USF and MP bleed
16 Sep 2021, 05:03 AM
#141
Posts: 1158
That mine changes games, so yea it's worth it to me
29 Jul 2014, 12:16 PM by siuking666:
T34/76 is NOT a joke on my hands; Maybe on your hands you make it suck shit? but on me, No. I can kill a stug with a little micro, go toe to toe with a Panzer 4. Is it a joke? LOL T34/85 is apparently a very good tank. But no one says it "one hit wipe" or elefant penetration; up to a point i think this little medium tank just have too much health and too much firepower with that fuel cost.
16 Sep 2021, 07:10 AM
#142
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
Its not used because every usf unit is bad. Its because the mine is on a utility/scout car wich has been nerfed quite a bit over the years to a points it provides little value.
You dont get a vehicle costing fuel just to lay mines.
The M20 has actually been buffed not nerfed.
Can we give it a rest with myth that all USF unit have nerfed to the ground?
16 Sep 2021, 08:21 AM
#143
Posts: 772
Crew no longer has a bazooka.
that was a very big nerf. Not saying that changes brough a net negative, but that zook used to be a big deal.
16 Sep 2021, 08:32 AM
#144
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
that was a very big nerf. Not saying that changes brough a net negative, but that zook used to be a big deal.
If one want bazooka one can simply buy for them crew or load the officer...
16 Sep 2021, 08:47 AM
#145
Posts: 772
If one want bazooka one can simply buy for them crew or load the officer...
it seems like you missed the whole point.
16 Sep 2021, 09:01 AM
#146
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
it seems like you missed the whole point.
or it seems you missed why bazooka no longer come for free for the crew
especially for vehicle almost immune to small arm fire.
Going m20 still comes with free bazooka on LT and unlocking weapon rak is quite cheap.
16 Sep 2021, 09:21 AM
#147
Posts: 772
The M20 has actually been buffed not nerfed.
Crew no longer has a bazooka.
16 Sep 2021, 09:26 AM
#148
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
....
Do you agree with this or not?
Its not used because every usf unit is bad. Its because the mine is on a utility/scout car wich has been nerfed quite a bit over the years to a points it provides little value.
You dont get a vehicle costing fuel just to lay mines.
or you just trying to take something I posted out of context in order prove something posted is wrong?
16 Sep 2021, 09:32 AM
#149
Posts: 772
...
no idea. I can't 1v1 USF at all.
it was still big nerfed tho.
16 Sep 2021, 09:41 AM
#150
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
no idea. I can't 1v1 USF at all.
it was still big nerfed tho.
Yes removing bazookas from the crew was nerf, how big is another story.
The vehicle itself thou has not bee "nerfed quite a bit over the years" but has received a number of buff instead.
16 Sep 2021, 11:10 AM
#151
Posts: 1158
It's performance has been pretty consistent. They made it build faster and reduce the costs associated with it, except the mine which is awesome(you guys need to campaign to nerf that next).
29 Jul 2014, 12:16 PM by siuking666:
T34/76 is NOT a joke on my hands; Maybe on your hands you make it suck shit? but on me, No. I can kill a stug with a little micro, go toe to toe with a Panzer 4. Is it a joke? LOL T34/85 is apparently a very good tank. But no one says it "one hit wipe" or elefant penetration; up to a point i think this little medium tank just have too much health and too much firepower with that fuel cost.
16 Sep 2021, 11:39 AM
#152
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
It's performance has been pretty consistent. They made it build faster and reduce the costs associated with it, except the mine which is awesome(you guys need to campaign to nerf that next).
Who exactly are you referring as "you guys" and why would anyone want to nerf that?
16 Sep 2021, 11:58 AM
#153
Posts: 1158
Anyone want to let Vipper in on the obvious?
29 Jul 2014, 12:16 PM by siuking666:
T34/76 is NOT a joke on my hands; Maybe on your hands you make it suck shit? but on me, No. I can kill a stug with a little micro, go toe to toe with a Panzer 4. Is it a joke? LOL T34/85 is apparently a very good tank. But no one says it "one hit wipe" or elefant penetration; up to a point i think this little medium tank just have too much health and too much firepower with that fuel cost.
16 Sep 2021, 12:40 PM
#155
Posts: 1289
The M20 has actually been buffed not nerfed.
Can we give it a rest with myth that all USF unit have nerfed to the ground?
Firstly i never stated all usf units are nerfed to the ground although some are.
And you almost never see the m6 because people rarely build the m20. Or i must be blind.
16 Sep 2021, 13:00 PM
#156
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
Firstly i never stated all usf units are nerfed to the ground although some are.
And that is direct result of the US tech revamp which was faction buff and changed the original design of the faction. Actually I had pointed out it at the time.
And you almost never see the m6 because people rarely build the m20. Or i must be blind.
Saying that m20 has been:"nerfed quite a bit over the years" and m20 is not a very common sense is not nearly the same thing.
I am not sure what mods you are playing so I respond to why you do not see it.
Anyway I think we can move on.
And here are the other buffs m20 got that where missing:
"M20
The m20 has received some adjustments, as it would have arrived even later, and been even less effective within this new tech structure.
Manpower cost from 340 to 240
M20 accuracy from 0.75/0.475/0.2 to 0.55/0.45/0.25
Weapon accuracy increases with veterancy: +10%/+15%/+15%
Veterancy requirements lowered from 880/1760/3520 to 500/1000/2000
Veterancy 3 reduces time to plant mines by 5 seconds.
