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Soviet late game options/tips? (1v1)

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TNrg
16 Mar 2016, 14:48 PM
#1
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Posts: 640

What good options do the soviets have in late game? I've been using the IS-2 recently and feel like it's like paying 640 MP and 230 fuel to throw the game.

The IS-2 doesn't hit infantry at all, it has a slow firing rate and usually can't even penetrate the other heavy tanks or the panther. It's super slow so a panther can easily just get behind it. It takes ages to repair, while OKW can repair it's tanks in no time. You need at least 2, preferably 3 combat engineers to repair the heavies effectively.

The T-34/85s are usually not affordable early enough if you go for a quick T-70. And the quick T-70 is a must 9/10 times since conscripts suck so hard and you need a shock unit. In most games, the T3 + T4 costs combined are too high just to get out a T-34/85. Also the T4 units (SU-76s or SU-85s) are usually out of the question since there's so many urban maps with too many shot blockers so going for an early T4 doesn't accomplish much.

Or how do you avoid getting into the late game without maxim spamming? :foreveralone:
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d0ggY
16 Mar 2016, 15:12 PM
#2
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Have you ever tried the ISU Commander with Guards, Mark Target, IL-2 drop? I use it often in 2v2, ISU just cleans the battlefield of infantry, should be protected of course by zis gun and mines
Me: I am scared, that i will need to shake ma head the same as when i read ur posts, so i rather not

Katitof: Its not even close to me even at my worst in the past, imagine ullu, incendiary, aaa, vetlolcake and disto merge into one mega axis zord with forcefield protecting it from accepting any factual data. Add to that a victim card(his rumblings at my PM).
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Kozokus
16 Mar 2016, 15:25 PM
#3
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Posts: 301

HEllo.

My late game options usually involve IS2 and/or KV8. If not viable, multiple T3476 (understand 4+) are what i use when i speak vehicles.
Unless in specific scenarios, i try to avoid SU85 and ISU as much as i can and keep them for multiplayer games.

Kozokus.
...For conflict is the great teacher,
and pain... the perfect educator...
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Captain QQ
16 Mar 2016, 15:32 PM
#4
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Posts: 365

My late game has been going very well recently. I made a thread recently about penals on this board. Check it out. Their anti-infantry and utility blows conscripts out of the water late game, plus you don't have to rely on armor to take out okw buildings.

However, the majority of the games I play with penals rarely go beyond 35 minutes. I rarely even need an mg and if I get one it is usually stolen.

jump backJump back to quoted post16 Mar 2016, 15:12 PMd0ggY
Have you ever tried the ISU Commander with Guards, Mark Target, IL-2 drop? I use it often in 2v2, ISU just cleans the battlefield of infantry, should be protected of course by zis gun and mines


The one thing I have found that makes me hesitant to use the ISU-152 is that it becomes almost useless on maps with any sloping terrain. It loves burying shots in the ground just in front of infantry. This is why I will always prefer the KV-2 when I want infantry decimating armor.
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d0ggY
16 Mar 2016, 15:46 PM
#5
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jump backJump back to quoted post16 Mar 2016, 15:32 PMCaptain QQ
My late game has been going very well recently. I made a thread recently about penals on this board. Check it out. Their anti-infantry and utility blows conscripts out of the water late game, plus you don't have to rely on armor to take out okw buildings.

However, the majority of the games I play with penals rarely go beyond 35 minutes. I rarely even need an mg and if I get one it is usually stolen.



The one thing I have found that makes me hesitant to use the ISU-152 is that it becomes almost useless on maps with any sloping terrain. It loves burying shots in the ground just in front of infantry. This is why I will always prefer the KV-2 when I want infantry decimating armor.


But you dont have guards right? ISU without guards as infantry that are allrounders i think is weak, the combination is what makes that doctrine strong
Me: I am scared, that i will need to shake ma head the same as when i read ur posts, so i rather not

Katitof: Its not even close to me even at my worst in the past, imagine ullu, incendiary, aaa, vetlolcake and disto merge into one mega axis zord with forcefield protecting it from accepting any factual data. Add to that a victim card(his rumblings at my PM).
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EtherealDragon
16 Mar 2016, 15:46 PM
#6
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I usually construct my late-game around how the early-mid game goes. Personally I'm a fan of 85s and if I apply enough early pressure/fuel harassment I'll tech straight for T4 and hopefully get an 85 around the same time as PZ4 if all goes well. Another option to consider is going for Quad M5 as your shock unit - that way you save 40 fuel for your faster late game armor.

Otherwise KV8 supported by multiple SU76s for AT isn't a bad way to go. If the game drags on you eventually call out IS2 for a very balanced AI/AT army. IS2 makes for a wonderful meat shield that can dish out punishment as well.

