It becomes available way too late to be relevant anymore. Now I know why I’ve never seen the dreaded panic puma in like months.
OKW’s puma is available after a similar amount of fuel expenditure as making ost t2, so IMO the bp2 requirement could totally be removed. Just some food for thought.
Why does ost puma require battle phase 2?
7 Apr 2019, 15:58 PM
#1
Posts: 3053
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7 Apr 2019, 16:00 PM
#2
Posts: 155
The death of the Ostheer puma is kind of sad, instead of making it part of teching it should have just come at 4-5CP or and be build-able from T0. The reason it was so heavily used before was because it was a call-in without tech requirement though.
7 Apr 2019, 16:01 PM
#3
Posts: 1593 | Subs: 1
Bringing back Puma would result in a buff for Ost, so no way.
7 Apr 2019, 16:02 PM
#4
Posts: 528 | Subs: 1
Remove command p4, add call in puma back. Both in the same doc are broken.
7 Apr 2019, 16:09 PM
#5
Posts: 3053
Remove command p4, add call in puma back. Both in the same doc are broken.
Yeah that whole doctrine is kind of wack. I used it this morning because I wanted a puma but was sorely disappointed. It was available about 5 mins after his AAHT appeared. I legitimately would have been better off making 3 222s. And why I would want ostruppen at 3cp is beyond me.
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7 Apr 2019, 16:18 PM
#6
Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1
I don't know how you can fix puma accessibility. Maybe make it require t2 building AND a CP level? Because just t2 is too early, but battlephase 3 is too late
7 Apr 2019, 17:17 PM
#7
Posts: 155
I don't know how you can fix puma accessibility. Maybe make it require t2 building AND a CP level? Because just t2 is too early, but battlephase 3 is too late
Like I said, this can be fixed easily by removing the call-in, making it build-able at 4CP or something. It would make its timing right around the time allied LV come out.
7 Apr 2019, 17:54 PM
#8
Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6
Like I said, this can be fixed easily by removing the call-in, making it build-able at 4CP or something. It would make its timing right around the time allied LV come out.
Nah, that'd be weird since no other call-in unit works like that.
I think in hindsight the wrong unit was nerfed. The problem of Mobile Defense was that it offered both AT and AI vehicles without having to tech but IMO the Puma wasn't the core of the problem: the Command Panzer IV was. I think the Puma should return to a 5CP call-in and the Command Panzer IV should be put in T3 as a buildable 0CP doctrinal unit.
Puma becoming viable again might help Ostheer do a lot better in the current meta.
7 Apr 2019, 18:07 PM
#9
Posts: 378
Because it was the only way everybody was playing ostheer, so if you make it a call-in again it will become the sole meta.
T34 85 needs to have slightly less AI. It's shells are basically on par with Sherman HE yet it does everything.
7 Apr 2019, 18:40 PM
#10
Posts: 4183 | Subs: 4
You could change around the fuel price of BP2. It is 90 fuel after all, and it's hefty. That could easily be shifted to tech structures.
7 Apr 2019, 18:42 PM
#11
Posts: 3260
You could change around the fuel price of BP2. It is 90 fuel after all, and it's hefty. That could easily be shifted to tech structures.
It was very deliberately loaded on BP2 to make the T3/T4 fork softer.
7 Apr 2019, 18:51 PM
#12
Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1
Like I said, this can be fixed easily by removing the call-in, making it build-able at 4CP or something. It would make its timing right around the time allied LV come out.
Woops I missed that line in your post my b
7 Apr 2019, 19:39 PM
#13
Posts: 833
Nah, that'd be weird since no other call-in unit works like that.
I think in hindsight the wrong unit was nerfed. The problem of Mobile Defense was that it offered both AT and AI vehicles without having to tech but IMO the Puma wasn't the core of the problem: the Command Panzer IV was. I think the Puma should return to a 5CP call-in and the Command Panzer IV should be put in T3 as a buildable 0CP doctrinal unit.
Puma becoming viable again might help Ostheer do a lot better in the current meta.
Puma was removed from call in because of "panic puma" cheese. Eg you pull off a good dive to take out a sniper in base with your damaged Stuart or something.
Bang he clicks the puma button and it instantly appeared in the base ruining all of the good play with brain-dead panic button.
Basically just the threat of mobile defence in an opposition's load out made going anywhere near the base with a LV scary. This is also why M10 was moved to t4
Let's unite the CoH2 community and make sure racism is
8 Apr 2019, 03:01 AM
#14
Posts: 1890 | Subs: 1
Main problem is that the fuel difference between StuG and Puma is so minimal that if you are going to tech BP2 then you might as well just stall for the extra 25 fuel to get StuG. Honestly I think the best way to make Puma work would be to make it side tech from Tier 2 like AEC and just cost it appropriately so that going for Puma is a conscious and deliberate decision to counter T70 and the likes.
8 Apr 2019, 08:19 AM
#15
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
Honestly I think the best way to make Puma work would be to make it side tech from Tier 2 like AEC and just cost it appropriately so that going for Puma is a conscious and deliberate decision to counter T70 and the likes.
This.
8 Apr 2019, 11:51 AM
#16
Posts: 3260
Main problem is that the fuel difference between StuG and Puma is so minimal that if you are going to tech BP2 then you might as well just stall for the extra 25 fuel to get StuG. Honestly I think the best way to make Puma work would be to make it side tech from Tier 2 like AEC and just cost it appropriately so that going for Puma is a conscious and deliberate decision to counter T70 and the likes.
I used to think the same, but the casemate StuG is awful against T-70s. It's like trying to use a Raketenwerfer against one.
When you're comparing 320 MP 70 FU (I think>) for a Puma to 540 FU 150 FU for a Support Armor Korps and the P4, it holds up more favourably.
Mostly though you use Mobile Defence to skip T3 entirely. Puma, Command P4, Battle Phase 3, Panther.
Decent counter to IS-2 stalls.
8 Apr 2019, 12:41 PM
#17
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
The problem was with the commander not with puma.
8 Apr 2019, 13:15 PM
#18
Posts: 503 | Subs: 1
Bringing back Puma would result in a buff for Ost, so no way.
Agreed. We should only have 4 viable factions at any one time. Previous patch, Brits were rubbish, the one before that was USF, and some time before that it was OKW, so it's Ostheer's turn to languish in the rubbish zone now.
God forbid we make all factions viable!
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