KV1 and Churchill can take too much damage

basically not what is expected for latest non doc tank, and from one which needs to close up on super heavies imo

Look

I dom't know why you think production year has anything to do with game balance, but please quit citing it being the 'latest' as if that means jack before you give us all an aneurism.

It just makes you sound like a rampant wehraboo more concerned with the super panther being Ubermensch Mächtiger Gott Panzer than the game.

Not saying it has to be true, but arguing from a point of 'but the panther was the latest tank and I expect it to pwn' is a terrible look


Anyway, this is all off topic, really.



Brick units take damage bexause that is their literal purpose, more at 11.

You could give the Panther zero rear armour and a Sherman still won't kill it with max range rear armour shots unless the Panther player is afk.

Because a competent Panther player isn't going to leave it there for 30 seconds.

Same reasons why elefant can't hard counter a Churchill as hard, since competent players dont leave it and elefant cant chase unlike say Jackson.

But if we reduce stray shots, it helps

Hell if wehr bro can replace elefant call in with jackson buildable, then Churchill and kv tanks, you won't see a topic on them, lol

Look

I dom't know why you think production year has anything to do with game balance, but please quit citing it being the 'latest' as if that means jack before you give us all an aneurism.

It just makes you sound like a rampant wehraboo more concerned with the super panther being Ubermensch Mächtiger Gott Panzer than the game.

Not saying it has to be true, but arguing from a point of 'but the panther was the latest tank and I expect it to pwn' is a terrible look


Anyway, this is all off topic, really.



Brick units take damage bexause that is their literal purpose, more at 11.

What no, im talking about in game getting a panther out. My impression say it's the latest to come out.

What no, im talking about in game getting a panther out. My impression say it's the latest to come out.

Ah.

Well, my unreserved apologies for misunderstanding that.

Guns

OKW PzIV
Accuracy near 0.05
Accuracy mid 0.0375
Accuracy far 0.025
Penetration near 125
Penetration mid 115
Penetration far 110
ROF 5.75

vet 3
Accuracy near 0.05
Accuracy mid 0.0375
Accuracy far 0.025
Penetration near 125
Penetration mid 115
Penetration far 110
ROF 4.1

KV-1
Accuracy near 0.05
Accuracy mid 0.0375
Accuracy far 0.025
Penetration near 120
Penetration mid 100
Penetration far 80
ROF 5.75

vet 3
Accuracy near 0.05
Accuracy mid 0.0375
Accuracy far 0.025
Penetration near 120
Penetration mid 100
Penetration far 80
ROF 3.3


Churchill

Accuracy near 0.05
Accuracy mid 0.0375
Accuracy far 0.025
Penetration near 135
Penetration mid 120
Penetration far 105
ROF 6.8


Vet 2
Accuracy near 0.05
Accuracy mid 0.0375
Accuracy far 0.025
Penetration near 135
Penetration mid 120
Penetration far 105
ROF 4.8

PzIV chance to penetrate Front/rear

KV-1 46%/43%/41% rear 76%/70%/67%
Churchill 52%/48%/46% rear 69%/64%/61%

KV-1 chance to penetrate front rear OKW PzIV
51%/43%/34% 100%/100%/89%

Churchill chance to penetrate front rear OKW PzIV
58%/51%/45% 100%/100%/100%

Is that KV1 RoF value correct ?

Is that KV1 RoF value correct ?

According to Cruzz the vet 3 yes the vet 0 was just corrected.

This isn't a proposal to balance the Churchill.

This is a request to totally replace it with a completely different unit with a completely different role because you don't like the fact a meatshield unit exists.

Besides which, the brits already have a command tank commander doctrinal ability. They don't need a weird command tank in hammer overlapping with it.

We are in the COH2 Balance root thread. So any thread from now on has concern about balance.
Actually it is not me who dislikes the brick tank design, IIRC a couple patches ago, KV1 was useless because it was a "XP sponge" and now we are talking that they are somewhere in between proper heavy tanks and XP bricks. Somewhere between a low skill useless tank and a high skill rewarding tool.
As far as i am concered, i like good game variety and mechanics. If you want to keep the churchill as it is, its gun is overperfoming for what a sponge tank is.
It also does not deserve to have free out of jail smoke, for the same reasons panzer tactician ruins tank gameplay.

The commander was a suggestion to give heavy tanks a unique role, as churchills also are field presence tanks, i was fit to suggest that idea.

Brits are no longer a UP faction, forgotten in a dark corner anymore, to have half i-win-button tanks, half unreasonably tough survival nondoc tank hybrid, even for UKF fanbois standards. As i said earlier its a noob tank, upgun it and it will become the apocalypse tank from RA2