Profile of Stormless

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Offline United Kingdom
Posts: 762 | Subs: 4

General Information
Last Visit Time: 24 Sep 2023, 13:47 PM
Broadcast: https://www.twitch.tv/Stormless
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/StormlessUK
Twitter: https://twitter.com/StormlessUK
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/user/StormlessUK
Steam: 76561198033828058
Birthday: 1990-11-22
Nationality:

United Kingdom
Timezone: Europe/London
Game Name: Stormless

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Thread: An open letter to the CoHmmunity about rebroadcasting4 Apr 2018, 16:57 PM Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2018, 16:43 PMLago Is the ad revenue large enough to be a significant factor? Ad revenue is fairly small to be honest. I am more focused on arguing the principles that you shouldn't try to make money off the back of others hard work. It's a message to anyone who is reading this that we're asking you to be considerate and that your contribution to the scene can be as little as allowing people to reap rewards from their work whether it's viewership, exclusive live casting, follows donations or ad revenue etc. Just because it is Hans' full-time job to make money from Company of Heroes, it is not an excuse to use his status to overrun people's events and claim that he's contributing. Just because Hans is a long time member of this community he does not have the right to take a s*** on people who put hard work into providing tournament opportunities and watchable content for this community. This wasn't my event and I'm not running the 2v2 cup. But if anyone thinks I will let someone take a dump on our community and members like this, friend or otherwise, they are mistaken. In: Lobby
Thread: An open letter to the CoHmmunity about rebroadcasting4 Apr 2018, 16:50 PM Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2018, 15:21 PMAronin The fault does not lie solely with HelpingHans. All that said, I also believe Stormless and the other organisers/casters had a way to attempt a more peaceable resolution to this than posting it on the CoH2 forums. The post may have been more justified if they attempted a personal conversation with HelpingHans first. I don't know whether this happened... It would reassure me if it did. If Hans still refused to admit the error with integrity then I believe this post is entirely justified. Thanks for your post. I'm genuinely sorry that this has caused any diminished love for a streamer and tbh, that actually sucks to read. With the best of luck, this is just a bad reaction to something I have no doubt is embarrassing, and to be honest with you this isn't fun for me to have to do this to someone I've considered an IRL friend for 3-4 years. Myself and the other organisers in our committee (I'm not actually running this event) messaged Hans over Facebook and Steam during the stream. It was receiving this message to stop casting that provoked Hans to speak publicly on his stream about us in what I consider a disrespectful way (i.e claiming our content is rubbish compared to his). I sent a short and quite sharp message to him afterwards too on Sunday which I haven't heard back from. I did call him something rude because he's a friend of mine and I was annoyed. But I was still hoping he would come back to me to argue a point. In: Lobby
Thread: An open letter to the CoHmmunity about rebroadcasting4 Apr 2018, 14:27 PM Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2018, 14:12 PMLago The community opinion doesn't make much of a difference because the community can't really do much about it. Even if this thread were a chorus of agreement (and it mostly is) the only people with the ability to do anything about it here are the tournament organizers and the people who want to stream tournament matches. I think the community is important because reading this discussion and understand how people feel about this gives the community more of an idea of how this kind of thing affects Tournament Organisers. There may be people who were not involved in this directly but may consider streaming this way in the future and hopefully, this would deter that kind of thing. It's also a matter of consensus because we are not able to convey as a minority that such behaviour is controversial and frowned upon. As a community with enough voices, we can speak out and build a general understand of behaviour that results in the happiness of everyone rather than a few people. In: Lobby
Thread: An open letter to the CoHmmunity about rebroadcasting4 Apr 2018, 13:49 PM Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2018, 13:35 PMTenshiCoH At this stage you're just beating a dead horse. James fucked up, and doubling down on his position is a really bad PR-move but he owned up and apologized for the direct re-streaming. I fail to see the use of this over just PMing James again, talking to him after the actual stream had concluded and be like "Hey man, that's a dick move, can you not?". Having an actual conversation with James would have been so much more constructive, as I'm sure you know this Dan, considering the fact that both you and I have had different opinions about topic X that we've voiced to James and he's been willing to listen. But I did actually message James during the event. We all did this as friends in private. He read those messages and decided to make a public statement about how fed up he was and how our content wasn't good enough to compete with his. I also messaged him after the event with the clip I have linked in my post. Granted I did make a short sharp comment about my thoughts on it which may not have been constructive. But those private messages have been read and then completely ignored since Sunday. I'm only stating this because I don't want people to think that I have just decided to publicly shame someone I considered a friend to me for no reason. I'm very comfortable in the way that we have handled this and I think that if James had either stopped streaming when asked by his friends or just made an apology after realising how upset it's made us then there would be no need to discuss this. But if this behaviour is genuinely accepted and validated (By any community of any size or value) then I think that's worth a discussion and in the future we'll make sure we protect ourselves from this happening for our own personal happiness rather than relying on the decency of others. In: Lobby
