Why maxim is trash

The first and only mistake there was buying a Maxim and expecting it to do anything.
Like say stopping a squad from going straight through the center of its cone and throwing a nade at it

The best thing you can do with a Maxim is to gift it to Axis, hoping they'll use it instead of an MG.

What bout shortening the maxims pack up time, keep the set up time the same make it faster to re position.

The first and only mistake there was buying a Maxim and expecting it to do anything.
Like say stopping a squad from going straight through the center of its cone and throwing a nade at it

The best thing you can do with a Maxim is to gift it to Axis, hoping they'll use it instead of an MG.

First allied negative bias specimen. They hurt the community as much as positive bias do, but this kind like to spread missinformation coupled with whines. Interesting subject. Might need more research.

Coincidently i remember some one in the stug vs heavy tanks said something like: Stug is too cheap to counter or deal with heavies. Well i would say now that maxim is too cheap to deal with pgren

This is an example of smartness here. Good job

because his Maxim does:
ratatatatatatatatatatata
and my MG does:
brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.
Seriously, in contrast to the MG the Maxim plays a more aggressive and mobile role, the MG has a strictly defensive role, the horizontal tracking is slow, and the armed is terribly slow, once flanked it has two options the withdrawal or death, however Maxim has a chance to reposition itself. In addition, Maxim is not very indispensable for a Soviet player, but for an Ost player it is vital, the Grens alone are incompetent.

IMO its worth to say that MG42 needs a horizontal traverse speed buff.

IMO its worth to say that MG42 needs a horizontal traverse speed buff.

Nah, the Grens early on are the real issue. MG42 is fine.

What bout shortening the maxims pack up time, keep the set up time the same make it faster to re position.

This is literally how it already works...

Maxim used to have amazing setup and pack-up time, then they nerfed the setup time and kept pack-up the same

Not defending the maxim, I think it’s a PoS, but seriously after they got suppressed and were obviously crawling for a grenade, he should have repositioned the maxim further away to not allow a grenade throw.

Yeah both things can be true. I agree the player could've done better, but with every other MG that wouldve been sufficient

Yes, he should have. Which is exactly why the Maxim is so frustrating if there is light cover, the PGrens should not have been able to throw in the first place. I assume we agree on that.

But to be honest if you reposition your MG you can assume that it should win. I stopped the time: From being suppressed starting the throwing animation was not even 2 seconds. And the time to the grenade exploding were an additional 4,5 seconds. So he had about 3 seconds from supression to ordering the repositioning, otherwise quite a few members will eat the grenade. That's enough time to do it, but when you reposition your MG you usually assume that the enemy squad should be suppressed and stuff like this does not happen. Look away to some other fight for 2 seconds and there is no way to dodge it anymore.

The whole issue in this video arises from the fact that the first model of PGrens was in yellow cover for the first burst of the Maxim. Thereby the squad did also not get suppressed by the short second burst and the PGrens were almost in throwing range by the third burst which finally suppressed. This is just bullshit.

Small correction. The model at which the Maxim aims at, is not receiving any cover. The cover icon appears when half or more of the squad is receiving any kind of cover.

You can deduce at which model it is aiming by how it died a second later.

Small correction. The model at which the Maxim aims at, is not receiving any cover. The cover icon appears when half or more of the squad is receiving any kind of cover.

You can deduce at which model it is aiming by how it died a second later.

It must have gotten light cover I think.
The whole squad got the cover icon, which happens as you said if half of the models are in the respective cover type. I assumed that the two models in light cover were the guy to the bottom and the front model that was targeted. I don't think the two guys in the top left got any cover at all, they're too far out. The bottom and the front one are closer to the slope.

First allied negative bias specimen. They hurt the community as much as positive bias do, but this kind like to spread missinformation coupled with whines. Interesting subject. Might need more research.

Coincidently i remember some one in the stug vs heavy tanks said something like: Stug is too cheap to counter or deal with heavies. Well i would say now that maxim is too cheap to deal with pgren

Common forum warrior, no research required.

I'm not sure if saying "Maxim is garbage" counts as allied bias, since it's pretty much agreed on that's been in a bad spot for a while. I guess saying "M36 is OP" counts as axis bias then? XD

Common forum warrior, no research required.

I'm not sure if saying "Maxim is garbage" counts as allied bias, since it's pretty much agreed on that's been in a bad spot for a while. I guess saying "M36 is OP" counts as axis bias then? XD

"its been in a bad spot" means it is used in every other teamgame? Even some high skilled players did use it 1v1 aswell? In a bad spot means it does its job accordingly, suppressing squads and with correct support and garrison can displace even an MG42?

I think "In a bad spot" means L2P... Overrating the Maxim

Stug is too cheap to counter or deal with heavies. Well i would say now that maxim is too cheap to deal with pgren

Now do the mg42 vs guards troops, rangers, Paras

And how can we compare the difference in price between stug and heavy tank with the difference in price between Maxim and Pgrens? Those numbers aren't even close

Now do the mg42 vs guards troops, rangers, Paras

And how can we compare the difference in price between stug and heavy tank with the difference in price between Maxim and Pgrens? Those numbers aren't even close

Compare first M36 to -instert any vehicle here*

Its simple, you take the MP cost and substract them, you could also take the % of one relative to the another.
You could do all kind of wonky math to compare two units, even those completely unrelated, its a common thing here. You should know already.

Infantry "costs" are two, plain dead simple. Time and MP.

Add. As long as the other unit is on the "boom" side of the stick, you can justify the price difference between any two units. Simpol. MG42 has a faction quirk you should take account into aswell.

