Its too cheap.
Should cost 10 Muni atleast.
Doesnt sound like much of a difference, but it will help prevent spamming as the Muni will start to add up, but also increases buildtime meaning it cant be so near instantly built and gives Ost a bit more of a chance to spot them being placed.
In later game when Muni starts rolling in, you can dedicate your CEs to placing these literally everywhere. Sweeping is completely out of the question when for example we are talking about 10 AP mines for a mere 70 Munis, placed all over the place, and guaranteed 1 model death off already numerically small Ost infantry and sometimes more.
Seriously. With this Commander try 2xCEs on dedicated AP mine duty. You literally cant place them fast enough to keep up with Muni income. Its quite hilarious and Ost will rage, hard, when whenever he tries to cap something or pass through a gap, he loses 1/4 of his unit for a mere 7 Muni.
7 muni Anti Personnel mine
10 Dec 2013, 12:31 PM
#101
Posts: 2425
Permanently Banned
10 Dec 2013, 14:16 PM
#102
Posts: 1003
Its too cheap.
Should cost 10 Muni atleast.
Doesnt sound like much of a difference, but it will help prevent spamming as the Muni will start to add up, but also increases buildtime meaning it cant be so near instantly built and gives Ost a bit more of a chance to spot them being placed.
In later game when Muni starts rolling in, you can dedicate your CEs to placing these literally everywhere. Sweeping is completely out of the question when for example we are talking about 10 AP mines for a mere 70 Munis, placed all over the place, and guaranteed 1 model death off already numerically small Ost infantry and sometimes more.
Seriously. With this Commander try 2xCEs on dedicated AP mine duty. You literally cant place them fast enough to keep up with Muni income. Its quite hilarious and Ost will rage, hard, when whenever he tries to cap something or pass through a gap, he loses 1/4 of his unit for a mere 7 Muni.
This commander have only advantage in first 5-10 minutes. Have DSHK and this little mines. No arty, no armor.
Many wermach player only use blob. Simply put engineer in this blob.
I want to have the same chance, to win for each side.
10 Dec 2013, 14:47 PM
#103
Posts: 2425
Permanently Banned
This commander have only advantage in first 5-10 minutes. Have DSHK and this little mines. No arty, no armor.
Many wermach player only use blob. Simply put engineer in this blob.
It doesnt matter that there is no arty/offmap or armor. Vanilla roster provides those just fine.
If you want arty or armor, choose another commander.
With this commander you only have to build T1 and then callin for T2 equivalents.
You are very effective early game and can cripple Ost map control early, whereas otherwise you just tech normally.
10 Dec 2013, 15:15 PM
#104
Posts: 1003
It doesnt matter that there is no arty/offmap or armor. Vanilla roster provides those just fine.
If you want arty or armor, choose another commander.
With this commander you only have to build T1 and then callin for T2 equivalents.
You are very effective early game and can cripple Ost map control early, whereas otherwise you just tech normally.
Yes. And if you nerf his advantage, no one will play this commander.
I want to have the same chance, to win for each side.
10 Dec 2013, 15:51 PM
#105
Posts: 971
Mines at 7 ammo are too good. Combined with Dshk it destroys german early game, but as some people are saying, is the only thing that commander has to offer and nerfing it would make it useless.
While we don't see that ability scrambled with another new commander I think is fine.
While we don't see that ability scrambled with another new commander I think is fine.
10 Dec 2013, 17:44 PM
#106
Posts: 1585 | Subs: 1
Agree with Greeb.
If this commander was given a later game call in in exchange for something, then this mine would immediately need to be increased in cost. In addition, if this mine is ever brought into another commander it will need to be increased in cost.
I think this commander show cases the difficulty of balancing 15 million commanders simultaneously.
If this commander was given a later game call in in exchange for something, then this mine would immediately need to be increased in cost. In addition, if this mine is ever brought into another commander it will need to be increased in cost.
I think this commander show cases the difficulty of balancing 15 million commanders simultaneously.
10 Dec 2013, 18:43 PM
#107
Posts: 604
I think their "size" should be slightly increased to prevent building them too close together, which causes cheap and devastating double-hits. It'd still knock any squad down to a state where they can no longer fight. Currently, when two of these are positioned very closely together, the squad hit by them will bunch up and wiggle around, often triggering the second nearby mine with much greater effect.
Requiring them to be spread out more would prevent this and also reduce the "too spammy" feeling of these mines.
Requiring them to be spread out more would prevent this and also reduce the "too spammy" feeling of these mines.
