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russian armor

Do you like new patch?

12 Jul 2013, 08:38 AM
#41
avatar of WarMonkey

Posts: 101


  • MG42 4 man crew further increases its ability to repel flanks and is unrequired, just return in back to 3 man crews. I have been saying it since alpha, please increase the damage of all small arms rifle fire so that flanked support units and units out of cover are punished harder and faster. In my mind 2 conscripts with a flank on a gren and mg42 should win the engagement, however this is rarely the case as MG42 pack, unpack and then fire extremely quickly again in response. Without an increase to small arms fire, my solution would be increase the pack up time of the MG42 so molotovs do more damage and a flanked unit is punished.
  • Soviet nerfs on mortars makes no sense as they were actually quite ineffective as they were last patch. Furthermore, it amplifies the strength of MG42's as mortars are weaker and the effects of flanking are weaker. I feel now the only way to breach well played 2-3 gren/2 mg based play is with M3 flamers/snipers or stall to T70. I feel flanking is never rewarded how it should be and early game Soviet indirect fire does not break MG positions well.


as someone who likes watching you play, i respectfully feel we are playing two different games. russian mortars did and still force me to engage (i.e. baited) or fall back. mg42s died in no time to molotovs with 3 man teams. players were punished hard for being flanked. flank a maxium means you have to resupply but not rebuild it. flank my mg42 before patch, oh well there's 240 mp down the drain plus any vet i might have got.

it's still easy to kill the mg42 with molotovs and flanking

if i go 2-3 gren and 2 mgs vs one mortar, 2-3 conscripts and a maxium (same manpower for both sides), the russian player will push me back. if i rush in i give up my mg position and allow the russian a better flank.
12 Jul 2013, 09:36 AM
#42
avatar of StephennJF

Posts: 934

When I am playing as Ostheer and its a 2 conscript vs 1 gren/1 mg engagement I feel I win the majority of the time. Even if my opponent does perform a flank where 1 conscript gets suppressed and the other gets close within grenade range it is still relatively easy to handle.

Shift the gren fire to the free squad, pick up the MG and dodge the grenade (even if it hits but you react fast enough you generally only lose 1/4 health. Then just sit your grens very close to the MG and suppress down the squad or if its to close then the MG42 continues to hurt the other squad already pinned down.

I don't know, but I'll keep trying as Russia but I feel the only way I win these small scale engagements is if I have an extra squad in the engagement or catch an MG42 off guard and quickly Orahh all my squads in very close. Even based manpower number battles that involve conscripts vs grens/mgs generally fall into the Ostheer players hands I feel.
12 Jul 2013, 09:40 AM
#43
avatar of Spanky
Senior Strategist Badge

Posts: 1820 | Subs: 2

The mg suppress is way too good, i unlocked the 10% more suppression and now its a joke, squads get pinned in under 1 second. i think the suppression should be reduced.

EDIT: but i do agree on the 4 man squad being okay actually. Last patch, m3 or a molotov was sure to get your MG, so you basically had to retreat most of the time. I think its too early to say, but lets play and see how it goes.
12 Jul 2013, 09:43 AM
#44
avatar of Porygon

Posts: 2779

When I am playing as Ostheer and its a 2 conscript vs 1 gren/1 mg engagement I feel I win the majority of the time. Even if my opponent does perform a flank where 1 conscript gets suppressed and the other gets close within grenade range it is still relatively easy to handle.

Shift the gren fire to the free squad, pick up the MG and dodge the grenade (even if it hits but you react fast enough you generally only lose 1/4 health. Then just sit your grens very close to the MG and suppress down the squad or if its to close then the MG42 continues to hurt the other squad already pinned down.

I don't know, but I'll keep trying as Russia but I feel the only way I win these small scale engagements is if I have an extra squad in the engagement or catch an MG42 off guard and quickly Orahh all my squads in very close. Even based manpower number battles that involve conscripts vs grens/mgs generally fall into the Ostheer players hands I feel.


They buff something not necessary to be buff, all they need is making Soviet support crew less men or less HP. Not bringing MG42 to level of unflankable

They balance the game in the wrong way, AGAIN
12 Jul 2013, 09:46 AM
#45
avatar of cr4wler

Posts: 1164

easy fix: make both MG set-up/break-down time something ridiculously high, like 5 seconds. suddenly flanking becomes more important (and basically means the MG is dead, if inadequately supported).

OR don't make weapon teams squad sized. can't really decide which would be the way to go.... ;-)
12 Jul 2013, 10:14 AM
#46
avatar of hubewa

Posts: 928

What about a damage multiplier for small arms on weapon teams?

That might work

Or is this not possible here?
12 Jul 2013, 10:16 AM
#47
avatar of OnkelSam
Honorary Member Badge

Posts: 1582 | Subs: 4

without target tables it might be difficult, but i dont know the details
12 Jul 2013, 12:14 PM
#48
avatar of cr4wler

Posts: 1164

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jul 2013, 10:14 AMhubewa
What about a damage multiplier for small arms on weapon teams?

That might work

Or is this not possible here?


you could lower the armor for weapon teams, that might work. tanks and other weapons will penetrate either way, but small arms might do more damage (if they don't penetrate 100% of the time anyway).
12 Jul 2013, 12:19 PM
#49
avatar of rofltehcat

Posts: 604

Lower armor than 1 wouldn't do anything, would it? Because you don't deal more damage to low armor tanks with a huge penetration gun either. You just have a chance of 0% for it to deflect. However, it might increase the chance for criticals (just speculation though).
So no, just lowering their armor wouldn't do anything. If anything, they'd have to buff every weapon in the game, which they surely won't do.
12 Jul 2013, 12:32 PM
#50
avatar of cr4wler

Posts: 1164

Lower armor than 1 wouldn't do anything, would it? Because you don't deal more damage to low armor tanks with a huge penetration gun either. You just have a chance of 0% for it to deflect. However, it might increase the chance for criticals (just speculation though).
So no, just lowering their armor wouldn't do anything. If anything, they'd have to buff every weapon in the game, which they surely won't do.


as i said, if they already penetrate 100%, lower armor will do nothing.

spoiler for criticals (wall of text):

12 Jul 2013, 13:34 PM
#51
avatar of Nullist

Posts: 2425

Permanently Banned
But if there is no hit ie: armor deflects, then there is no critical chance.

Isnt that how criticals work?
12 Jul 2013, 13:47 PM
#52
avatar of Sukha

Posts: 9

MVGame patch, they left out most of the abuse on Russian side and German strafe....
I mean how do you ignore the likes of HTD and Strafing run....
12 Jul 2013, 14:20 PM
#53
avatar of hubewa

Posts: 928

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jul 2013, 13:47 PMSukha
MVGame patch, they left out most of the abuse on Russian side and German strafe....
I mean how do you ignore the likes of HTD and Strafing run....


HTD is counterable, strafing run isn't.

This coming from a 50/50 Ost/Soviet player.

Most of the stuff the Sovs were abusing have been nerfed. But I think everyone's unhappy about the 4 man MGs.
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