4v4 win rates disparity

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 12:37 PMSturmpanther

About why axis have higher win rate in 4vs4! :
1.in random vs random axis are most of the time better. But in premade vs premade allies are stronger. Allies random don't know how to counter a mg or killing a tank.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 12:37 PMSturmpanther

2. Matchmaking is fail atm. When you search axis you get top 100 mates but only facing 1k to 6k allies. So ofc axis wins. Just look last streams from duffman. Shows the same. And when duffman played random allies, he got friendly snipes.
So yes atm something is wrong in 4vs4. But imo its not the unit balance self. Something in the matchmaker is not working. It wasn't so worse in past. Ofc there were days where you faced as top 100 1k-6k but it happend on axis and allies sind. Now its only on allies side.
So ofc axis has higher winrate.
As said look duffmann stream, or rosebone thread, or ask aerafield. He tried in the last week to play random allies and no chance at all from matchmaking.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 12:37 PMSturmpanther

3. As allies random: Ban redball, port of hamburg. Snow maps are not that bad. Lower your settings or get better pc if you have still problems.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 12:37 PMSturmpanther

fftopic you guys saw the wins from allies in 1vs1? 3 time 52 % allies faction. poor wehrmacht 44 % lol.
Brits with the highest. But on the other side you don't see brits in 1vs1 Cups, because people know how to counter it.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 12:59 PMSturmpanther

last 40+ games axis?`How can you see that? only the last 10-15 games in history are acutall. the other 10-15 are from 2-3 years ago btw...
--> again lie

Last game I can see is: Wehr 2v2, VonAsten and you vs SpongeCoh and TM Q, length 29 minutes, KD ratio 1.21. Exactly 38th game if I didn't count it wrong
EDIT: counted wrong, exactly 40th

Yeah you maybe remeber the time where allies in 4vs4 were broken as shit? 1919 spam and brits etc. There i agree we played more axis as i explained you already.
I remember, and those were necessary nerfs. Nothing wrong with nerfing borken shit


Now mainly axis? I stopped playing coh2 since 2 months because of RL and Job. Just for few days ago i played 3-4 games with old friends.
--> again lie
Can't see the date of the games. Never said that you played them yesterday. Only said last 40 games or so. Last 40 games in past 10 years or 40 games in past 10 days, don't care. I play a game a week so I understand and I apologize if I gave a notion about you playing constantly

About data, thats why i explained you in the 3 points, which are not shown in the stats.
Also its about week to weeks. When i play active again with my friends, probably allies will be higher winrate then again^^.

I just can agree that random allies are most of the worser than axis randoms and that atm something is wrong in matchmaking! And that is what the stats from his side shows.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 12:59 PMHannibal

Complete lie. You can clearly see him playing as Allies regularly. Your "mostly Axis" claim is just made up.



You regularly post you opinion about balancing ideas. How is that not being interested in balance?

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 12:40 PMProtos Angelus

(not to mention they are German so it naturally comes to play with Germans, nothing wrong with that).

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:12 PMVipper

I am not sure why some people waste so much time an effort to "demonstrate" that some else one is biased. (and usally people who themselves play a certain faction or show bias themselves)

Even so one in MOD team is biased that does not make any buff to one's faction or nerf to other factions "wrong".

It much more constructive to focus on the changes and not the people.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:14 PMgeneral_gawain

I'm german too and play about 80% allied side. In the end I just want to have a balanced and fun game. 1vs1 and 2vs2 seems to be close to be balanced if you ask me. 3v3 and 4vs4 are far of because of ressource inflation and too small maps for the unit count.

If that can't be changed you have to change units. You could use doctrinal units like E8, Pershing, IS-2, KW-1 and so on to achieve that without changing balance in the smaller gamemodes.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:12 PMVipper

I am not sure why some people waste so much time an effort to "demonstrate" that some else one is biased.

It much more constructive to focus on the changes and not the people.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 12:37 PMSturmpanther

About why axis have higher win rate in 4vs4! :
1.in random vs random axis are most of the time better. But in premade vs premade allies are stronger. Allies random don't know how to counter a mg or killing a tank.

