid. 37mm stuka is really weak, but for it's cost it might be usefull to kill Halftrucks and lighter vehicles.

No doubt about Soviet commander, all abilities are useful and good for all the game stages

Jump back to quoted post19 Feb 2014, 00:28 AMpigsoup

there's fuel to muni ability...

also having a lot of muni options doesnt translate to muni-starved...

Jump back to quoted post19 Feb 2014, 12:39 PMAurgelwulf

If it was manpower to munitions, it would be fine, but no German player can afford the 50 fuel.

Jump back to quoted post20 Feb 2014, 13:02 PMKatitof

Probably because every german player is stuck with "I Need to get as much P4s in shortest time possible" mindset.
The doctrine is based on heavy T1/T2 play with light med armor support asnd heavy off map support. If you will play it like other doctrines, you'll fail because you will completely miss its purpose.