Profile of Protos Angelus

I don't know. Truth be told, I quite like the USF AT gun. In my view, it's the best. Raketen is cancerous to play against. Again, a bit lower range and all, but the retreat really is cancerous. The number of times 2 raketen were playing the role of a frontline unit, nuking vehicles and then retreating.... rage inducing.

Funnily, it's hard to wipe raketen with small arms but a granade straight up destroys all models. Last game 2x rifles with 2bars were unable to wipe 1 raketen running up to them and then a couple of seconds of retreat, whereas a nade that didn't even hit it well, somehow wiped all models off it.

Doctrine or not, and what the Panther can do or not has no bearing in the design of USF. That design dictates that they are not to have durable armour, instead they have mobile armour that can heal itself.

Every faction pays for their strengths with weaknesses.
Soviet have durable infantry but lack concentrated dps. They are designed to out attrition the enemy.
Ost has small squads but better than average team weapons and high impact squads. They are meant to outperform not out last.
OKW has no caches but has 5 levels of vet, non-doc elite infantry and armour. They are meant to outlast and out fight but not outproduce- nothing they have is "cheap"
Usf is extremely mobile and VERY aggressive. They are meant to lick their wounds quicker than anyone else be back in the fight before their enemy can. They are meant to keep the enemy on the back foot not to outlast them in a slug fest.

USF extremely mobile? In what way? Their tanks are not any faster or more agile than axis counterparts. AT gun does not have any sort of sprint. Pak howi also has agility of a turtle. I mean, USF having an 800 hp/235 armour premium medium with OK penetration and OK AI would not break anything. Especially if you would make the E8 mobile and pricey.
USF Aggressive? Sure, that they are. They don't really have any sort of durability to slug it out.

Using faction traits as an argument is a double edged sword. If you say:
Faction X is Y, then you have to provide the proof of Y and how the proposed change would violate the Y trait.

Hi Von, love your streams.

You know I tried to experiment with the stock AA HT and often compare it to the M3 halftrack. One is 90 muni 30 fuel vs the flat 50 fuel.

The thing does weirdly against things like the 222 where sometimes it just won't fire it's damn flak rounds even when stationary. When the thing WORKS it's actually pretty good but getting the damn thing to work is a nightmare. I won't even touch on it's pathing. I also noticed it only seems to suppress one squad, not a blob, I don't know if that's intentional? I don't think it's flak rounds penetrate a luchs, I never got that far. I tried once but it died so instantly I think I did that much dmg to it.

Then when you use the M3 it's night and day, it turns great, it suppresses a blob, it has killing power. It can actually beat a 222 as well. It loses to a luches obviously.

I like your suggestion since it makes the flak HT at least have some purpose over the M3, it can fight a luchs or equivalent and not risk losing to a 222 just because it decides to not fire or a do a weird jig. It therefore trades raw suppression power for that trade. I don't know if they'd do it however.

Agreed. AA HT actually penetrates the luchs. Problem is, AA HT won't always fire (even when freshly reloaded) the high caliber rounds, even when stationary (like you have written). It does penetrate luchs, so it can scare it away. About the pathing.... lost one yesterday due to it going around in circles xD. I order it to go back by driving forward (I know right..) and instead of just continuing to drive forward and shoot at the back, it decided to spin around 2 times. Probably the movement order got stuck with the auto attack or sth. It's horrible to use. But very rewarding. The suppression is nothing home to write, but still, better than anything

What do you even mean by scaling, by your logic the only scaling for Grenadier is MG42 ?

If we look at pure bonuses from veterancy, USF and SOV mainlines are scaling way way WAY better than their axis counterparts and Infantry Sections build on to an insane base value.

And finally, if Grens and Volks are being "upgraded" to Obers and PGrens, so are Concripts to Guards and Shocks, Infantry Sections to Bren Commandos and Rifleman to Paras and Rangers.

If we look at weapons, both UKF and USF can field double guns on their units, which combined with better "veterancy bonus" infantry makes them basically elite infantry. And yes, in team games USF infantry is supported too with its SOV allys Katyusha or UKF Off-map barage.

