However, in contrast to DAK, which I feel needs what I have already classified as a complete rework, Wehr basically doesn’t need that kind of surgery, it’s a really well designed faction, which you’d expect given that its essentially the third attempt in over 15 years. So my changes are mostly superficial tweaks with an eye to the future and an eye to the past.
I want to set the tone of this post as being different from my DAK thread, as the changes I propose there:
https://www.coh2.org/topic/111231/dak-redesign
I’m absolutely convinced of and I think are obvious. Here though, the changes are not the end of the World, the faction will still be fine if not implemented, but these are more experimental and creative. They aim to liven up the same old Wehr formula into something a bit more spicey.
Without further ado, let’s have a look at the current design:
Current Design
A few observations to start off.
Wehr really lacks side tech relative to the other factions. While DAK have a whole armoury of side tech options, Brits have a structure dedicated to it as well and Americans have 3 trees of side tech. Wehr really have only the veterency and side skirts upgrades and that’s your lot. It means Wehr doesn’t really have the same opportunity cost and decision making other factions have, the choice between more units or better units. This would be something I would change.
Jägers design is questionable. In the Scoped version they’re okay, but with the Schrek it’s a nightmare. The problem is you have a single Schrek upgrade on 5 man squad. Whenever in the Coh franchise this has been done before, this has always lead to blobbing because it can deal with basically everything. Panzergrenadiers in PE, Grens in Coh1 Wehr, Volksgrenadiers in OKW, Panzergrenadiers in Ostheer; this is the latest in a long saga. In Coh2, they got removed in the case of Volks and made into a dedicated AT squad once upgrade in the case of Pgrens. I see the same happening to Jägers at some point.
Hulldown makes little sense as it can be activated in combat, is free and gives buff immediately.
Finally, I feel AT is perceived as a problem for Wehr, not because they don’t have it but because it can be difficult to access due to the steep costs of switching between tiers. The design basically encourages staying in one tier at the expense of others but this leads to less varied build orders.
Here’s what I would change:
New Design
Like last time, I will explain the changes first and then the logic after. Unlike last time though, I’ve already modded the proposals before making them, so if reading is not your thing, just check it out yourself here:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2947341907
Tier 0 stays the exact same. Tier 1 stays the same except now it has various side techs. These side techs basically boil down to veterency (already existing), infantry ability unlocks, infantry upgrade unlocks and infantry construction unlocks; all of which I will explain later in greater detail.
Tier 2 and Tier 3 are where the changes become more stark, the upfront costs of both of these tiers have been reduced by about 30% and they each now have their own individual side tier. For Tier 1, Jägers and the Flak 30 are unlocked immediately but the 221 and the Marder are locked behind behind tier 2.5, which comprises of that cost that was removed from the base building. In Tier 3, Panzergrenadiers and the Pak40 are available immediately but the 251 and the Nebel are locked behind their own side tier, 3.5. The StuG and the Wirbelwind are still locked behind the same side tier, albeit at a reduced price and the upgrade is dependant on either Tier 2.5/3.5 having been already researched. Both Tier 2 and Tier 3 have an additional side upgrade, in Tier 2’s case, this unlocks vehicle abilities and in Tier 3’s case, unlocking vehicle unit upgrades.
Tier 4 follows much of the same logic, the upfront cost of teching T4 is reduced but about 1 third, but it now has a side tier called tier 4.5. In the base tier of tier 4, we have the Stoßtruppen but also the recovery halftrack (which I removed from DAK!). In tier 4.5 we have the Panzer 4, Sturmpanzer and also the Nashorn tank destroyer. Finally, T4 retains the same side tech upgrades as before.
One change that I also make in the mod which is not apparent from the diagram is tying callins to tech. The Stug D, 251 Mechanised Group, 8 Rad, Wirbelwind and P4 Command Tank callins are all tied to requiring either T4 base tech or Tier 2/3*. Then the Tiger and Panther are tied to Tier 4.5.