Sadly I haven't had much success with solely using stock T4 units in late game (but I do like SU-85s on more open maps where the self spotting can be pretty nasty). That and of course you'll want Katushyas against any turtle.
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Clarity
16 Mar 2016, 16:40 PM
#7
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Right now, I do feel it's really difficult to fight late game OKW infantry without having at least 2 Maxims and a couple squads of Guards. I really used to like Shock Troops but I feel they bleed much harder than Guards and have less versatility. I had a hour long game last night using Soviet Reserve where I had wiped out almost all of my OKW opponents infantry force, but his King Tiger + JP4 combo was absolutely wrecking my SU-85's. His Stuka continued to rain down on my support weapons, which made it really difficult to stop the Falls he continued to build. Soviets with Call-ins + Maxims are really strong, but playing the faction while trying to use core units is really difficult against a solid OKW player who goes for anything other than Volks. If you want to try and get to the mid-game without Maxim spamming, Guards are pretty much a must have. You could also try building 2 DShK's from the Lend Lease commander, (or defensive if you like to hurt yourself). DShK's pin faster than Maxims but require a little more micro.
How to play CoH 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fZwJFjiA0A :hansREKT:



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SturmTigerTrafalgar
16 Mar 2016, 16:50 PM
#8
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Posts: 160

well it depends on ur enemy. most of the time the axix player will have the better infantry in late game, so the best way to deal with it is a t70, mines, demos and indirect fire like mortar.
if u didnt hold both fuel points of the map, then theres no reason to get t34 or something like that. SU76 are doing the same job if u need more AT to support ur IS2/KV2. Or just build AT guns if u need AT supp against the Tiger/KT
Aka Danny
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luvnest
16 Mar 2016, 17:14 PM
#9
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jump backJump back to quoted post16 Mar 2016, 16:50 PMSturmTigerTrafalgar
axix player

:foreveralone:

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VonIvan
16 Mar 2016, 19:21 PM
#10
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jump backJump back to quoted post16 Mar 2016, 14:48 PMTNrg

Or how do you avoid getting into the late game without maxim spamming? :foreveralone:


Spamming more maxims :wub:

j/k

Guards/Shocks/(Double)Sniper combo or cons + DhsK.
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Captain QQ
16 Mar 2016, 19:28 PM
#11
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jump backJump back to quoted post16 Mar 2016, 15:46 PMd0ggY


But you dont have guards right? ISU without guards as infantry that are allrounders i think is weak, the combination is what makes that doctrine strong


Two different conversations.

If I go ISU i def go guards too, but I have just had too many games where a VERY small hill makes the ISU obsolete. I don't even run with it in my roster anymore.

I would love it if you gave me your thoughts on this
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TNrg
16 Mar 2016, 19:48 PM
#12
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Posts: 640

Thanks for the tips, will have to experiment with these ideas :sibTux:
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d0ggY
17 Mar 2016, 04:22 AM
#13
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jump backJump back to quoted post16 Mar 2016, 19:28 PMCaptain QQ


Two different conversations.

If I go ISU i def go guards too, but I have just had too many games where a VERY small hill makes the ISU obsolete. I don't even run with it in my roster anymore.

I would love it if you gave me your thoughts on this



Penals seem to have improved a bit, but still not that valid. As soon as LMG hits field, gg wp dead guys
Me: I am scared, that i will need to shake ma head the same as when i read ur posts, so i rather not

Katitof: Its not even close to me even at my worst in the past, imagine ullu, incendiary, aaa, vetlolcake and disto merge into one mega axis zord with forcefield protecting it from accepting any factual data. Add to that a victim card(his rumblings at my PM).
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Captain QQ
17 Mar 2016, 07:12 AM
#14
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Posts: 365

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Mar 2016, 04:22 AMd0ggY



Penals seem to have improved a bit, but still not that valid. As soon as LMG hits field, gg wp dead guys


Clearly you haven't see what 3 vet 2 Flame penal squads can do to lmg cowards. :)
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d0ggY
17 Mar 2016, 15:34 PM
#15
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jump backJump back to quoted post17 Mar 2016, 07:12 AMCaptain QQ


Clearly you haven't see what 3 vet 2 Flame penal squads can do to lmg cowards. :)


Playercard? If people let penals get in flamer range it i s their own fault
Me: I am scared, that i will need to shake ma head the same as when i read ur posts, so i rather not

Katitof: Its not even close to me even at my worst in the past, imagine ullu, incendiary, aaa, vetlolcake and disto merge into one mega axis zord with forcefield protecting it from accepting any factual data. Add to that a victim card(his rumblings at my PM).
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vietnamabc
17 Mar 2016, 17:53 PM
#16
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Posts: 1063

In another note: anybody know any decent counter to Tiger + Stuka AT loiter, in this patch it seems that even without vision, Stuka can strafe my tanks which are being repaired deep in base sector (WTF) and Quad seems to deal jack shit to airplane.
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zerocoh
19 Mar 2016, 06:09 AM
#17
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Posts: 930

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Mar 2016, 15:34 PMd0ggY


Playercard? If people let penals get in flamer range it i s their own fault


Lots of people forget (myself included) but penals do have oorah! put your squad on a flank/hedge/house then oorah to get a nice surprise.

Also, for 1v1s go guard motors. Guards are really paying themselves when you use them right and 2 T34 85s + mark vehicle = any tank dead in seconds
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TNrg
19 Mar 2016, 10:29 AM
#18
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Posts: 640

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Mar 2016, 17:53 PMvietnamabc
In another note: anybody know any decent counter to Tiger + Stuka AT loiter, in this patch it seems that even without vision, Stuka can strafe my tanks which are being repaired deep in base sector (WTF) and Quad seems to deal jack shit to airplane.


Yeah, AA in this game has to be one of the most inconsistent things ever.
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