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Will they address Panzergrens in the new patch?

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Vipper
30 Dec 2020, 19:01 PM
#121
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:00 PMSkysTheLimit

Is it in this thread or not?

I'll ask again, why are you talking about penals. Not just as a matter of staying on topic, but pgrens don't have anywhere near the same drawbacks

You are talking about Penal not me, I am simply responding to your questions. If you do not want to talk about Penal simply do not ask me questions about them.

And no Penal do not have any drawbacks. Penal and PG are both imo "semi elite" infantry if one is available at minute 0 there is little reason for the other not be available at min 4.

(edited)
:)
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blvckdream
30 Dec 2020, 19:03 PM
#122
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:01 PMVipper

And no Penal do not any drawbacks.


Penals do not have any drawbacks? Are you serious? They are the infantry unit with the most drawbacks in all of COH2.
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Vipper
30 Dec 2020, 19:04 PM
#123
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:03 PMblvckdream


Penals do not have any drawbacks? Are you serious? They are the infantry unit with the most drawbacks in all of COH2.

feel free to list them
:)
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blvckdream
30 Dec 2020, 19:05 PM
#124
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:04 PMVipper

feel free to list them


- no access to MG
- no access to AT-gun
- no access to indirect fire
- no access to effective AT
- no regular grenade
- no weapon upgrade
- bad scaling while being heavily outnumbered in the early game

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SkysTheLimit
30 Dec 2020, 19:07 PM
#125
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:01 PMVipper

You are talking about Penal not me.

You can't be serious

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Nov 2020, 10:05 AMVipper

And no Penal do not any drawbacks.

That is objectively not true
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Vipper
30 Dec 2020, 19:09 PM
#126
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:05 PMblvckdream


- no access to MG
- no access to AT-gun
- no access to indirect fire
- no access to effective AT

Those are problems of the building not Penals

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:05 PMblvckdream

- no regular grenade

But the anti building tool that PG do not have.

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:05 PMblvckdream

- no weapon upgrade

Its called PTRS

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:05 PMblvckdream

- bad scaling

They have good vet bonuses that are superior to Panzerfüsilier up to vet 2 and inline with them at vet 3.
:)
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SkysTheLimit
30 Dec 2020, 19:10 PM
#127
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:09 PMVipper

Those are problems of the building not Penals

Lol
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blvckdream
30 Dec 2020, 19:14 PM
#128
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:09 PMVipper

Those are problems of the building not Penals


But the anti building tool that PG do not have.


Its called PTRS


They have good vet bonuses that are superior to Panzerfüsilier up to vet 2 and inline with them at vet 3.


PTRS is not a weapon upgrade, it's a mediocre sidegrade.

Saying all these things are just a problem of the tier building and not Penals themselves is true but I can't build Penals in other tier buildings so what is the point? Penals do have these drawbacks and there is no denying that. Only way to solve them is by going for a doctrine with dhsk/m42. It's simply not possible to get 3 Penals + T2 + Zis/Maxim as you will never have enough MP unless it's a complete noob stomp.
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JohnSmith
30 Dec 2020, 19:17 PM
#129
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Posts: 1273

Vipper, can you please not turn every thread into a Penals rant? I enjoy reading threads about my favourite faction and my favourite Panzergrens units, but then it feels like you're steamrolling with Penals rant in every thread.


jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:05 PMblvckdream

- no access to MG
- no access to AT-gun
- no access to indirect fire
- no access to effective AT


jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:09 PMVipper

Those are problems of the building not Penals


At least explain, don't shut down discussions because you're wrong and blvckdream made a few valid points that challenge your point of view. Honestly, that's probably the densest reply I have ever read in this forum. Especially even worse since you asked the poor fella about it.
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Vipper
30 Dec 2020, 19:18 PM
#130
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:14 PMblvckdream


PTRS is not a weapon upgrade, it's a mediocre sidegrade.

That comment is simply beneath you, you post are usually are much higher quality than that. (I suggest you leave semantic games to another user)

There is nothing wrong with AI DPS of Penals they have good DPS at all ranges.

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:14 PMblvckdream

Saying all these things are just a problem of the tier building and not Penals themselves is true but I can't build Penals in other tier buildings so what is the point? Penals do have these drawbacks and there is no denying that. Only way to solve them is by going for a doctrine with dhsk/m42. It's simply not possible to get 3 Penals + T2 + Zis/Maxim as you will never have enough MP unless it's a complete noob stomp.

The flaw in you logic it that you expect Penals to carry all faction on their shoulders they can not and the should not. Else you would simply have Penal blobs running around the same way you had VG shcreck blobs.

Penal are cost effective unit with no drawbacks, any and all problems with them are related to the design of T1.
:)
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Elaindil
30 Dec 2020, 19:20 PM
#131
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Posts: 97


- no access to MG
- no access to AT-gun
- no access to indirect fire
- no access to effective AT


jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:09 PMVipper

Those are problems of the building not Penals



I am sorry but this just too much:clap:

So do we need to work with buildings now?

