Tiger Ace not viable

You did enjoy the vanilla factions tho?

Cons spam/Maxim Spam into call ins

MG42 that didn't suppress, sniper dies when looking at it, Pzgren being trash, etc etc.

Ost vs USSR has always been the most balanced matchup. Since I've always enjoyed Ost the most, and now you get mostly USF and UKF to play vs it's just not enjoyable.

Ost vs USSR has always been the most balanced matchup. Since I've always enjoyed Ost the most, and now you get mostly USF and UKF to play vs it's just not enjoyable.

balanced in a way of call ins and some other stupid shit like 9 conscript into ISU, or guard motor.

You might as well play vCoH for US Wehr matchup, at least wehrmacht was not completely hopeless against indirect fire spam and actually have cheap infantry.

balanced in a way of call ins and some other stupid shit like 9 conscript into ISU, or guard motor.

You might as well play vCoH for US Wehr matchup, at least wehrmacht was not completely hopeless against indirect fire spam and actually have cheap infantry.

It's better than playing vs emplacement spam cancer/land mattress/rifle blob to Pershing/Calliope.

You did enjoy the vanilla factions tho?

Cons spam/Maxim Spam into call ins

MG42 that didn't suppress, sniper dies when looking at it, Pzgren being trash, etc etc.

The first few patches of COH2 were the most enjoyable for 1v1 play. Back when T34 ram was kinda OP but backfired badly when dodged, back when Pzgrens took a shit on HTD scripts, back when you would actually see the Ostheer vs Soviet sniper matchup, back when there was T34 vs Pz4 or P4s flanking SU85s every game. 1v1 was actually fun then, now I just play it every now because I like competition more than the game itself.

I think it's in an ok space.

The sight buff makes more of a difference than you guys are letting on.

It's not something you can attack move and be successful with.

It still needs to be supported, thank God it's not a one man army like it was at it's release.

Yeah, right! Can you pass the joint please?

To all the fellow members who say that TA is bad or not viable:

Who do you play against? I mean, come on guys.
If you play against an equal skilled player and you are slightly winning, then he pulls the Ace out and the advantage is automatically on his side (Especially if you play as USF).
The Ace has so much AI and AT power. The ROF is insane, or am i wrong here? I don't think so.
And don't forget the rest of the abilities of this commander.

P.S. If you thing and say that the Ace is not good, why i keep seeing him in every "high ranked" players Loadout? I guess they are fooling them selfs (NOT).

I can see your point, but you definitely can't see mine. By the time TA arrive, you should have allready won, if USF. If not, TA or not you will most probably lose. My point is that this unit has no point if it's no "ACE". There is virtualy no difference between a 3 level xp Tiger and TA. That was not the intended concept and that's the whole point: you lose income but you get a crack unit. I fail to understand why people can't see but the advantages that bother them, without considering the whole picture. Just jalous whiners everywhere. TA used to shine and you couldn't stand it. That's the necked truth. Admit that and move on. It won't come back to a usefull unit, no fear

Ost vs USSR has always been the most balanced matchup. Since I've always enjoyed Ost the most, and now you get mostly USF and UKF to play vs it's just not enjoyable.

Ï guess that is true. How about Okw only vs. UKF & USF. And SOV vs OST only?

There is virtualy no difference between a 3 level xp Tiger and TA.

How can you say that? The TA has better ROF, has already all the Vet bonuses and TWP. Am i forgetting something?
Its not the same man, its 100% not. Its a "staying alive" or "come back from the dead" unit.
Ether you put the Ace out to finish a game or you are at a point where you have nothing to loose and it will very much help you to accomplish your goal (finish the game of or keep you alive).
No other faction has this kind of unit.
No matter how you try to describe it, that's what it is.

By the time TA arrive, you should have allready won, if USF. If not, TA or not you will most probably lose.

So if you play as USF you are not allowed to play a match that is longer then 20 minutes and win?
You HAVE to win early or go pudding your self? That sucks man, this is just silly logic.

TWP.

Removed awhile ago.

Removed awhile ago.

Thanks, my bad

How can you say that? The TA has better ROF, has already all the Vet bonuses and TWP. Am i forgetting something?
Its not the same man, its 100% not. Its a "staying alive" or "come back from the dead" unit.
Ether you put the Ace out to finish a game or you are at a point where you have nothing to loose and it will very much help you to accomplish your goal (finish the game of or keep you alive).
No other faction has this kind of unit.
No matter how you try to describe it, that's what it is.

Doesn't matter if no other faction has that type of unit. No other faction has 6 man AT guns or 2 man snipers, that doesn't break Soviets. And also the fact that almost everyone that has Tiger Ace has it in their loadout does not mean it is overpowered. I almost always have it in my loadout despite picking it maybe 20% of the time. Its good to have in the loadout because sadly it is the only commander in the fucking game that allows mid game tech flexibility like getting Panzerwerfer, Panther, Ostwind, etc. without completely relegating the shock value of your doctrinal armor. That is not a problem with Tiger Ace, its a problem with every other heavy tank doctrine because fuel cost for doctrinal super heavies is cancerous design. That is the reason why so many patches have been dominated by pure infantry spam to heavy call-in spam, because why get mid game vehicles when it prevents you from fielding your best unit in many cases.

