How come ppl have probs with FRPs all the sudden
15 Jan 2016, 07:29 AM
#1
Posts: 128
This is a fad that just came up right? Cos I don't recall seeing these arguments anytime before
It takes great skills to hide the fact that you have great skills
15 Jan 2016, 07:40 AM
#2
Posts: 2396 | Subs: 1
I hate this false problem. FRPs are fine and prevent games from being linear and faction copy pasting. But people these days are only looking for things that prevent them from winning. I don't even want to imagine a 3v3 or 4v4 game without FRPs. What will be the point of infantry? FRPs are great for 2v2s also.
Everything in this game OP or not OP, has counters. There are only people who don't like to work for their wins. I was never bothered by FRPs when playing against them. There were times when an OKW frp was erased from the face of the earth in eraly game, with a combined, good push, properly executed by allied players, after which OKW player never came back.
In fact, people who are blaming FRPs are targeting (what's new) OKW again. Because they will come with arguments like "there is no other faction that has FRP in early game" pointing this as a bad thing instead appreciating diversity.
Everything in this game OP or not OP, has counters. There are only people who don't like to work for their wins. I was never bothered by FRPs when playing against them. There were times when an OKW frp was erased from the face of the earth in eraly game, with a combined, good push, properly executed by allied players, after which OKW player never came back.
In fact, people who are blaming FRPs are targeting (what's new) OKW again. Because they will come with arguments like "there is no other faction that has FRP in early game" pointing this as a bad thing instead appreciating diversity.
BeefSurge wrote:
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
15 Jan 2016, 08:25 AM
#3
Posts: 230
Permanently BannedThe actual problem is volks having shrecks, and rifles having terminator vet 3. All other blobs are l2p.
15 Jan 2016, 08:39 AM
#4
Posts: 301
The actual problem is volks having shrecks, and rifles having terminator vet 3. All other blobs are l2p.
I wonder how OKW can fight light armor without shrecks. If you wanna answer to give them faust, remember that their atgun is only a pale copy of others and that none shrecks and raketten are enough alone.
Rifles without a solid endgame resistance would be hard for USF.
Kozo.
...For conflict is the great teacher,
and pain... the perfect educator...
and pain... the perfect educator...
15 Jan 2016, 08:54 AM
#5
Posts: 230
Permanently Banned
I wonder how OKW can fight light armor without shrecks. If you wanna answer to give them faust, remember that their atgun is only a pale copy of others and that none shrecks and raketten are enough alone.
Rifles without a solid endgame resistance would be hard for USF.
Kozo.
Replace -20% received accuracy with reduce reinforcement cost and reinforce time. Was thinking like 21-23mp at vet3? Change -23% at vet 2 to -29%
Remove shrecks on volks and put them on a new unit?
Just my suggestion.
15 Jan 2016, 09:02 AM
#6
Posts: 301
Replace -20% received accuracy with reduce reinforcement cost and reinforce time. Was thinking like 23mp at vet3?
Remove shrecks on volks and put them on a new unit?
I thought about reducing costs. But what is the point in the end? your (main faction force) rifles will still get easily killed (and easily rinfrced). maybe giving them +0.5 armor like Shock. I relly think they need survivability.
I also thought about a new unit with shrecks, that would copypasta Pgrenadiers in some flavour. The problem is that most factions (with the exception of UKF but they get piats later) has their first AT snare/shots on the frontline core infantery. That would be a very big change and you would see less arguments to build volks instead f thoses.
Kozo.
...For conflict is the great teacher,
and pain... the perfect educator...
and pain... the perfect educator...
15 Jan 2016, 09:12 AM
#7
Posts: 230
Permanently BannedI dislike riflemen durability especially with lmgs, and I also dislike their high reinforcement cost. Riflemen aren't elite infantry, they should be cheaper. Make weapon racks and grenades combined for same cost to compensate.
I thought about reducing costs. But what is the point in the end? your (main faction force) rifles will still get easily killed (and easily rinfrced). maybe giving them +0.5 armor like Shock. I relly think they need survivability.
I also thought about a new unit with shrecks, that would copypasta Pgrenadiers in some flavour. The problem is that most factions (with the exception of UKF but they get piats later) has their first AT snare/shots on the frontline core infantery. That would be a very big change and you would see less arguments to build volks instead f thoses.
Kozo.