Why are you purposely acting so dense? Or you really are?



All of these are problems have to do with going Penals. They don't just puff into existence unlike PG that have none of these drawbacks since it was mentioned.
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Vipper
30 Dec 2020, 19:23 PM
#132
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:20 PMElaindil




I am sorry but this just too much:clap:

So do we need to work with buildings now?

Why are you purposely acting so dense? Or you really are?



All of these are problems have to do with going Penals. They don't just puff into existence unlike PG that have none of these drawbacks since it was mentioned.

Ok ,
so in your opinion Luch has drawback because when you build it you do not get healing in base?
Pak howitzer under-performs because you do not get a HMG with it?

Once more Penal is cost efficient unit.
:)
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Elaindil
30 Dec 2020, 19:34 PM
#133
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Posts: 97

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:23 PMVipper

Ok ,
so in your opinion Luch has drawback because when you build it you do not get healing in base?
Pak howitzer under-performs because you do not get a HMG with it?

Once more Penal is cost efficient unit.


Stick to the topic of Penals and PG without whataboutism and deflecting. Do you consider going penals has none of drawbacks mentioned? Just yes or no will suffice if you don't want to elaborate.
http://www.companyofheroes.com/leaderboards#profile/steam/76561198033143735/standings
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Vipper
30 Dec 2020, 19:38 PM
#134
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:34 PMElaindil


Stick to the topic of Penals and PG without whataboutism and deflecting. Do you consider going penals has none of drawbacks mentioned? Just yes or no will suffice if you don't want to elaborate.

The topic is actually PGs not Penals.

Going T1 has issues because it badly designed. Penal are fine.

A friendly word of advice if you do not like my answers stop asking for my opinion.
:)
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Elaindil
30 Dec 2020, 19:48 PM
#135
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Posts: 97

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:38 PMVipper

The topic is actually PGs not Penals.

Going T1 has issues because it badly designed. Penal are fine.

A friendly word of advice if you do not like my answers stop asking my opinion.


You derailed the topic to penals since post 5 and we all ran with that because Penals are the closest counterpart to PGs.

I've never said I don't like your opinions. I am just confused sometimes by them and curios to get a clarification. Since you are the most active user pushing axis buffs\allies "reworks" it's only natural you get your opinions challenged or discussed.

Like I asked a direct question and you answered very ambiguously
Going T1 has issues because it badly designed. Penal are fine.


I take it going penals does have drawbacks mentioned according to you. Am I correct?
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Vipper
30 Dec 2020, 19:53 PM
#136
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:48 PMElaindil


You derailed the topic to penals since post 5 and we all ran with that because Penals are the closest counterpart to PGs.

I've never said I don't like your opinions. I am just confused sometimes by them and curios to get a clarification. Since you are the most active user pushing axis buffs\allies "reworks" it's only natural you get your opinions challenged or discussed.

That might be the case if you where not being aggressive. We can debate anything you like but there is little reason to do so in an civilized manner.

Comments like this one "I am sorry but this just too much:clap: " are simply non constructive.

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:48 PMElaindil

Like I asked a direct question and you answered very ambiguously


I take it going penals does have drawbacks mentioned according to you. Am I correct?

If ones goes T1 there are drawbacks.
:)
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Elaindil
30 Dec 2020, 19:56 PM
#137
avatar of Elaindil

Posts: 97


So now that we both confirmed that going Penals actually has drawbacks


- no access to MG
- no access to AT-gun
- no access to indirect fire
- no access to effective AT


Does it mean you changed your mind?

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:01 PMVipper


And no Penal do not have any drawbacks.
(edited)

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Vipper
30 Dec 2020, 19:58 PM
#138
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:56 PMElaindil

So now that we both confirmed that going Penals actually has drawbacks



Does it mean you changed your mind?



T1 one has drawbacks regardless if you build a single Penal or not.
:)
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SkysTheLimit
30 Dec 2020, 19:58 PM
#139
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jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:23 PMVipper

Ok ,
so in your opinion Luch has drawback because when you build it you do not get healing in base?
Pak howitzer under-performs because you do not get a HMG with it?

You know damn well that these situations are not analagous

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:58 PMVipper

T1 one has drawbacks regardless if you build a single Penal or not.

You know damn well that nobody would ever build t1 under those circumstances
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Elaindil
30 Dec 2020, 20:01 PM
#140
avatar of Elaindil

Posts: 97

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Dec 2020, 19:58 PMVipper

T1 one has drawbacks regardless if you build a single Penal or not.


When you are saying "T1" do you exclusively mean the building that has been build into existance on the entity of the map in the game of Company of Heroes 2 by the Soviet faction that is on the map?


Do you think we can extrapolate all these drawbacks to all the units in this T1 builidng?
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