2. Matchmaking is fail atm. When you search axis you get top 100 mates but only facing 1k to 6k allies. So ofc axis wins. Just look last streams from duffman. Shows the same. And when duffman played random allies, he got friendly snipes.
So yes atm something is wrong in 4vs4. But imo its not the unit balance self. Something in the matchmaker is not working. It wasn't so worse in past. Ofc there were days where you faced as top 100 1k-6k but it happend on axis and allies sind. Now its only on allies side.
So ofc axis has higher winrate.
As said look duffmann stream, or rosebone thread, or ask aerafield. He tried in the last week to play random allies and no chance at all from matchmaking.

3. As allies random: Ban redball, port of hamburg. Snow maps are not that bad. Lower your settings or get better pc if you have still problems.

Offtopic you guys saw the wins from allies in 1vs1? 3 time 52 % allies faction. poor wehrmacht 44 % lol.
Brits with the highest. But on the other side you don't see brits in 1vs1 Cups, because people know how to counter it.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:19 PMKatitof

Really? I thought of all people on .org, you'd understood that better then anyone else.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:19 PMKatitof

Is this why you personally attack every single person who disagrees with you and do everything in your power to discredit them?

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:19 PMKatitof

Rules for thee but not for me?

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:19 PMKatitof

Every single man is biased, the extend to which he is is the only difference.
To claim self as unbiased is arrogant and ignorant.
This is why not a single person is responsible for balance changes, but a whole team that discusses best solutions from all sides pov.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:11 PMProtos Angelus

I seldom post balancing ideas. Posted one on AEF forum yesterday (??). I shit on the balancing ideas being proposed by some people mostly. Like disguising nerfs as buffs or using "cookie-cutting, in line with" BS. I like the game, don't like majority of people involved in balancing the game. I'm light years away from being good at balancing COH2. I don't play it regularly, nor do I play OST/brits/soviets. I play with soviets and brits VS OST but I don't play as them.

Ok, counted it all out using CTRL-F in Mozilla and it highlights in the scroll all occurances : http://www.companyofheroes.com/leaderboards#profile/steam/76561198046481660/history
Last 40 games:
Soviet: 9
AEF: 1
Brits: 5
Axis: 25 (WGerman 4)

Sturm can balance Germans as much as he wants, but I don't expect him to say anything about USF or Brit balancing

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:14 PMProtos Angelus

I wholeheartedly agree. But those people are in "charge" and 90% of good suggestions will go sidelined because they do not agree with the changes. I mean look at the arguments "Ban Redball if you play allies". People like that should not balance a game.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 12:37 PMSturmpanther

Offtopic you guys saw the wins from allies in 1vs1? 3 time 52 % allies faction. poor wehrmacht 44 % lol.
Brits with the highest. But on the other side you don't see brits in 1vs1 Cups, because people know how to counter it.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:14 PMProtos Angelus

TBH, if there was NDH or Yugoslavia or Croatia in any way shape or form in any game, I'd avoid it like it was the devil. Hate my country. On another note, I do love Germany. Beautiful country ran by a chemist. Also the best tourists, who, unlike the brits, don't litter, curse and yell all the time.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:22 PMKisiel

Ignore everything people in this thread said about what the issues are.
Suggest that top 200 players can't counter mg or kill a tank.
Blame it on matchmaker and red ball express and finish off with "but 1v1 though".

Amazing.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:23 PMleithianz

It's really good to learn why Allies are losing in team battle from the BT.

Thank you, I'll make sure to learn how to destory mg & tanks.

BTW, have you seen my other reply that shows 41.9% win rate of UKF in 1vs1?

Can UKF also gets poor british... from you?

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:26 PMSturmpanther

Great so the random saved 15 games in past from years ago were sadly axis or even wehrmacht. RIP me, you got me indeed...
You know that i have many teams with different people and there i can play okw or soviet or usa or brit too? But yes i look what my mates play and then i fill. Thats why most of the time I end with soviet and wehr, to fill the team with balance.




Makes no sense again, since
- i play all 5 faction in 1vs4 to 4vs4. tho in special number question in 1vs1 i hear more of the others.
- even IF i would be biased it makes still no sense, because we are a team and everyone has the same power of his vote. So its not that i say no nerf to axis and then all the votes from the others are nothing LUL.