Tiger Ace is in so many loadouts because the versatility of being able to produce vehicles mid game, not because the Tiger Ace itself is a unkillable god. That and because 80% of the Ostheer vanilla commanders are dogshit.

No other faction has 6 man AT guns or 2 man snipers, that doesn't break Soviets. And also the

You have a good point(in the rest of your post) but let me ask you this .
What would you rather have? A 4 man PAK or a 6 man ZIS. The German sniper or the soviet one?
6 man ZIS and 2 man SU sniper don't have that big of an impact as the TA, no doubt about it.

You have a good point(in the rest of your post) but let me ask you this .
What would you rather have? A 4 man PAK or a 6 man ZIS. The German sniper or the soviet one?
6 man ZIS and 2 man SU sniper don't have that big of an impact as the TA, no doubt about it.

Of course it doesn't, why are you comparing a end game unit to a T2 AT gun? You should be comparing the TA to other end game units. Then when you consider the intangibles like the massive resource drain and only getting 1 per game, if anything it underperforms when compared to something like a Pershing.

Tiger ace is fine. It's a powerful unit that can quickly end a match. It won't bring you back from the dead and it's not a get out of jail free card for playing poorly the whole game. It used to be like thar and it made the game horrible; they fixed it and now it is fine.

How can you say that? The TA has better ROF, has already all the Vet bonuses and TWP. Am i forgetting something?

Normal Tiger:
1040 HP
19 Pop
35 sight
mg34_coaxial_generic_mp 2.06 / 5.55
mg42_turret_mounted_panther_mp 50mu 4.07 / 12.21
experience_value = 3440

Tiger ace:
1280 HP
26 Pop
50 Sight
mg34_coaxial_generic_tigerace_mp 4.10 / 10.95
experience_value = 3700

While i think it's fine, i wouldn't mind giving it an arty call in (same one from OKW) as it has an officer on top instead of an MG. Giving it anything that is not TWP power level would be fine. Statwise is fine.

The only thing i'd do is reduce its popcap, 26 is just too high.

Normal Tiger:
1040 HP
19 Pop
35 sight
mg34_coaxial_generic_mp 2.06 / 5.55
mg42_turret_mounted_panther_mp 50mu 4.07 / 12.21
experience_value = 3440

Tiger ace:
1280 HP
26 Pop
50 Sight
mg34_coaxial_generic_tigerace_mp 4.10 / 10.95
experience_value = 3700

While i think it's fine, i wouldn't mind giving it an arty call in (same one from OKW) as it has an officer on top instead of an MG. Giving it anything that is not TWP power level would be fine. Statwise is fine.

Yes it is but the penalties aren't fine at all.Also for some of you who said TA it's a unit that can make you win that's a stupid ideea.A normal vet 3 tiger won't give you the victory,so why a Tiger Ace will give you the victory?It's a desperation call in unit when you don't have anymore fuel and that's it.Or you call it when you have 2 vp and at least 1 fuel point just for defence.TA can still be outranged by firefly,su 85,su 152,jackson that can kill the TA.Some will just suicide 2 jacksons,or maybe 2 firefly to kill the TA .A vet 3 tiger it's not a one man army that can bring you the victory

Yes it is but the penalties aren't fine at all.Also for some of you who said TA it's a unit that can make you win that's a stupid ideea.A normal vet 3 tiger won't give you the victory,so why a Tiger Ace will give you the victory?It's a desperation call in unit when you don't have anymore fuel and that's it.Or you call it when you have 2 vp and at least 1 fuel point just for defence.TA can still be outranged by firefly,su 85,su 152,jackson that can kill the TA.Some will just suicide 2 jacksons,or maybe 2 firefly to kill the TA .A vet 3 tiger it's not a one man army that can bring you the victory

IIRC:
640mp 230f for a normal tiger.
800mp for the TA -25% mp (75) and -90% fuel income.

The unit is meant to be a comeback or finisher mechanism. It's a heavy mp unit which is not meant to be played defensively. I'll say if you think the match will not take longer than 5-10 mins, the unit is not a bad call cause that's the margin on which the unit is "cost effective".

The TA is not a teamgame oriented unit, as much of it's attributes comes from the shock value. If you think a vet3 Tiger won't give you the victory, that's clearly because you are thinking above 2v2+. Modes on which you can amass resources and vehicles to focus fire this kinds of threats.

Of course it doesn't, why are you comparing a end game unit to a T2 AT gun? You should be comparing the TA to other end game units. Then when you consider the intangibles like the massive resource drain and only getting 1 per game, if anything it underperforms when compared to something like a Pershing.

You mentioned them, not me
And i didn't compare them to TA. I aid ZIS or PAK and german Sniper or soviet one

It's better than playing vs emplacement spam cancer/land mattress/rifle blob to Pershing/Calliope.

well...ya, the match is 80% decided when you see the matchup on the loading screen.