The Logic
It goes like this.
The elefant in the room is the changes to the tech costs, which primarily have the motivation of making it easier to tech from one tier to the other. This will make it easier to have more flexible build orders and will make it less punishing when your build order doesn’t accommodate the situation you find yourself in. A good example of this is making T3 cheaper, this essentially has the effect of making the Pak more available. So if you screw up your T2 game loose your Marder and don’t have the fuel to tech StuG or the munitions for Schreks, it’s not a complete lost cause as teching Paks is relatively easy. This also applies to T4 stalls, as if you miscalculate and a light vehicle shows up before you can really get to within grasp of those late game vehicles, the Pak is always an option.
Another nice feature of this setup is that it makes it easier to make the best up of the Stug/Wirbelwind unlock, as once you’ve unlocked one, say the Stug for example, its now 30% cheaper to pick up the tech for the other. It also has the advantage of making transfer order more accessible, as by picking up both tiers, you can transform your army to be suited at all ranges rather than being nudged specifically towards one uit or the other. This change also makes AT in T2 more available, as Marders come at an earlier fuel point, meaning you’re less likely to get caught out.
With the T4 price split, this has 3 broad purposes. The first is to make Stoßtruppen arrive earlier in the same manner that the Panzer Kommand in OKW was split to get Obers earlier and make the tech less of a large upfront cost with no benefit. Another advantage is that it makes the side skirts upgrade more available, so let’s say your army has a considerable contigent of Wirbelwinds or Stugs, then getting the skirts upgrade is less of a stretch and more appealing, or at the least can be upgraded faster. Finally, this also plays into the battlegroup call-in timings. With 2 different points in the tech tree, which are roughly the same timing fuel wise (90-100 with tier 2&3 respectively, 80 with a straight tech to T4), it opens up a broader set of build orders where you could conceivably go for a T4 straight tech and call in either a Stug D, 8 Rad or Panzer command tank. This works out especially elegantly with the StuG D and 8 Rad as 80 fuel is the same amout of fuel it takes to tech these units directly with DAK in my mod, which was not the original intention, but a happy happenstance.
The inclusion of the recovery halftrack to me makes a lot of sense. Relative to DAK, where everything either repairs or repairs itself, Wehr lack repair options in that they only have Pioneers and Repair bunkers. The recovery halftrack fills a niche more admirably here I feel by giving you that lategame fast repair. I haven’t been able to find in the modding tools how to adjust the repair rate yet but I’m sure I can figure out how to give it DAK advanced repair.
The side tech upgrades for units I feel is basically self explanatory, with the infantry related ones, various squad upgrades are locked behind tech and likewise with various abilities and there’s a opporunity cost in getting them. The ones I particularly want to make a shout out to though include:
- The Jäger schrek upgrade. With Jägers, I’ve experimented with making them 4 men and reducing their cost manpower accordingly. I’ve also made the Panzerschrek upgrade a double schrek upgrade, so once upgraded, they’re basically a dedicated AT squad. I tend to avoid making balance changes when I can, as my mod really really is all about design, but with schreks I reduced their damage, penetration and accuracy to compensate for the fact that Jägers have 2 of them now. I’m still monitoring to see if they need further changes, but I feel this is only a realisation of what is inevitable.
- Panzergrenadiers now have an upgrade that gives them rudimentary repair. I found when playing T3 I always used the 251 in conjunction with Panzer Grens. The entire time I was wishing for some minor repair facility so I could synergise them more effectively and not have to run my halftrack off to my pioneers. It was bit of whim change, not essential in the grand scheme of things, but it works well and is a nod to their DAK cousins.