10 Dec 2013, 18:48 PM
#108
Posts: 2425
Permanently BannedAn increase to 10 Muni would be sufficient.
Its too cheap and fast.
It doesnt matter whether the Commander has an armor callin or not.
That doesnt change the cost effectiveness of this ability in the least.
If you want Commander changes, look at the Ost Defensive Commander, which is a steaming pile of **** in comparison.
Edited to add on Rofls suggestion: I agree, but I fear the coding involved with creating such a placement radius might be difficult. Nonetheless, I agree that stacking/chaining mine detonations should be somehow mitigated.
Its too cheap and fast.
It doesnt matter whether the Commander has an armor callin or not.
That doesnt change the cost effectiveness of this ability in the least.
If you want Commander changes, look at the Ost Defensive Commander, which is a steaming pile of **** in comparison.
Edited to add on Rofls suggestion: I agree, but I fear the coding involved with creating such a placement radius might be difficult. Nonetheless, I agree that stacking/chaining mine detonations should be somehow mitigated.
10 Dec 2013, 19:21 PM
#109
Posts: 337
Well the DHSK just got nerfed pretty heavily, making the commander weaker.
Abilities should NEVER be balanced without taking into account the rest of the commander.
Abilities should NEVER be balanced without taking into account the rest of the commander.
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10 Dec 2013, 21:40 PM
#110
Posts: 688
Well the DHSK just got nerfed pretty heavily, making the commander weaker.
Abilities should NEVER be balanced without taking into account the rest of the commander.
I think that is a valid point.
This commander is piss-poor after the first ~10 minutes.
'There's honour in victory, honour in defeat and honour in just staying alive'.
[Quote from Wings Reel]
[Quote from Wings Reel]
10 Dec 2013, 21:52 PM
#111
Posts: 419
how about a slow recharge, they can stay cheap but you cant wtf spam them in a short time.
10 Dec 2013, 22:06 PM
#112
Posts: 1003
Next uselles Soviet commander? The same think as overnerfed 120mm mortars?
I want to have the same chance, to win for each side.
11 Dec 2013, 09:22 AM
#113
Posts: 688
Dishka appears to have been as well nerfed as delayed.
You could argue that this commander doesn't have much going for it anymore - remembering that its main advantage was exactly the early game.
Seeing that, I don't think the mine nerf is a good idea anymore.
You could argue that this commander doesn't have much going for it anymore - remembering that its main advantage was exactly the early game.
Seeing that, I don't think the mine nerf is a good idea anymore.
'There's honour in victory, honour in defeat and honour in just staying alive'.
[Quote from Wings Reel]
[Quote from Wings Reel]
11 Dec 2013, 09:28 AM
#114
Posts: 2425
Permanently Bannedhow about a slow recharge, they can stay cheap but you cant wtf spam them in a short time.
Yeah, a cooldown would work too. Good suggestion.
11 Dec 2013, 09:28 AM
#115
Posts: 401
The DSHK kept its arc, and suppression. Its damage was already pretty high, and it ignores the armor bonus German Infantry get, so the more elite it is, the more the DSHK ignores their armor.
It should be fine. This just prevents the DSHK from rushing the way MG42s used to be rushed into buildings.
And you can always plant those mines to help.
That said, the rest of the commander could use work. Doesn't seem like the tank traps hold back anything since they can be one shot.
It should be fine. This just prevents the DSHK from rushing the way MG42s used to be rushed into buildings.
And you can always plant those mines to help.
That said, the rest of the commander could use work. Doesn't seem like the tank traps hold back anything since they can be one shot.
11 Dec 2013, 10:05 AM
#116
15 
Posts: 786
So now it doesn't eat FHTs alive?
11 Dec 2013, 17:52 PM
#117
Posts: 2425
Permanently BannedSo now it doesn't eat FHTs alive?
Havent tested, but Im pretty sure AP will still rip a HT/221 to shreds.
11 Dec 2013, 18:38 PM
#118
Posts: 950 | Subs: 1
The DSHK kept its arc, and suppression. Its damage was already pretty high, and it ignores the armor bonus German Infantry get, so the more elite it is, the more the DSHK ignores their armor.
not sure what youre talking about. you think the dshk has penetration? it has 1 pen just like other small arms, unless you use its ability.
So now it doesn't eat FHTs alive?
it used to kill a fht in about 3.75 seconds, now it will take something like 5.1 seconds. thats only when using the AP ability though.
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