Veterancy 3 increases stealth detection by 10; 35 stealth detection radius from 25"
16 Sep 2021, 19:56 PM
#157
Posts: 1289
And that is direct result of the US tech revamp which was faction buff and changed the original design of the faction. Actually I had pointed out it at the time.
Saying that m20 has been:"nerfed quite a bit over the years" and m20 is not a very common sense is not nearly the same thing.
I am not sure what mods you are playing so I respond to why you do not see it.
Anyway I think we can move on.
And here are the other buffs m20 got that where missing:
"M20
The m20 has received some adjustments, as it would have arrived even later, and been even less effective within this new tech structure.
Manpower cost from 340 to 240
M20 accuracy from 0.75/0.475/0.2 to 0.55/0.45/0.25
Weapon accuracy increases with veterancy: +10%/+15%/+15%
Veterancy requirements lowered from 880/1760/3520 to 500/1000/2000
Veterancy 3 reduces time to plant mines by 5 seconds.
Veterancy 3 increases stealth detection by 10; 35 stealth detection radius from 25"
I think you miss my point. The m20 was nerfed cuz it was to strong, and even with its buffs afterwards it isent used much. So imo its still nerfed more then buffed.
Also i didnt mean to try and prove something you posted to be wrong.
16 Sep 2021, 20:20 PM
#158
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
I think you miss my point. The m20 was nerfed cuz it was to strong, and even with its buffs afterwards it isent used much. So imo its still nerfed more then buffed.
Also i didnt mean to try and prove something you posted to be wrong.
That simply not the case according to the patch notes:
POPULATION CHANGES
• M20: 6 to 4 buff
M20
The m20 has received some adjustments, as it would have arrived even later, and been even less effective within this new tech structure.
Manpower cost from 340 to 240 buff
M20 accuracy from 0.75/0.475/0.2 to 0.55/0.45/0.25 buff
Weapon accuracy increases with veterancy: +10%/+15%/+15% buff
Veterancy requirements lowered from 880/1760/3520 to 500/1000/2000 buff
Veterancy 3 reduces time to plant mines by 5 seconds. buff
Veterancy 3 increases stealth detection by 10; 35 stealth detection radius from 25 buff
M20 Utility Car
The M20 has repeatedly been reported as a problem unit by top players, particularly in 1v1. The Bazooka has been removed, as it was seen to make the m20 too difficult to counter, given it already has mines, high speed, smoke, and potential Lieutenant bazooka support in its favour.
Build time increased by 10 seconds (M20 will now arrive 20 seconds slower when taking the above tech changes into account) nerf
Crew no longer has a bazooka. nerf
M20 Utility Car
We wanted to introduce counter play against snipers
Now has 50% bonus accuracy against sniper types buff
Increase detection radius from 10 to 25 buff
M20
The M20 is having its build-time reduced so it can arrive sooner onto the battlefield. Furthermore, its armoured skirts are being reduced in price to better match their performance.
Build time from 55 to 45 buff
Skirt cost from 70 to 50 buff
The only real nerf is removing the bazooka which one can still purchase. When the meta changes it does not mean that a unit is up.
16 Sep 2021, 20:35 PM
#159
Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1
I think you miss my point. The m20 was nerfed cuz it was to strong, and even with its buffs afterwards it isent used much. So imo its still nerfed more then buffed.
I feel like you are thinking of the greyhound?
Cause that description doesn't apply to m20, applies a little better to the greyhound. M8 definitely deserved most of those nerfs though
16 Sep 2021, 20:55 PM
#160
Posts: 1289
That simply not the case according to the patch notes:
POPULATION CHANGES
• M20: 6 to 4 buff
M20
The m20 has received some adjustments, as it would have arrived even later, and been even less effective within this new tech structure.
Manpower cost from 340 to 240 buff
M20 accuracy from 0.75/0.475/0.2 to 0.55/0.45/0.25 buff
Weapon accuracy increases with veterancy: +10%/+15%/+15% buff
Veterancy requirements lowered from 880/1760/3520 to 500/1000/2000 buff
Veterancy 3 reduces time to plant mines by 5 seconds. buff
Veterancy 3 increases stealth detection by 10; 35 stealth detection radius from 25 buff
M20 Utility Car
The M20 has repeatedly been reported as a problem unit by top players, particularly in 1v1. The Bazooka has been removed, as it was seen to make the m20 too difficult to counter, given it already has mines, high speed, smoke, and potential Lieutenant bazooka support in its favour.
Build time increased by 10 seconds (M20 will now arrive 20 seconds slower when taking the above tech changes into account) nerf
Crew no longer has a bazooka. nerf
M20 Utility Car
We wanted to introduce counter play against snipers
Now has 50% bonus accuracy against sniper types buff
Increase detection radius from 10 to 25 buff
M20
The M20 is having its build-time reduced so it can arrive sooner onto the battlefield. Furthermore, its armoured skirts are being reduced in price to better match their performance.
Build time from 55 to 45 buff
Skirt cost from 70 to 50 buff
The only real nerf is removing the bazooka which one can still purchase. When the meta changes it does not mean that a unit is up.
Yes most are buffs, yet not every buff is as valuable.
The accuracy chance is not a buff. Its long rang acc got slightly better yet its mid and close range acc got nerfed. The curve got flattened.
Build time is still longer then before.
Bazooka removed wich you can buy now from weapon racks yes, reducing the effectines of the armoured skirt price buff.
Imo its still worse off overall despite it being cheaper, getting some vet bonusses in acc. Hence imo it isent used much currently
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