- Now for the Grens. So for Grens I often see reports from people complaining about how weak they are and its true, they don’t scale so well into the late game. Clearly relic has designed Transfer orders so that players can switch out Grenadiers when they’re no longer so great in direct confrontations and that with merge, sandbags and snares, they’re angling for the ‘Conscripts of Coh3’ accolade. Having thought about this dynamic a bit, I wanted to make the decision to transfer squads out more difficult by making Grens more appealing in terms of late game scale, but I don’t want to do this via making them stronger or giving them weapon upgrades, but instead I wanted to increase their utility.
In that pursuit, I gave Grens 3 squad upgrades.
The first is med kits, where they can not only heal nearby squads when outside of combat but also drop med crates for a munitions cost. This synergises amazingly well with your support weapon army and increases your staying power in the field. In my testing, I almost never when base healing before the 8 minute mark as I just co-ordinated my squads to use these heals. It works exactly like the Sturmpioneer crate drops, but currently they also passively heal outside of combat. In the long run, this ought to be a timed munitions ability like the 250 halftrack, but coding it this way was easier and the timed healing abilities in the game are incredibly lack lustre right now, as well as being difficult to change.
The second upgrade is an observer upgrade, where the squad has increased LOS when stationary and also detects vehicles in the FOW. This is also extremely useful, giving just a few examples:
- It works well with MGs allowing your to open fire immediately as squads enter it’s arc.
- This logic also applies to Snipers.
- It reduces scatter on Mortars and Nebels.
- Sniping vehicles with Paks is easier.
My personal favourite is using it in conjunction with the Marder, as the LOS makes it easier to take advantage of the Marder’s range, but also the vehicle detection reveals the unit in the FOW for attack ground shots, hunting vehicles down or even knowing when a dive is coming so you can back up early and make ready the faust. In summary this upgrade has serius utility.
Finally, the last upgrade increases the squads capture rate by 20% and also allows grens to detect mines while stationary. The whole idea behind this, is that as the game draw out, this would be your squad capping up the edges, capping faster and avoiding mines. I experimented with getting the kettenkrad cables upgrade to work on grens, but no luck, that would have been interesting to at least try, but may have been OP. This upgrade I found myself using the least, not because I doubt its utiility, but when playing against the AI which is how I do my testing, they don’t build a whole lot of mines. I’ve been tempted to add Salvage to it as well as it would be thematically suited.
Another upgrade I really wanted to get working but just couldn’t due to restrictions in the Mod tooling, was locking all the construction abilities behind a squad upgrade and also the ability to construct mines. I feel this upgrade would be on par in terms of utility with the rest of the upgrades, perhaps if Relic fix the tooling I can add it, but no hacky work around I tried made it possible.
All of the above add a great deal of tactical nuance and synergy in your army. I found it basically impossible to get rid of my Grens once I had teched up, as they’re just so useful. It makes that transfer order decision much more weighty and interesting, you should try it out and you’ll see what I mean.
Hulldown can only be activated when outside of combat for 10 seconds now. That is all.
Finally, the one other change I made was the add the Nashorn to tier 4.5. This is mostly an experimental change but I felt that Wehr late game was somewhat lacking relative to other factions, battlegroups excluded. With DAK you have the stock Flak 36 and Tiger, with Brits you have the 17 Pounder, US has the upgunned Shermans. I feel with faction design its important for the base faction to have all the tools it needs to handle any situation and Wehr doesn’t really have a great answer to heavy armour in the last game, the P4 is good but OKW had the best P4, the Panther and the KT. Soviets had the SU85, which the Stug definitely isn’t. Brits had the firefly and USF had the Jackson. It would really constrain Wehr battlegroup design if it had to contain some AT related late game answer, to fill in the gap. I feel it’s an idea with merit and better this than some DLC or adding the Panther, yet again.
Anyway, this is my take on Wehr, ike I said, my MOD is fully updated with this changes for give it a try and let me know your thoughts!
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2947341907
I’ve big plans for Brits next!
Relic Entertainment
cblanco ★ 
보드카 중대 
VonManteuffel 
Heartless Jäger 