Thread: An open letter to the CoHmmunity about rebroadcasting4 Apr 2018, 13:22 PM Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2018, 13:12 PMLago I think we need to be realistic here. As far as I am aware, there are presently no rules from Twitch or Relic against streaming and casting other people's matches, be it from saved replays or Observer Mode. As it stands if someone's determined to parallel cast a tournament match neither Relic nor Twitch is going to stop them. In my original post I copied a section from Twitch's T&C's which states that you can not rebroadcast unauthorized material that doesn't belong to you. This was in relation to Hans casting from AE's stream rather than in-game. With regards to observing an open and available game this isn't illegal or against Twitch rules, but it is wrong we feel both morally and on a level of decency. That is mainly what the post is about. Discussing whether as a community we find this acceptable and want it to continue, or whether we should implement sanctions and stricter rules In: Lobby
Thread: An open letter to the CoHmmunity about rebroadcasting4 Apr 2018, 13:19 PM Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2018, 13:04 PMshadowwada You should have mentioned in the OP that there was a statement prohibiting rebroadcasts prior to the event as that gives you more authority since there wasn't ambiguity. Hans is a long standing member of the community and, to the best of my knowledge, your friend so handling this misunderstanding in private or a more magnanimous public post would be better than dog pilling on hans. As for the morality around casting games through the client, I mainly talked about the legality of it. Sure, you can say it is a crappy thing to do when the official stream is going on but it can be argued having more casts of the tourny games improves hype and will lead people to the official stream. As i pointed out before, Hans is a full time variety streamer so a good portion of viewers may not know about the tourney. Thanks for being civil about this. I do just want to clear some things up and respond to some points I've included above. 1. Yes, I should have included this in the original post and apologise for not including this information. 2. Yes, I would say that Hans is a personal friend of mine (IRL/whatever). Myself and others did contact Hans on Facebook and Steam during his stream to ask that he stopped because it was disrespectful (we thought). It was after Hans read this that he made the speech on his stream, and that is why I wrote a public letter. 3. I agree with you that having more streams and covering all games is good. It's also cooler for the community and I don't dispute this. I would certainly want to know that we as organisers had more control over who was doing this though, especially when it's a streamer who commands such a following on Twitch and can disrupt viewership on someone else's channel. So I do agree with this general point about more streams etc. But I would say that they did already have 2 streams covering the matches already so there was no need for Hans to create a copy broadcast of content that was already running. I do think that TO's should be able to control that. In: Lobby
Thread: An open letter to the CoHmmunity about rebroadcasting4 Apr 2018, 13:05 PM Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2018, 12:58 PMd0ggY how come we can't pull on the same string and make something even greater out of this ? :< this is becoming sad. This is a good discussion to have. I wouldn't say that nothing good is going to come out of this because we as organisers are speaking out about how we feel about this. The most important thing is that instead of this 'unspoken code of conduct' we have opened a debate so everyone can have their say about it. Following all the points here. Rules will be updated, guidelines will be established and sanctions created to ensure that situations like this are clear cut when someone breaks the rules. Tournament organisers, casters and players have had a great and functional relationship for years without actually establishing any written guidelines. If we can't all agree on what is morally right or wrong, then we now have to make that clear to people. There will still be people who break rules and try to shun the work we are doing in the community. But at least when that happens, we can unite against it In: Lobby
Thread: An open letter to the CoHmmunity about rebroadcasting4 Apr 2018, 12:34 PM Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2018, 12:33 PMA_E You literally kicked up an even bigger stink than this, when this exact thing happened to your tournament. You must have amnesia. Is this when Devlish broadcast Kreatir's event without asking and Kreatir quit the community and left the scene? In: Lobby
Thread: An open letter to the CoHmmunity about rebroadcasting4 Apr 2018, 12:20 PM Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2018, 11:24 AMshadowwada Hans is under no obligation to do so. If the official broadcasters didn't prohibit restreaming beforehand, it is considered fair game. Streaming the Tournament We would appreciate it if you do not stream our tournament, so that we can attract as many viewers for the official stream as possible. Consider it a donation to the tournament. ^ This is was written on the UTT tournament page originally by a close friend of James. Someone who was a 3 year sub to Hans... You can do your own morales on that and if you believe Hans made a valuable contribution to the the community then fine. Also how is it not wrong? It's the same concept as going to a boxing match and livestreaming the event to Twitch. It's not your content. It is factual unauthorised broadcasting. You don't need to make your own moral judgements about this. It is written on the Twitch terms of conduct so that you don't have to guess what is right and what is wrong. Hans didn't even bother to observe the game he actually opened AE's stream to cast from it. For someone who's entire income is based around Twitch I would have thought stepping into this territory might be considered risky. It might be worth reading those guidelines. With regards to donations, streamers make money from advertising revenue, subs and donations. All things that could have been denied. Tournament Organisers have a right to schedule and run their own event. I'm fully aware we can't stop people broadcasting it. But it's written in the rules and it's about a level of human decency which is what this post is about. Any of you could be streaming this event. But most people and players don't because they have the concensus on what is morally right and wrong to do. Stream 1v1 or another game. Don't s*** all over your friends and people who put on tournaments for you to play in. In: Lobby
Thread: An open letter to the CoHmmunity about rebroadcasting4 Apr 2018, 09:29 AM Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2018, 09:27 AMMetalacil But you violate the rule by slandeirng someone openly? thats against TOS + making thw twitch TOS use to threat peopel is not allowed by the same TOS. I made very careful consideration not to mention Hans by name or slander him at all in my post. The post was not about Hans but about behaviour from streamers during tournaments. Hans clips were used as an example situationally and I did not threaten him directly. If I was unreasonable and an angry person... I probably would have just reported the video and had his channel taken down. In: Lobby