[UKF] Lets talk about the churchill crocodile.

I guess we should nerf the crocodile into obscurity, I know it's a lot to ask for axis to try and use flanking, landmines, or tactics.

We all know those were never used in the war, only by allies.

You want to know a great tactic? Here is one: When the enemy makes a tank, use an AT gun.
But guess what? Crocodile hard-counters AT guns most effectively out of all the tanks in-game.
Nerfing solely the damage against Paks and Rakettens, while keeping everything else, would be fair.

You want to know a great tactic? Here is one: When the enemy makes a tank, use an AT gun.
But guess what? Crocodile hard-counters AT guns most effectively out of all the tanks in-game.
Nerfing solely the damage against Paks and Rakettens, while keeping everything else, would be fair.

Cause nobody this patch has been using the brumbar in the same manner.

Crocodile is a late game heavy tank for the british, you should require more than just some AT guns to fight it. By then you should have some toys of your own.

It was batshit OP last patch. It's simply in the "incredibly strong" category now that the damage has been reduced significantly. Last patch it could face-melt raketens before they even fired once.

People often talk about countering the Croc in isolation, forgetting that it will come along with a FF and the best Allied AT gun. Fausting the Croc used to be a deathwish, lol. I've had a Vet 5 full health Volks die before the faust even got fired. It's far harder to counter than some of you are claiming it to be.

I'm not sure Elephants or Jagtigers have much of an issue with it... but I mean I only see those every team game so what do I know?

Again, is this ..1v1.. or big team games where balance gets thrown out the window?

The amount of residual flames it leaves behind every burst is kind of ridiculous IMO.

To me that's what's a struggle to handle. The croc just sets the whole field on fire.

Do we have a comparison chart for the flamer weapons? I know the Croc, Wasp, and Flamer Halftrakk all seem to have a very similiar aoe affeft of their flamers.

No, I'm not saying these light vehicles compare directly, as obviously a Croc can do some serious work given its a tank. But I'm not familiar with the stats of these 3 flamer weapons, but visually they appear the same to me when I play.


The croc seems like a break through tank, it clobbers AT guns and it can soak up some damage. Take that away, and it's just going to be a gimmicky flanker like the Kv-8 which doesn't see much action due to pathing issues w/ large tanks.

You have to get to the 32 range of the PAK to hit it with flames. That is 2-3 PAK shots before it even damages the weapon. 1-2 more before Croc kills the ATG. 2 PAKs counter the crocodile.

It is the heavy tank which is designed to counter infantry, it can still penetrate PIV from time to time, but it is absolutely useless against tank destroyers due to the range, and Panther+ due to the low main weapon penetration.

If you have Croc + Firefly + 2 ATG attacking, you can still counter the 50 popcap group with 2 ATGs as long as you have a spotter, or better, a volks/grens to faust it when it gets hit two times.

Most of you guys are missing the point, it is next to impossible to counter brit late game with croc.

Firefly + 2 AT guns will keep any armor in check, ofc jagdtiger and elephant are the ways to go but good luck getting those in the field in time before the game is over. Now you would think, ok he has a lot of AT capabilities so I'll make a bit more infantry and try to flank them and all that good stuff, guess what? 3 infantry sections with bolster squad + double vickers or bren guns will just reck any infantry you get, they don't even need cover (just attack ground to victory). But now you think ok, how do I keep the blob in check? alright some hmg's and/or flak emplacements, guess what? the double AT guns and firefly will reck the emplacements and the blob just recks any hmg. And just to top all of that you have the croc that, if I am not mistaken, still has the double damage from its flamethrower (heard it on propagandacast) that just kills your AT guns + hmg's + infantry in seconds. So tell me how one is supposed to counter this?

The only solution I see for the croc is to remove the autofire from the flamethrower and make one ability that sets and area on fire, kind of like the incendiary artillery barrage ability for soviets but it would be the croc that has to get there and set things on fire. If this wouldn't prove enough it would be a good idea to reduce it's movement speed a little, right now it moves too fast and can avoid fausts with ease.

Most of you guys are missing the point, it is next to impossible to counter brit late game with croc.

Firefly + 2 AT guns will keep any armor in check, ofc jagdtiger and elephant are the ways to go but good luck getting those in the field in time before the game is over. Now you would think, ok he has a lot of AT capabilities so I'll make a bit more infantry and try to flank them and all that good stuff, guess what? 3 infantry sections with bolster squad + double vickers or bren guns will just reck any infantry you get, they don't even need cover (just attack ground to victory). But now you think ok, how do I keep the blob in check? alright some hmg's and/or flak emplacements, guess what? the double AT guns and firefly will reck the emplacements and the blob just recks any hmg. And just to top all of that you have the croc that, if I am not mistaken, still has the double damage from its flamethrower (heard it on propagandacast) that just kills your AT guns + hmg's + infantry in seconds. So tell me how one is supposed to counter this?

The only solution I see for the croc is to remove the autofire from the flamethrower and make one ability that sets and area on fire, kind of like the incendiary artillery barrage ability for soviets but it would be the croc that has to get there and set things on fire. If this wouldn't prove enough it would be a good idea to reduce it's movement speed a little, right now it moves too fast and can avoid fausts with ease.

So we'd make the croc the only vehicle that has an on-use ability to set something on fire. I disagree, there's a lot more ways to approach this situation than nerfing the Croc.

But in the situation you've described, it just sounds like you've lost. You didn't pressure him enough, if he has a firefly, 2 AT guns, a Croc, and a bunch of Bren brits going around. You've lost, you should of hammered him harder so he didnt have this luxury to come at you.

Also, you can lay a landmine, 1 landmine pretty much cripples this entire assault as you seem to think it's all centered around this Crocodile doing work and whiping infantry instantly....

Got any replays? I never see the croc kill instantly in seconds like you're stating. It does work vs AT guns because they count as green cover, which all flamers excel at...

Cause nobody this patch has been using the brumbar in the same manner.

If the flamethrower is as strong as it is why not make it an ability instead of it being constantly putting the entire map on fire? You are, kinda, comparing the croc with a brumbar that to be accurate needs to attack ground which requires more micro and skill than the croc, not to mention that the brumbar doesnt even have the armor/health of a croc to tank AT guns before trying to kill them. The right comparison would be with the Kv-8. With the kv-8 you can't fire both the flamethrower and the main gun at the same time and that on it's own makes the kv-8 a lot more balanced than the croc so why can't the croc have an ability to spit flames like the kv-8 has an ability to switch weapons?

Next time I come against a croc I'll post here the replay, meanwhile if anyone has a relevant replay please feel free to post it.

Everybody who say the croc is fine need to adjust his biased look at this game

You have to get to the 32 range of the PAK to hit it with flames. That is 2-3 PAK shots before it even damages the weapon. 1-2 more before Croc kills the ATG. 2 PAKs counter the crocodile.

Or it just kills one, inflicting bleed that OST cant keep up with and just retreats since it has come out ahead.

Also 7 shots doing 160 damage does 1120 damage and each shot only has an 80% chance of penning so thats more like 980. Not enough to kill it.