Commandos and paras and shocks and guards are stock...
I'm not talking about veterancy scaling. Neither am I talking about pure mainline scaling.
If looking at mainlines only. Yes, allies win here (with exception to conscripts until 7th man).
However, in teamgames, you'll see a lot of builds which deviate from the usual 1v1 builds.

Eg: Most of the builds I've seen playing vs OST are: double MG42s with double pios. Light vehicle and then 3-4 PGrens.
OKW: Sturmpios, kubel and then one volk squad into vehicles and then 2-3 ober squads.

In 1v1 such builds would usually end up with a loss before minute 15 due to severe lack of map control. But in 3v3+, that's really not an issue.

In the later stages of the game, in teamgames, most infantry engagements are long range. Nobody is stupid enough to go through no cover zone to reach the enemy squad, when there are plenty of killing machines that can stop that halt and bleed you. Nobody can deny that Axis are dominant in long range engagements. It even says in the unit description.

So basically rifles sh** on volks and grens in early stages of the game, but once the game progresses and BARs further amplify the short-medium range firepower, the Obers pretty much eat vet3 rifles, unless they have to close in (eg, you're behind cover and obers don't have any cover to get behind)
Conscripts are weird, not gonna comment the weird scaling of that unit. Pretty sh** until 7th man, then they shine.
IS dominate early on on long range, lose short. Brens do give them the edge long range, even vs Obers but don't really have anything to follow up with. Also have a power spike with 5 man.

Of course, if doctrines are picked, then the situations shifts a bit, depending which elite unit you get (if you get any at all).

Fussies are also in a weird position, but are doctrinal so not gonna comment.


In all the games I've played with USF, if I've won, it's been in first 20 minutes of the game most of the time. As the game progresses you find it more difficult to deal with the obers/PGrens. Even if you go trading with them, a werfer will displace you (or stuka). If you try to do the same with a pak howi, good luck. Not to mention how rifles are quite bad in snaring (due to the long animation, and God forbid the snaring unit is killed, the animation starts over).

I'm not denying that the ally infantry is strong. It is. Allies have stronger mainline infantry that is more versatile, which is exemplified in 1v1s where it's quite important. But in 3v3+, mainlines are not your bread and butter which win the game, only to cap. Elite squads shred infantry, mainline or two cap, while tanks battle it out with support from rocket arty.

Axis is stronger because of one reason only: They can blob efficiently.
PGrens or obers into grens/volks blobs can't really be punished by anyone except Soviets. Non doctrinal at least. I used to love punishing such blobs with AA HT + 2xpak howi but ever since the nerf, you can really feel the damage drop and the lower kill count on the paks.
Good OKW players can also A-move raketen behind the blobs because of the retreat, so you don't really risk anything. Anyone with half a brain will stuka/werfer known MG/AT positions before advancing.

Can USF deal with an AT wall on maps like Redball? With calliope. Yes. Without one: never. The best thing USF brings to the table are the huge smoke dispensers called Scotts. Sure their autofire range is low and the AOE is low and they really don't stop any blobs, but holy smokes can they saturate an area with smoke, denying super heavies (unless the axis player likes micro to ground attack through smoke).
Point is. Yes, axis are less micro intensive and overall stronger due to the late game units they have, but with proper teamplay, allies are pretty fun to play. USF that brings a jackson + scotts can greatly complement Soviet's katy + [literally anything].
Brits can bring Comets to amplify the flanking pushes + a firefly (in my opinion, the best TD).

Sure the infantry scaling is in Axis favor, same with the tank scaling but that doesn't mean allies are hopeless. Axis have the brutal firepower (damage+armour), allies have versatility (3 factions) and range.
Besides, playing 4v4 is really a fools choice. 800 population worth of units = artyfests + tankspams + more artyfests.

Besides some braindead balance changes in last patch (and current commanders), the overall balance is quite well made. If you ask me, removing maps like Redball, Ettelbruck, Hamburger, Angermunde, Essen would go long ways of improving the balance.