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Why maxim is trash

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24 Feb 2020, 00:06 AM
#61
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1


Nope, you just came up with that.

You dont agree with the ingame force multipliers, not me.


What are you talking about? I said nothing of the sort about force multipliers

Literally the 4th post in the thread:

All I don't understand is why the mg42 and Maxim are same price
24 Feb 2020, 00:16 AM
#62
avatar of distrofio

Posts: 2358



What are you talking about? I said nothing of the sort about force multipliers

Literally the 4th post in the thread:


Then you agree with force multipliers.

Because HMG42 is OST. I said it already. But it seems you missed it.


...MG42 has a faction quirk you should take account into aswell.


Can we stop entangling threads?
24 Feb 2020, 00:21 AM
#63
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1



Because HMG42 is OST. I said it already. But it seems you missed it.


No I didn't. I already addressed this exact point


Yes faction quirk is irrelevant because you're still not even responding to my point... The mg42 should be better than the Maxim. It should just cost a little more or the difference in performance shouldn't be this great. That's it

That claim does not at all conflict with the idea that Ost is a "team weapons faction".


USF is supposed to have the strongest mainline. It does. That mainline is also more expensive than grens, who need a tech building

"Ost is supposed to have the strongest MG" is true. It has nothing to do with whether or not it should be the same price as the maxim, which also needs a tech building
24 Feb 2020, 01:01 AM
#64
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1794

I got an idea, how about a 7 man maxim upgrade?
It keeps the flavor while adding more lasting in battle. Defensive offensive!

24 Feb 2020, 01:46 AM
#65
avatar of CreativeName

Posts: 281

The maxim is in a weird spot, its supression is kinda meh without vet but i dont think it needs a buff.
its rather mediocre performance early on gets compensated by a durable 6man crew, decent damage and a fast set up time. you cant really buff the maxim without taking away its upsides

any buffs for the maxim will result in the old maxim spam meta, which is a scary thought. i guess you could move some of the vet2-3 bonuses to vet1 or vet0 but thats about it but im not even sure thats needed.

24 Feb 2020, 01:57 AM
#66
avatar of Mr Carmine

Posts: 1289

The maxim is in a weird spot, its supression is kinda meh without vet but i dont think it needs a buff.
its rather mediocre performance early on gets compensated by a durable 6man crew, decent damage and a fast set up time. you cant really buff the maxim without taking away its upsides

any buffs for the maxim will result in the old maxim spam meta, which is a scary thought. i guess you could move some of the vet2-3 bonuses to vet1 or vet0 but thats about it but im not even sure thats needed.



The old maxim was op because it was very mobile and supressed a lot faster then now. Its mobility and supression where lowered substationaly in exchange for a larger arc and a price and build time increase.
The deathloop makes the durable 6 men crew quite redundant imo. Its not more survivable then a 4 men mg.

Since they cant fix the deathloop just make it 240mp again. This wont make the maxim spammable just as the 10mp for volks didnt stop okw spamming them. It will still be a worse mg just with a slightly lower price then its much better counterparts.
24 Feb 2020, 02:14 AM
#67
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1794

Yep decrease mp cost or 7 man upgrade seems the best direction to take.

It highlights maxim higher survival/cost for lesser suppression. This maintain the asymmetric nature of mg available in game
24 Feb 2020, 04:16 AM
#68
avatar of C3 TOOTH

Posts: 176

@Mr Carmine
I remember when the I played Soviet in 2014 or so. I hated how Maxim arc is only 60 while MG42 has 120. MG42 was just too much better.

When I got better at the game, I enjoyed how fast Maxim setup time and incredible suppression.

Until Maxim get 90arc and lower pin & longer setup time. It becomes the worst MG.

Old Maxim rewards good players a ton. While newbie cant use it.
24 Feb 2020, 04:42 AM
#69
avatar of distrofio

Posts: 2358



No I didn't. I already IGNORED this exact point


There, fixed it, at least its true now.



USF is supposed to have the strongest mainline. It does. That mainline is also more expensive than grens, who need a tech building

"Ost is supposed to have the strongest MG" is true. It has nothing to do with whether or not it should be the same price as the maxim, which also needs a tech building

I cant get even simpler to make you understand. Strong has nothing to do with costly. An expensive unit is less often spammed. A strong unit secures a game style. Strong TW encourages TW strategies. Strong Mainline encourages its use. Its a core unit. Just that.

It is not hard to understand it if you actually read and comprehend that this is not Age of Empiers.

Tech building is offtopic, it depends on the faction tech tree and limitations. Price does not determine performance. It determines efficiency and abundance.

24 Feb 2020, 05:08 AM
#70
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1


I cant get even simpler to make you understand. Strong has nothing to do with costly. An expensive unit is less often spammed. A strong unit secures a game style. Strong TW encourages TW strategies. Strong Mainline encourages its use. Its a core unit. Just that.


I already understood your point and explained why it has nothing to do with what I'm saying. I'm sorry you can't understand the context and and instead feel like editing my posts to suit your weird narrative about me


Tech building is offtopic, it depends on the faction tech tree and limitations. Price does not determine performance. It determines efficiency and abundance.


You've barely mentioned the topic the entire time. The tech location of the maxim is not offtopic at all, it delays your opening against OKW. Use your numerous posts that were invised earlier if you need help understanding what the word offtopic means

You do realize someone in this thread is suggesting a 7 man maxim right? That is way stronger of a change than what I am proposing... No need to start a meaningless fight again
24 Feb 2020, 05:32 AM
#71
avatar of Kurobane

Posts: 658

Honestly the best way to fix Maxim is to leave it as is and allow it to upgrade into the DHSK later on.
24 Feb 2020, 05:51 AM
#73
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1



The old maxim was op because it was very mobile and supressed a lot faster then now. Its mobility and supression where lowered substationaly in exchange for a larger arc and a price and build time increase.
The deathloop makes the durable 6 men crew quite redundant imo. Its not more survivable then a 4 men mg.

Since they cant fix the deathloop just make it 240mp again. This wont make the maxim spammable just as the 10mp for volks didnt stop okw spamming them. It will still be a worse mg just with a slightly lower price then its much better counterparts.


+1

The difference in price between buying 4 old maxims and 4 new maxims is just 80mp total (20 per). 80mp is not the main reason no one spams them anymore.

That would be their current performance + how much better penals and cons are than they were for most of the maxim spam days

Honestly the best way to fix Maxim is to leave it as is and allow it to upgrade into the DHSK later on.


How would this work? Like an upgrade on the unit itself? Or it replaces Maxim in the building?
24 Feb 2020, 08:45 AM
#74
avatar of Mr Carmine

Posts: 1289

@Mr Carmine
I remember when the I played Soviet in 2014 or so. I hated how Maxim arc is only 60 while MG42 has 120. MG42 was just too much better.

When I got better at the game, I enjoyed how fast Maxim setup time and incredible suppression.

Until Maxim get 90arc and lower pin & longer setup time. It becomes the worst MG.

Old Maxim rewards good players a ton. While newbie cant use it.


The first maxem was mobile but had very low supression in its tiny arc. Most inf just walked out of the arc before anything signifigant happend. The moment its suppression was buffed with no counter balance nerf it became op.

The counter nerf came later in buildtime increase price increase setup time increase supression decrease and wider arc.
24 Feb 2020, 14:38 PM
#80
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3

My Maxim idea is to have it require T3 built before you can build it from T2. That was its timing is pushed back to around 2-3CP and it can be buffed without fear of it being spammed.
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