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Maybe the g43's don't lock out mg42 or atlest lock it out till T4. |
Let me try to explain this once more and then move on because we are drifting off topic.
Each infatry unit in COH 1 had a different number of HP and a different type of armor. The result was mess.
Standardizing HP in COH 2 and having a similar "type of armor" for the majority of infantries is a huge advantage that has improved games mechanics for both the players and for developers.
Creating weapon profiles again was a great improvement helping both the player to get the most out of their units and developers to easier fine tune units.
Actually Relic has claimed that "target tables" that where used in COH 1 where a nightmare to implement/balance and they actually went to extremes to avoid them in COH 2.
I really do not see any advantage in COH 1 infatry system it was unnecessary complicated for both player and developers and that is why COH 2 moved on.
Now can we go back to G43 upgrades?
Once more one has to keep in mind that the upgrade is even named "G43 upgrade" so options for bonuses it can provide is huge.
Each unit had different HP i know that. And that was good cus that didn't mean having 4 men squads was a disadvantage but a tradeoff. But in coh2 having 4 men squad is all disadvantage with no benefit at all.
Yeah I know it's a nightmare to implement coh1 system. If you do even a little bit coding you would know.
I can get back to g43's but that does not mean that system was bad for balance or taxing on the player. |
No actually there was a very good site that explained all different armor type and their interaction with different weapons. With out it one would be at complete loss, and experience would be of litttle help to him...
Really, could you get DevM to pitch in and say he was at a complete loss without those sites.
I didn't memorize or even know what the stats were of things until patch 2.6(I think) of coh1. Like sure, one(you can't say him/he cus girls/women play the game too) would not be able to pick up on some weird out their detail like, regular arty shell did nothing to brit emplacements but flames (Mortar HT and Nebels) absolutely shred them. But Flames did more damage to structures anyway and Brit emplacements were a bitch to kill with anything else. Or the really weird one, skdfz 234's 50mm gun(puma) upgrade would normally make you shit vs infantry but it would make you good vs light vehicles. However vs Brit the upgrade made it good vs both brit LV's and infantry. |
No, I'm saying people don't memorise huge lists of stats. Then they get confused when units don't perform the way they expect them to and post threads on the forums.
You do realize you are making the mistake of people having assumptions before they fully learn a game. Side question: What was it coh1 that you found that didn't line with your expectations???
Maybe at your level. Throughout most of the ladder people support their tanks against flanks and don't roll over several mines at once.
Yes, Right and people don't support their attacks either they just blindly send tanks one by one and hope for the best. Flanking, infantry support, artillery, Recon are all things that don't exist.
CoH 1 used deflection damage, which is something you could add to CoH 2 fairly easily. Bazookas already use it.
The countless individual exceptions Vipper is talking about are present in both CoH 1 and 2. CoH 1 used a lot with infantry.
I think for sake of trying to prove me wrong you forgotten what the point you yourself was trying to make. |
No, they don't. All stats are hidden from the player ingame, leaving them reliant on visual language, vague tooltips and experience to assess the capabilities of units.
And humans are terrible at assessing probability that way. It's why you get so many players ardently convinced the faction they play most is underpowered.
Right coh1 players are all gods who know all the games stats top to bottom without fail. Like even I can tell you what p4's hp was as well as brenguns dps vs KCH at rage 14.
The easiest way? Halve the fire rate of all tank destroyers and quadruple their penetration. Quadruple the frontal armour on all heavy tanks and halve their health.
Tank destroyers remain equally effective against heavies, but are vastly less effective against mediums because of their halved DPS. Mediums can't penetrate heavies from the front, but are twice as effective attacking from the rear.
Congratulations, you just turned tank destroyers into a silver bullet for doctrinal units.
Good job now you've made you heavy tanks useless as will get dominated by mediums who are more agile and
are way more cost effective. + you'v also now made it possible that mines kill your tanks incredibly fast now.
There's also Vipper's method, where you whack the target size on heavies up really high so anything can hit them. You then give Tank Destroyers switchable rounds: high penetration, low accuracy rounds for heavies, and mid-penetration, high accuracy rounds for mediums. Performance against the two classes of vehicle are now separated.
And that's a simpler solution than coh1????? Your contradicting your self. |
Simply read the patch notes about weapons profiles and relative positioning.
The idea simple and allows player to know how to best use their units without having to test and memorize every single engagement. And keep in my that possible combination of much up and ranges are ridiculous high.
Doesn't matter bro people will learn every quirk of a game doesn't matter how wild or unintuitive it may be. When I guy figures it out everybody who is semi serious about the game will. What do you think that coh1 players were uber geniuses. And no one learned the game at all. |
Hardly. It means you have to look up all these little modifiers on the internet. That's bad design, not good.
The ideal is complex interactions from simple rules, not memorising a long list of exceptions.
People may mock Vipper for their unrealistic expections of the Balance Team's resources, but on this they're completely right: mechanical consistency is a very good thing.
Yes, game experience is not a thing at all. How could I have forgotten about the fact people don't learn anything from playing. That mechanics and matchups don't become second nature at what point at all.
You can pretty easily, in several different ways.
They haven't because making a unit that only counter doctrinal heavy tanks is dumb.
No you can't. If i'm wrong please enlighten my ignorant self. I beg of you please provide example cus i'm slow. |
Im thinking maybe axis wil field 8 panthers in 4v4, surely you can do the same with 60td spam. Or you can one up and rush sherman or t34 blob.
But imo no axis team will spend all on panthers since this will leave a big hole on AI in their team. Panther even with pintle sucks in AI
Im just not convinced wehr is op in 4v4 that they need to suffer in 2v2.
Show us the receipts
I think shreck pg blobs might be the culprit. They will melt any armored force in existence, and also can deal with basic infantry in cqc. |
There is nothing to support that claim.
On the other hand it made the game a complete mess where certain units devastated certain units and where useless vs other forcing the player to learn a whole lot of match ups.
The COH2 system is far superior due to simplicity. (It would be even better if there where less deviation from "weapons profiles" and "relative positioning" and if units where balanced for all vet levels).
COH2's system is simpler. But having to learn different matchups is not a bad thing but a good thing. It puts a higher skill ceiling on gameplay.
Here's a problem with COH2's system. You can't make TD be strong vs heavies without beeing oppressing mediums in coh2 but you could in coh1. |
Now if the at inf with snare are actualy as good at alpha damage as shrecks squads this would be a valid point imo.
Axis have a far better chance to bounce allied hh at then allies do vs shrecks. Making the snare on anything above a vetted p4 less effective.
Allied infantry also has a better chance to shred axis infantry too. You wanna have your cake and eat it too. |
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