Still worth investing time and energy into COH2?

So, I guess to sum all this up and bring it back 'round, I wanted to ask y'all if you think it's even worth sticking with and continuing to learn COH2, or if it's just not worth the effort of investing the time... ?

Seeing as you already have doubt about sticking to this game, you should apply the golden rule; when in doubt, don't. Go and find yourself a game you actually enjoy playing.

I'm not sure you read my post very thoroughly. I *do* enjoy the game. A lot. My concerns are mostly

1. Many "veteran" players constantly bash Relic and are incredibly negative about the game, which I see as a deterrent to new players. I want/need an active community to keep the matchmaking working so I don't end up facing players much better or worse than myself
2. If the game is indeed dying, then I don't see much point in continuing to attempt to learn and improve.

I really enjoy the actual game play, factions etc

if you are reliant on others to have an opinion for you, choose one to follow and then abide by it

I'm not sure you read my post very thoroughly. I *do* enjoy the game. A lot. My concerns are mostly

1. Many "veteran" players constantly bash Relic and are incredibly negative about the game, which I see as a deterrent to new players. I want/need an active community to keep the matchmaking working so I don't end up facing players much better or worse than myself
2. If the game is indeed dying, then I don't see much point in continuing to attempt to learn and improve.

I really enjoy the actual game play, factions etc

My opinion is that this is only a transition phase, especially in regards to "veterans".
CoH2 has its issues for sure, but it also has a lot of potential and is something that will evolve over time.

I think a big reason for much of the negativity and crying by veterans is that they compare CoH2 too much to CoH1. Don't get me wrong of course its a sequal and should be compared to its prequel, but i think many people overextend this comparison by going down into too many details.

While CoH2 is a sequel to CoH1, at the same time it is a new game. Some people seem to have expected CoH2 to be CoH1 with better graphics without any new design elements. Now CoH2 has many new elements which you may like or not. But some people just don't want to get out of their comfort zone or have an open mind to new stuff, thus thes cry about how CoH1 is so much better at this and this compared to CoH2.

...

Long story short. CoH2 is a different game than CoH1. In the transition phase some veterans from CoH1 will drift away or go back to CoH1 and while doing so they're quite vocal. After some time the guys who like the game will stay and new veterans will evolve.
Its been the same for CoH1 with its expansions.

If you like the game, stay with it. It's far from being dead.

I don't think I've ever bashed CoH2. I'm still here, I still care about the game, I still spend time improving this site and trying to help Relic improve the game. It's just a simple matter of not enjoying the game enough to invest what little free time I have into improving myself as a player. I hate playing competitive games if I can't (or am not motivated to) take the time to play at a high level. Winning is fun for me, so if I can't motivate myself to focus and improve, I don't want to waste my time.

That doesn't mean a time won't ever come where I decide the effort is worth it. I came to vCoH 3 years after its release, and it took me 2 years after that to find the motivation to really improve as a player. I'm disappointed that Relic has, in my opinion, taken a step back from what made vCoH great with CoH2, and I'm worried about things like commanders, but I'm still optimistic. If I wasn't, I wouldn't be here.

Thanks all

So, I guess to sum all this up and bring it back 'round, I wanted to ask y'all if you think it's even worth sticking with and continuing to learn COH2, or if it's just not worth the effort of investing the time... ?

Sadly yes there is not much players atm and 1v1 is quite boring. I still find 2v2 pretty much fun tho. Maybe SNF will bring some new and old players again.

One thing that you have to consider is that the majority of the people that play the game and enjoy it are not active members of the community. IMO This game is just as good as vCoH was on launch if not better. I think that a lot of people who have been playing the game since the vCoH were expecting the same game again (which is kind of ironic since a lot of people complain that the game wasn't as "revolutionary" as the first).

Along with a lot of responses you've gotten to this post I'll say that if you like the game then continue to play it. I usually overlook the "negativity" regarding the game as a vocal minority. Granted the game is not without it's problems, but I think this one will have a lasting community, I mean there is already a sponsored tournament, pretty sure that didn't happen a few months after the release of vCoH.

Sadly yes there is not much players atm and 1v1 is quite boring. I still find 2v2 pretty much fun tho. Maybe SNF will bring some new and old players again.

Boring is subjective. I find 1v1 to be more stressful and therefore play more 2v2, but I certainly don't find it boring.

No matter how much bad stuff we say about the game, very few of us would still be here if we genuinely thought this game has nothing worthwhile, either in its current form or potentially in the future or whatever. Doubly so for staff members. If I thought CoH 2 were a lost cause I wouldn't be on these forums in the first place, nor would Inverse or any of the other vets who are always complaining.

Well, here's my take on the game:

I play it a lot, despite the fact I absolutely despise the current meta, the patches come out a bit too slowly for my taste, and the game / mechanics seem a bit dumbed down from vcoh.

Why do I play a lot? Because I want to give feedback anyway I can, I see the game having a lot of potential. I could see it being better than vcoh at some point. If the game ends up not getting balanced and fine tuned in a way that would make it more fun, then I'll stop playing.

I will say that I believe every patch has been in the right direction (in my opinion of course). Things seem pretty good and although I don't find the factions balanced (because of one or two glaringly obvious abilities / cheesey strats that both sides can perform depending on timing) I can see and hope that they'll be fixed. There are a lot of things that have been promised and hopefully coming and if relic delivers, yea, I think this game will be worth playing in the long run.

Ineverse:

I don't personally fine CoH2 worth investing the effort I put into vCoH,

You: 'This is exactly the sort of negativity that has me considering my future with COH2, or at least with COH2.org"

Did you consider that twisting other peoples words is rude and negativity, far greater than what you perceive the negativity?

