Great post and a lot of thoughtful changes suggested.
It does seem odd that rather than a gradual stepping down of supposedly OP units, Relic overdoes things and then steps them back up to get the right balance.
In both the case of the commando dps and Churchill armour it seems like they need to reduce the changes by 50% to get the right balance.
With these balance previews, do they read the responses here and adjust them before they put the patch live or is it pretty much a done deal?
It is also a shame that they don't appear to be acting on any other complaints players have expressed about the shortcomings of the British with regard to the deep flaws with their emplacements, which are supposed to be a mainstay of their faction.
I don't actually like the Commando glider call in as it stands - in the original CoH game it was a straight decent to the landing point, so you could choose to land behind it away from the enemy to keep their presence hidden. But now it circles the battlefield before landing so you might as well have a neon sign pop up to your opponents announcing that the commandoes are coming so they can prepare their counters.
Thanks for the feedback  2 patches ago they did do balance changes based on feedback but in the end, we got the OP volks incend nade when it was impossible to dodge and would fry your squad in seconds. Then they released another patch without balance preview and we got the lovely OP PaK and LeIG along with the vet stacking bugs on vickers, shermans, tigers and brit tanks. The last time I remember Relic not breaking the game or messing up balance was the very first couple of preview tests which went rather well and looked like they were picking up their game. However, it's been a steep downward slope after that especially after the whole broken game during the OCF qualifiers... |
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Here's my feedback on the balance patch, these are all opinions from 1v1/2v2/3v3 inhouse games with friends:
Centaur: Feels like it's in a good place now, can still wreck infantry but isn't over the top like before.
Flame damage vs garrisons: Feels better as well
Flame vehicles: WASP buff is great, was not performing with a 90 muni cost before with 6 dmg. Croc dmg nerf is justified though new armour value isn't (see churchills below)
Air Superiority: Nerfed wrong values... needs a 25-50% less damage vs emplacements, especially OKW trucks since they can be 1 shot with this ability. You really should be punished if you keep ANY unit in the AoE of this 320 Muni ability. Nerfing the AoE radius of the bombs still wont fix the problems most people had with this ability.
Heavy Artillery: 25% dmg nerf to buildings is an unnecessary change. Artillery already is underwhelming IMO due to its accuracy, only useful with anvil upgrade. If you let an IS or a 50 cal sniper get in range of your production trucks and buildings for an arty call in, you should be punished for it.
Pack Howi and LeIG: New firing arc is nice but barrage nerf is not. Players should be rewarded for a skillful barrages on blobs. IMO should have more suppression during barrages and should be the only time these guns pin squads. Guns should also pin if squads already suppressed by MGs. The role these weapons should have is to suppress approaching squads in the open which was what they were achieving in the past. Revert stats to pre-OP stats of both guns, buff barrages and keep the higher firing arc. I would also like to see them remove the auto turning and firing to make this unit more micro intensive.
IS section reinforce: Seems like a nice change. I feel like now I can have more than 2 IS squads if I wish to play an inf heavy game without being harshly punished by reinforcing.
Commandos Sten guns: Way overnerfed, If you want to keep them at this performance then their initial call in has to be cheaper in both the vanguard and commando regiment. 500/540+350MP is WAY too much for a squad which need heavy micro to use aggressively (moving them from cover to cover to get close to squads). Not to mention IR halftracks reveal stealth units and prevent them from using ambush bonus which makes them pretty much useless now. It's a nice dynamic how vanguard glider is defensive while commando glider is offensive and can disrupt a defensive line of team weapons. However, spending 500 MP to aggressively deploy a glider which will definitely take damage and lose it's reinforce ability on landing or during the engagement only for the squad to not have much shock value and bleed models on a well placed call in is disappointing. Here are my proposed changes 1) Change fire rate to 22 and keep MP costs 2) Keep nerfed stats, Reduce all MP of all glider call ins. P.S Also need to add their light gammon bomb needs to be on the level of Axis bundle nades. It seems like they do more damage than any nade in the game.
Churchill Tanks: Overnerfed, feels like Relic is unsure what role they want these tanks to fill, here are the choices I would make for it. 1) Make it a non-RNG dmg sponge which keeps the 1600HP, which needs 2 AT shots before fausted and changes the armour to 200. 2) A more 'standard' heavy tank with a mix of good armour (240-280) and decent HP (1400). As for the croc and AVRE variant, I believe they should have less HP and slightly less armour than normal Churchills. Also should add the defensive nades need to have same stats as mills bomb nades. Right now tank nades AoE seems huge.
Forward Assemblies: I'm surprised people aren't mentioning how easy it is to destroy these. One CAS AT strafe will kill it at full health which means a 120 Muni trade for a 400 (450?) MP if the retreat point has been bought. Needs either a 50% health buff and the Brace ability or a significant health buff of around 100-200%.
Other balance suggestions:
Volksgrenadiers: These units have always been garbage... Give them old grenade back and a choice between AI/AT upgrade with an increased manpower price (OKW already float MP). Give incendiary nades to Sturms and remove stun nade.
UKF Trenches: Seem really hard for AT guns and Shrecks to hit. Not sure if they are bugged but currently it's incredible hard to kill a trench without flame weapons. Needs received accuracy stats checked.
USF AT gun: Needs way more penetration, is underwhelming with standard shots vs P4s and is terrible vs late game heavies rarely penning panthers or tigers even with AP round. Either bring it to similar stats as british AT gun and remove AP rounds or slightly buff penetration and make AP rounds 15 munis.
UKF emplacements: Still take too much dmg vs fire, another tone down would be nice to make emplacements viable.
Building fires: Buildings take too to be burnt down by hand held flamethrowers, used to be a viable tactic to burn down buildings close to your support weapons to stop infiltration from sneaking in behind your lines. Now on any brick buildings it takes way too long.
Jacksons: Honestly, this TD just feels like it's in such an odd place... Right now M10s are a no brainer over this tank (watch Romeo's recent cast of Jesulin vs Luvnest where 4 M10s killed a tiger ace with PaK support) since you can swarm enemy armour with it's 80 fuel cost (and OP crush ofc which should be looked at). E8s are a much safer late game choice as well since they fill both the AT and AI role. I honestly feel this tank needs one of either more speed, health, range or penetration. It still doesn't seem to reliably pen a KT from the front without AP rounds on and especially now that heavies have more range, it's a lot harder to use safely. IMO increasing the fuel cost, range and pen would probably be the best change for this unit. Also should mention this unit feels like a reactionary unit more than anything in 1v1s as standard M4 shermans are usually a better choice with their new pen buff.
Lend Lease M5 Half Track: Still gets reinforce with AA upgrade, should be removed.
USF Mechanized Company Half Track: Needs stats to be brought in line with other half track variants ability. Also, could be reduced by 1 CP with a price decrease as it comes in way too late and is not worth the cost.
Infantry Sections construction: Do not receive debuff while building trenches or sandbags, debuff should be added.
USF 50 cal: Weapon crew gets decrewed way too quickly by infantry fire, needs the received accuracy modifier removed.
Grenadier stun nade: Remove unable to retreat bug.
WM sniper: Add chance to miss with incendiary shot on retreating squads
50 cal Sniper: I could be wrong, but this sniper seems a lot more accurate vs retreating squads. Should have the same miss chance as other snipers.
USF Recon Company (ROFL Company?): Whole thing needs to be revised, only useful unit are the I&R Pathfinders (not too much of a priority IMO)
That's all I can think of right now, I've probably forgotten a couple of things which I will add later after testing the patch more. |
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