And yes there is a difference between unit balancing and map balancing. Some maps are axis favorited, some allies. And then even special for brits or usa depends if its CC or longrange map.
So we can't balance the games based in units for all maps.
Its the same for brits on port of hamburg, brits lack in indirecte fire in early game. So a map, which is mainly only camp and arty is bad. So ban it.
And about this map thing, that is not only my opionion from the BT btw So we all should not balance the game then i guess...

And again about the 90% of good changes get ignored. Come on pls, i think in the 3-4 patches the BT looked often to the people and how they feel. And good changes went in. I think the last unit patch was big success. Never had soo less mimimi and crying after the patch came out.

The only one where i agree is, in 1vs1 i do more the job as observer, since 1vs1 is not my main modus. I am tho around 60-100 when i play active 1vs1...
And then you don't need to play 1vs1 self active from micro skill to understand the game. For example AE has good knowledge about what is op and what is up in 1vs1. Just from casting and using his brain.

It is your right, that you don't like me or think i make mistakes, but keep that for yourself and not bring this into a discussion. And esp. don't spread any lies!

Look how this forum thread changed his topic already...
That is another reason why i most of the time try to avoid to reply on coh2.org forum threads. But i still see them.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:11 PMProtos Angelus

I seldom post balancing ideas. Posted one on AEF forum yesterday (??). I shit on the balancing ideas being proposed by some people mostly. Like disguising nerfs as buffs or using "cookie-cutting, in line with" BS. I like the game, don't like majority of people involved in balancing the game. I'm light years away from being good at balancing COH2. I don't play it regularly, nor do I play OST/brits/soviets. I play with soviets and brits VS OST but I don't play as them.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:11 PMProtos Angelus

Ok, counted it all out using CTRL-F in Mozilla and it highlights in the scroll all occurances : http://www.companyofheroes.com/leaderboards#profile/steam/76561198046481660/history
Last 40 games:
Soviet: 9
AEF: 1
Brits: 5
Axis: 25 (WGerman 4)

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:11 PMProtos Angelus

Sturm can balance Germans as much as he wants, but I don't expect him to say anything about USF or Brit balancing

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:36 PMSturmpanther

I just told the fact, that in ML almost nobody plays brit 1vs1. And if you ask the topplayers they said brit is not playable in 1vs1^^.

IF you ask for MY OPIONION:
I think brit can be strong in 1vs1. But if you make 1 mistakes you have a problem. Also you are kind of onesided from gameplay in 1vs1. So your enemy knows exact what will come and can try to counter it.
Also it depends on which map and which side you play brit.
Also it depends if you play vs wehrmacht or okw.
In automatch everything is random so it's fine.
In cups there is nothing from that.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:36 PMSturmpanther

2. Ok ask yourself, how often do you use smoke?

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:50 PMHannibal

Doesn't matter if you suggest yourself or comment on other people's ideas. You have an opinion about balance and you voice it regularly. I just casually scrolled through your 20 most recent posts and you commented on Falls, Volks and USF units.


One wehrmacht comes from "most played faction". Soviets comes up 11 times for me. The WGerman seems to be bugged out to 4 but is 3. He apparently played 45% as Allies. How is that "WGerman and Wermacht mostly"? Especially if you consider his overall profile, so stop misleading. He plays apparently more Ostheer and less OKW than if it were completely random, also more slightly Soviets and less USF. The rest is COMPLETELY in line.

Wtf does it have to do with Germans? He even has more games as Brits than as OKW despite there being 3 Allied factions.
Nevertheless, if you want to stay consistent with your own logic you should not comment on anything outside of team game USF then, yet you do.


You don't like the balancing people/Sturmpanther and what they do for whatever reason while simultaneously claiming you did not care about balance. I don't mind, I don't like every balance suggestion that has been done either. But at this point you are just projecting some Axis fanboyism into someone where even your own quoted data contradicts what you say. If you don't like the changes despite not caring about balance, then phrase it accordingly. But stop lying about false linkages.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:54 PMSelvy289

The most solid data that I can see from this is the commanders pick rate (or load out rate).

I think that's a good place to look at first before anything else.

Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2021, 13:52 PMleithianz

You do realize that UKF don't have access to smoke unless building "mortar pit" in prior-to tank right?

Or should I use AEC to go front-line and fart some smokes?

Oh, wait.. there was a mortar drop... NVM. Gonna be removed in next patch for some reason.
Wait again, mortar cover from the Commando..? NVM CP8 required.