Ostheer infantry scaling

yeah....where is the early counter on OKW side vs MG spam?

Only brits have T0 MGs in the Allied side, plus OKW has Sturms to flank and Kubel to spot mgs without getting surpressed and send back to base, the issue lies with buildings that overwatch areas of the map that allow strong MGs to single handedly stall entire enemy blobs on their lonesome.

Only brits have T0 MGs in the Allied side, plus OKW has Sturms to flank and Kubel to spot mgs without getting surpressed and send back to base, the issue lies with buildings that overwatch areas of the map that allow strong MGs to single handedly stall entire enemy blobs on their lonesome.

This.

OKW lacks garison counters not mg counters

This.

OKW lacks garison counters not mg counters

Well, that's what the WBP changes to the Flak Halftrack and Luchs are meant to address... just not for the first many minutes of any given match, where OKW will continue to be locked in base.

This.

OKW lacks garison counters not mg counters

OKW also lacks an early EFFECTIVE suppression platform that can deal with the hordes of infantry you face.

This thread is about OH infantry scaling not OKW vs garrison/MG spam

This thread is about OH infantry scaling not OKW vs garrison/MG spam

Yeah well since I derail threads almost daily, I have given up on hating on people derailing my threads, I simply join them now.

This thread is about OH infantry scaling not OKW vs garrison/MG spam

I don't think Wehr deserves to have the strongest infantry and the best support weapons tbh.

Wehr has the weakest infantry, and a pretty mixed bag of support weapons. OH Mortar is alright but of course overshadowed by the US mortar and the highly micro-intensive UK mortar pit, while the 42 is better than the 34 but arguably worse than any other machinegun in overall utility and suppression capability. The one "support" unit where OH genuinely shines is the sniper...

It's still ridiculous just how little damage the MG42 deals.

The wider arc of fire isn't really that much of an advantage at all given the way most of the maps are designed.

Though all in all, number crunching needs to wait until the total failure on Relic's part in designing the model spacing is finally fixed after TWO AND A HALF YEARS this month.

My estimation is that once the spacing is standardized, it'll become even more evident just how disadvantageous 4-man squads are, at which point we'll probably need to wait another year for something to change in that regard.

Ost weapons teams should cost and reinforce as fast as osttruppen. Now osttruppen doc is a must if you want to rely on heavy weapon team tactic.

I think (in my limited, humble opinion) that the thing about ost is that support weapons by themselves suck, and ost infantry by themselves suck, but they are designed to fill each other's gaps and weaknesses and be played together. In a way, that makes ost harder than a lot of other factions, especially WFA, because they don't have access to some do-all badass unit, but have a bunch of tools to use in tandem with each other to get the job done. I think the wbp is a step in the right direction for ost, but they still shouldn't have infantry on the levels of riflemen or tommies. They could be cheaper to reinforce though imo (maybe 26-27; in between volks and brit and usf infantry).

IMO, the problems aren't with OST, just some super over performing or unfair situations that occur when fighting Brit/USF.

Once over performance is addressed on certain key issues probably you will see less issues.

Your text..

Loopdloop has the right concept, although I would say that all support weapons bar maybe the maxim are useless on their own. OST is the combined arms faction after all, they require their units to work in tandem to get the best results, hence why so many are specialized.

OST infantry aren't supposed to suck, but they are meant to be somewhat limited in exchange for the large roster of vehicles and high quality support weapons. As the mod team has stated, the OST infantry are the gold-standard for balance.

Currently the reason that OST infantry suffer isn't the fact that overall they are too weak (except maybe grens early damage output, they do nothing to disocurage flanking rifles and penals from breaking cover and rushing them into close range when protecting somthing like an mg)its the other elements of the faction they work with/protect that fail to properly support them in turn.

Their support weapons are consistently wiped by the likes of the far too potent indirect fire options available to mainly the WFA, watch a matchup of SOV vs OST and its easy to see why OST is on far better terms as SOV indirect is mainly area denial through their innacurate mortars and high scatter katy. OST weapon teams are forced to relocate under that fire whereas the LM, calliope, mortar pit, USF mortar and pack howi all simply wipe them beofore they can pack up, meaning that the other team either steals/destroys the weapon, prevents any vet from accumalating on the team and prevents it redeploying and keeping the grens/p-grens supported against the more powerful enemy infantry/tanks.

The other problem is that overall (stug excluded, as he kinda overperforms and is basically the faction crutch) is that most OST tanks underperform, the Ostwind is really unreliable and so squishy, the P4 sub-standard for its price and is easily outclassed by its equivalents, the Panther is a relic left over from the vanilla gameplay, the Brumbar is again arguably unreliable (unless one understands how to use attack ground, as then its a heavy micro beast).

So without proper support elements, the OST infantry will keep consistently losing engagements until these problems are adressed, they aren't supposed to work standalone and that reflects in their smaller size and more limited abilities compared to say rifles. Hell if the Ostwind was up to scratch, I imagine the infantry engagements would be far less one sided if OST had something reliable to counter the mid-game infantry when they gain their weapon upgrades and begin stomping on the OST infantry and overwhelming their mgs.

Having less entities is an disadvantage and one has to acknowledge that. The best Ostheer infantry are Osttruppen although they have the largest target (1.25) than any other infantry.

That does not necessarily mean that Ostheer need an extra entity but WFA need to be toned down.

Actually all units that come before minute 1 should be balanced one vs the other as it was done in the September Patch.

This.

OKW lacks garison counters not mg counters

Incendiary grenade?

Incendiary grenade?

in a 1v1 situation with maxim spam, only having an incendiary grenade isn't enough.

Incendiary grenade?

Incendiary grenade requires a tech truck to have finished setting up.

Rushing just for incendiary nades means always going medic truck. This gives a soviet maxim spammer pretty good reliability that their t70 will be unchallenged by Pumas and that their maxims won't be overrun by Luchs.

Incendiary grenade?

Incendiary greande is rather expensive. Paying 30 munnition each time you need to lure HMG from building isn´t best thing to do. Thats why are infiltration grenades so popular.

Having normal light artillery piece that is worse against units in the open and not sucking against buildings is needed.

Or indoctrinal flamethrower.

UKF has this same issue, hence that´s why mobile assult doc is so popular