Compare first M36 to -instert any vehicle here*

Its simple, you take the MP cost and substract them, you could also take the % of one relative to the another.
You could do all kind of wonky math to compare two units, even those completely unrelated, its a common thing here. You should know already.

Infantry "costs" are two, plain dead simple. Time and MP.

Add. As long as the other unit is on the "boom" side of the stick, you can justify the price difference between any two units. Simpol. MG42 has a faction quirk you should take account into aswell.

It's actually not simple at all, otherwise the Maxim wouldn't have been changed so many times to the point it doesn't even resemble the MG that it was at launch. You can't say something is simple when it's literally been debated since the game was launched by everyone

And "faction quirk" is not a valid argument against what I'm saying. I'm not saying the Maxim should even be as good as mg42. It just shouldn't be this bad while costing the same and requiring fuel to unlock. It makes no sense

The Jackson costs 120mp and 55 fuel more than the Stug, and is unlocked later. This is irrelevant to the thread so I have no idea why you're bringing it up

It's actually not simple at all, otherwise the Maxim wouldn't have been changed so many times to the point it doesn't even resemble the MG that it was at launch. You can't say something is simple when it's literally been debated since the game was launched by everyone

And "faction quirk" is not a valid argument against what I'm saying. I'm not saying the Maxim should even be as good as mg42. It just shouldn't be this bad while costing the same and requiring fuel to unlock. It makes no sense

It is SIMPLE, some people like to complicate things.

Let me enligten you a bit.

(unit type) + MP + Abilities + (Faction quirks) + Time = Cost/Balance ratio

Now replace each part with the correct items.
-Type is a force multiplier. I.e. HMG has 150% efficiency stopping infantry.
-Abilities are all the abilities/upgrades
-Faction quirk is a real property (you ignore it in this case because its about OST and you know well OST is teamweapons oriented), can sometimes be positive/null/negative.
In the case of SU it could be 6 man crew for TW at the cost of 0.75 efficiency.
-Time could be either its rushed time or its average time, those are the limits, it incluse training time of course.

That its, now you do the math while i drink my tea.

Added. Rude of me to not do it myself. We can discard the time but they can be converted into a hidden MP cost (an opportunity cost) to make the example simple enough
A maxim costs in a representative example 100MP (It costs 260 IIRC, i dont memorize sry)
HMG type (150%) + 100 MP + Maxims normal fire means no modifier + "Quirks" (75%) + Time (discarded)

Result. A maxim will reliably counter (100*1.5*1*.75) = 112 MP
It means that at most 112 MP, even being an HMG units have a power ceiling

It is SIMPLE, some people like to complicate things.

Let me enligten you a bit.

(unit type) + MP + Abilities + (Faction quirks) + Time = Cost/Balance ratio

Now replace each part with the correct items.
-Type is a force multiplier. I.e. HMG has 150% efficiency stopping infantry.
-Abilities are all the abilities/upgrades
-Faction quirk is a real property (you ignore it in this case because its about OST and you know well OST is teamweapons oriented), can sometimes be positive/null/negative.
In the case of SU it could be 6 man crew for TW at the cost of 0.75 efficiency.
-Time could be either its rushed time or its average time, those are the limits, it incluse training time of course.

That its, now you do the math while i drink my tea.

You want me to do math with those numbers you just made up? No thanks. .75 effeciency? 150% effectiveness against infantry? Use actual stats about the game please and actually discuss the topic. You barely even mentioned the maxim in that post

You said Maxim was too cheap to deal with pgrens. I gave examples of even more expensive squads that the mg42 can deal with

Yes faction quirk is irrelevant because you're still not even responding to my point... The mg42 should be better than the Maxim. It should just cost a little more or the difference in performance shouldn't be this great. That's it

That claim does not at all conflict with the idea that Ost is a "team weapons faction". Enjoy your tea

You want me to do math with those numbers you just made up? No thanks. .75 effeciency? 150% effectiveness against infantry? Use actual stats about the game please and actually discuss the topic. You barely even mentioned the maxim in that post

You said Maxim was too cheap to deal with pgrens. I gave examples of even more expensive squads that the mg42 can deal with

Yes faction quirk is irrelevant because you're still not even responding to my point... The mg42 should be better than the Maxim. It should just cost a little more or the difference in performance shouldn't be this great. That's it

That claim does not at all conflict with the idea that Ost is a "team weapons faction". Enjoy your tea

I added an example, but those "made up numbers" make more sense than any "maxim trash" sentences.

I actually dont know the force multiplier numbers since i am not a dev, but every game and game design has those.

The OST being a TW based faction can mean their force multiplier are higher. Thats why a HMG42 can deal with *more expensive squads. (Its their thing)

Again simple math. But some other people prefer to remain stupid and scream loud.

I added an example, but those "made up numbers" make more sense than any "maxim trash" sentences.

I actually dont know the force multiplier numbers since i am not a dev, but every game and game design has those.

The OST being a TW based faction can mean their force multiplier are higher.

Again simple math. But some other people prefer to remain stupid and scream loud.

What does any of this have to with my point? You have yet to respond to it despite quoting me numerous times

Thats why a HMG42 can deal with *more expensive squads. (Its their thing)

I never said it shouldn't. It just should cost slightly more than the maxim. 280mp

I never said it shouldn't. It just should cost slightly more than the maxim. 280mp

Nope, you just came up with that.

You dont agree with the ingame force multipliers, i explained the concept only.

It shouldnt be more expensive.