Leaving bits out makes him look negative, and you some sort of saint

vCoH didn't peak until many years after its release. In its current form, I don't personally fine CoH2 worth investing the effort I put into vCoH, but there's nothing stopping the game from improving and changing my mind.

But when you read it like this, it makes you look like a little troll and him as reasonable person with fair and rational opinion which in no way is negative like you tried to make it

Play nice, if you want sympathy

This thread sounds like a plea to end community negativity.

I remember reading an article about how Heart of the Swarm threatens to end many Star Craft 2 Professional gamers' careers because it's too much of a change for them to adapt. I get a similar feeling with some hardcore vCoh players. They have grown so used to playing a specific sort of game that any change that causes them to lose their edge frustrates them. It's natural to have a player base like this and it does not bother me personally to see such negativity. Part of the reason why these players are so vocal is because they want developers to reintroduce the mechanics that gave them their edge from the previous game.

I don't think you should worry about this group, but your general concern about lowering numbers in players is legitimate. I predict this game will have a solid, yet small community of core diehard players and that will be the base for the long term life of this game. You could argue that quality interaction is superior to quantity and for that reason I don't mind such a future for this game.

There is a difference between just bashing the game and criticizing it so that hopefully it will be improved. That said I'm not interested in continuing playing with the current DLC commander model. Just over 3 months ago I paid $100, I'm not going to spend more to continue playing. Sure you don't need to buy the newer commanders, but this is a strategy game we are talking about and when a good portion of players (that probably have less total money invested in the game) have more units and abilities its a terrible model both competitively and ethically.

I really dont get the argument "if you dont like it, why are you here". Those of us who think that COH2 is a step down compared to vCOH, but still voice our oppinions, obviously wants the game to be better, and contribute with our oppinions on how it hopefully will be.

Parallell to this thread we are discussing Tactical placement and manouevering vs micro, in another thread, and hopefully that is something that will be looke at as well. The flanking mechanics of MGs was, in my oppinion, broken for the first months, untill Relic made them more voulnerable to flanking, excactly like in vCOH, after massive feedback.

We are here because we see potential and wants the game to be even better than vCOH.

people are still having second thoughts, please wait for the new patches, i believe they make the game so much better

Boring is subjective. I find 1v1 to be more stressful and therefore play more 2v2, but I certainly don't find it boring.

Yes this is your opinion and you are right , its more stressful to play 1v1 than 2v2 agree. I compare it much to vCOH where i loved 1v1 and i got great feeling after long match. I dont know why but i cant get that feeling with coh2. There is just something missing. Maybe its only me, maybe im too old and tired to get excited ^^

Having played vcoh (mostly 3vs3 or 4vs4) since it's early beginning i can say that Coh2 have a lot of potential. Considering that it come after one of the best rts of all time: Vcoh and after one of the best game of all time: COHO, it's still a nice success.

What it need to be greater and the greatest of all :

-More balance; (it's coming nicely)
-Better networking in larger games; (hope it's coming)
-A lot more new maps; (also coming)
-Less random in all aspects;(hope it's coming)
-A powerful world builder; (also coming)
-New faction addons : The US, the brits.,etc(i'm sure it will come)
-Better lobby and matchmaking (hope it's coming)
-Leaderboard (i'm sure it will come)(Even if coh2.org has a great one )

I wish coh2 a great future. We need this game to succeed !!!

Having played vcoh (mostly 3vs3 or 4vs4) since it's early beginning i can say that Coh2 have a lot of potential. Considering that it come after one of the best rts of all time: Vcoh and after one of the best game of all time: COHO, it's still a nice success.

What it need to be greater and the greatest of all :

-More balance; (it's coming nicely)
-Better networking in larger games; (hope it's coming)
-A lot more new maps; (also coming)
-Less random in all aspects;(hope it's coming)
-A powerful world builder; (also coming)
-New faction addons : The US, the brits.,etc(i'm sure it will come)
-Better lobby and matchmaking (hope it's coming)
-Leaderboard (i'm sure it will come)(Even if coh2.org has a great one )

I wish coh2 a great future. We need this game to succeed !!!

Nice list, totally agree on all points. I keep play vCoh for now

I think most of people's frustrations come from the nature of pre-ordering the game. Many people who preordered were probably the hardcore, hardline players of vCoH that hadn't fallen by the wayside over the years. A CoH game taking place on the eastern front with truesight, vaulting, snow, and ice were what were probably on most minds.

Come beta, the game felt very much like that, but there were tentative issues with some of the features that seemed as if they were simplified or removed from the core of vCoH both gameplay wise and online game-wise: Linear commander choices instead of doctrines, the whole bulletins thing, no fixed start locations on maps, no custom lobbies, no random faction choice, to name some. And this is placing all balancing issues aside (especially as far as competitive gameplay goes). The reality that it was only in beta kept spirits high for the game: these will be resolved by release. None of them were, and the only real changes that occurred in multiplayer between beta to release were minor balancing of artillery stats and Flame HT reload rate.

And since release nothing has changed for multiplayer beyond minor tweaking of unit stats, and the introduction of paid DLC commanders (a continuation of a game feature that's been dubious from the start.) Very few maps have been made since release, and those that were were clones of maps that were already from vCoH. There's been continuous and extensive development for the single player side of the game, but it's my guess that very few people who preordered the game were that interested in singleplayer gameplay. And the number of people who preordered appears to have been no small number, considering SEGA sued Valve for almost a million dollars of preorder assets back in July.

Maybe I'm feeling extra cynical because I've been wishing the Worldbuilder would be released and Relic is officially streaming their office all playing DoW with each other right now, all the while thinking about how CoH2 was almost never released due to THQ's bankruptcy.