Thank you for creating this list and taking your time to post here on COH2.org
I hope Relic will read this and investigate those bugs.
...and thanks for your maps :-) |
This is such hard decision.... Do I feed my family this week or pre-order the add-on? Must have those free skins but the uncertainty of knowing just 80% forces me to spend hours and nights voicing my concern... |
I wish there would be more information about OKW out there by now (I am pretty much satisfied with the US game play introduction by Relic) but this is just to squelch my need for instant gratification. I am sure Relic will release more information in the next days and some media outlets will get advanced/exclusive information to publish, too.
But, to me as a customer it does not make a big difference in my decision to buy or not. I have to say, the lack of information made it quite exciting to find out the game mechanics once I buy it - without being influenced by other feedback first. I hope there will be some surprise unit wise (xmas tree effect), something that was not mentioned before or has being discussed to death. I
Also, with this expansion just costing $12 or $20. Personally, I could not care less if I have not all information disclosed before I buy it. From what I have seen, it looks great and the entertainment value will be much better then the 2 beers and 1 burger I could use my money otherwise for...
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As Kolaris explained quite rightly, DLC commanders give more options and strategies to pick.
That's P2W. It doesn't really matter if you actually win or not.
You have an advantatge in terms of units, abilities and strategies available and your enemy who didn't purchase DLC doesn't have.
So, with that logic, every single add-on for CoH was pay to win? From what I remember you could play against Brits, even so you had never bought the add-on. |
Here are my elephants... DLC, Money, Alternatives and Pain
I don't think the current DLC is pay to win. If Relic manages to keep the balance between commanders (and applies patches where needed), it is variety/flavor. I would not mind if all commanders would be offered for free, but that is not going to happen. Also, DLC will not go away. If this is what you are hoping for, I think looking for other games is your best option.
For those hoping for major changes in the core mechanics. How to do you think those changes are financed? From the money you paid in 2013? Most game developers move their staff to new projects, once the game is released. A little core group would work on patches and bug fixes for a certain time and then you could hope for a new expansion in a year or two. If you want to see ongoing changes and content, you need an ongoing money stream. I think DLC is a OK solution to this. It helps finance changes/fixes and new content rolling (Alternatives could be a subscription model or a premium pass thing...none of which I want to see...ever for CoH2).
I am not sure how large Relic is, but lets assume it has currently 20 people working on CoH2. They maybe have an average payroll cost of $50.000 per person/month(I assume this is on the lower side, but it is easier to calculate). This means that Relic has monthly HR expenses of $1.000 000. Add to this: office rent, travel costs, hardware, software, utility, server rental, office supply, take out food, network etc. and divide it by the price of your favorite DLC and you get an idea how much they must sell in order to break even. Sure, they sell also the base game, but I assume mostly during the sales, as those people who really wanted the game, bought in 2013.
In the last 7 month I have seen Relic releasing patches, mostly monthly, adding new features, removing bugs, establishing a Beta and an Alpha test, implementing the Battle Servers (a huge want to have feature) and providing additional content. To say that Relic is not listening or sitting on their hands, is not true. Many requested "competitive features" are not really on my list of want-to-have-instantly. I see good reasoning for them, but they do not affect me and I hope Relic is trying to balance the needs of all player groups well in the coming months.
Speaking of other games. CoH caters to a niche target group: RTS and WW2 fans. Now, CoH2 reduces the target group even further by reducing it to two fractions, of which neither is the obvious "good" side. Both sides offer cool tanks and gear to play with, but not many player will be able to relate to them, as they were able with the American or British. Hence the target group is certainly smaller (Maybe the Battle of the Bulge Add-on will change that ;-) )
I don't think there is any game in the market that can really compete with CoH2 in its segment. This might explain why we see so many people hanging around, providing "feedback", after they returned their game, burned it, un-installed it, gave to the dog or never bought it. There is not just any alternative and they feel betrayed for Relic not giving them vCoH2...or they just experience separation anxiety ;-)
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+4
+7 (including my two kids who play) |
Casual gamers don t like games where they must spend 182.33$ to get the "full" game. This DLCs mess is turning potentially new Players away from this game right from the start. If i would tell my friends about COH 2 i would tell the truth and told them that the "full" game with all DLCs cost about 200$. My friends would think that i must be crazy to play such a "Milking machine" game.
Well, I am casual gamer and I could not care less that one could sent $183 on stuff you do not really need. Why would I need to buy all skins in order to enjoy/play the game? It is not needed, actually the game even rewards you with free skins/commanders for playing. I think most people (who complain about this) have a problem with having a choice and are not able to make up their mind. Do you really need every DLC commander? Some are great and fun to play and add flavor.
TOW content is fun if you like it. Better getting DLC TOW now then to wait 2 years.
I am not sure what you mean with "full game". How did you determine that what was included in the first place and left out in order to milk us? You can say, I would have liked more for my money, but that does not mean that all the DLC content was ready in June 2013 and just not released. I think for current $20 CoH2 is a great value. It was even on sale for $13 in December. That is right in line with going to the movies, once...alone.
Sure, $183 is a lot of money, but I also do not buy every wine I can put my wine glas either. DLC is not a must, but an offer for those who want to spend the money for more content and customization.
How about the community made maps that are free? In other games you have to have a Premium pass or buy new maps, not so here.
I think we should put this in the right perspective. Saying you must spend $200 to enjoy and play the game, is not the truth.
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I won't.
I like the diversity new commanders bring and all of them will eventually get balanced and since I plan to stay in CoH2 for years, I'm not in hurry. No P2W screaming monkey will change that. It took 3 years for vCoH to even start being remotely balanced.
Exactly. New commanders add new flavor to the game, for which I do not have to wait years until released (like a full expansion).
Besides, the new commanders will be released anyway. I would rather not pay and use them :-). CoH2 for the win! |
Thank you for the tool! Great work.
I am sure you have thought about further enhancement and here are just some random thoughts/suggestions:
mouse over: when you hoover your mouse over an ability icon, it increases in size and you can read the details of the ability selected.
Searching for abilities: allows you to select certain abilities you like and based on your selection, all generals that have those abilities will be shown.
Again, thank you for this tool. |
Ciez - the problem is the game - to the majority of players and not the minority which unfortunately you are a part of - it just IS NOT FUN.
...........
Till they make the game enjoyable for the majority - this game is done for.
I am not trying to argue with your opinion, but saying that the majority of players does not enjoy the game, is not a fact you can proof in any way. Sure, you and many friends of yours do not, agreed. But, I can counter and say that many of my friends actually do - which is true.
Your majority most likely is a specific fraction of the those who play CoH2 (e.g. esport/competitive players, who care about their rank/stats/streaks etc.). But for many other paying customers, your problems or fun issues are not the same or have the same priority. Claiming a majority without the statistics means nothing.
Otherwise, I think CieZ made some very valid points - great post. I also agree with DerBaer, that some just do not want to understand what Noun was saying in the first place. |