Mp drain will probably be reduced this way, and nobody will blob anymore and get away with it. Plus they only become -14% less durable with vet 3 due to vet 2 change. But I get what you mean.
As for volks, they could get stgs and panzerfaust sidetech? Maybe put AT squad in medic truck so you aren't screwed for going battlegroup, AT squad wouldn't be nearly as resilient and do less damage vs infantry, but could maybe get some cool abilities with vet like camo or accurate first shot.
15 Jan 2016, 09:32 AM
#8
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
FRPs were called many times before.
They give unfair advantage.
They make blobbing more rewarding / less punishing
They give great map presence.
They give unfair advantage.
They make blobbing more rewarding / less punishing
They give great map presence.
15 Jan 2016, 15:01 PM
#9
Posts: 468
FRPs were not as big of a problem because...
Riflemen weren't buffed until recently. M1919 wasn't overused because it was only on one commander but now it's on the supposedly OP calliope one as well. Originally, the meta was easy 8 commander with flamer riflemen that only excelled in close combat without the buff.
OKW had a resource constraint... losing squads or even models became a heavy MP drain on their economy. However, once that was removed and volks were buffed, blobbing become rewarded as there isn't as heavy a drawback as before.
That is why FRPs are bad.
For UKF, their units cost so much and high reinforce rate, that's why they are not as cost effective as OKW and USF. That is also why you hear OKW players crying about obersoldaten costs. they can't spam those and maintain a floating MP because of high reinforce.
Riflemen weren't buffed until recently. M1919 wasn't overused because it was only on one commander but now it's on the supposedly OP calliope one as well. Originally, the meta was easy 8 commander with flamer riflemen that only excelled in close combat without the buff.
OKW had a resource constraint... losing squads or even models became a heavy MP drain on their economy. However, once that was removed and volks were buffed, blobbing become rewarded as there isn't as heavy a drawback as before.
That is why FRPs are bad.
For UKF, their units cost so much and high reinforce rate, that's why they are not as cost effective as OKW and USF. That is also why you hear OKW players crying about obersoldaten costs. they can't spam those and maintain a floating MP because of high reinforce.
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15 Jan 2016, 15:16 PM
#10
Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1
There have been complaints against FRPs since WFA blobs got famous, which was a while ago.
15 Jan 2016, 17:38 PM
#11
Posts: 680
All these complaints yet even with the AEC buff it feels like a real gamble to build a FRP as Brits, when I do it's 50/50 whether I regret it or not.
I can only think of a couple of games where a well placed and timely FRP made a difference, but then I tend to veto the large maps in 1v1.
The OKW flak trucks acts as a FRP I think? That seems to make a huge difference but it is organically defended and a tough blighter to kill. The Brit tent's placement seems like an art form, too close and easy meat to kill, too far back and has little effect, garrison bonus is only useful if you use lots of emplacments...
It might just be a matter of playstyle or a force multiplier for those who are rather better than I at unit preservation but there are a lot of things I would rather do with 450 manpower.
I can only think of a couple of games where a well placed and timely FRP made a difference, but then I tend to veto the large maps in 1v1.
The OKW flak trucks acts as a FRP I think? That seems to make a huge difference but it is organically defended and a tough blighter to kill. The Brit tent's placement seems like an art form, too close and easy meat to kill, too far back and has little effect, garrison bonus is only useful if you use lots of emplacments...
It might just be a matter of playstyle or a force multiplier for those who are rather better than I at unit preservation but there are a lot of things I would rather do with 450 manpower.
15 Jan 2016, 18:09 PM
#12
Posts: 468
All these complaints yet even with the AEC buff it feels like a real gamble to build a FRP as Brits, when I do it's 50/50 whether I regret it or not.
I can only think of a couple of games where a well placed and timely FRP made a difference, but then I tend to veto the large maps in 1v1.
The OKW flak trucks acts as a FRP I think? That seems to make a huge difference but it is organically defended and a tough blighter to kill. The Brit tent's placement seems like an art form, too close and easy meat to kill, too far back and has little effect, garrison bonus is only useful if you use lots of emplacments...
It might just be a matter of playstyle or a force multiplier for those who are rather better than I at unit preservation but there are a lot of things I would rather do with 450 manpower.
The main problem with FRP is not with UKF. It's USF and OKW who can field and sustain mainline infantry.
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15 Jan 2016, 18:16 PM
#13
Posts: 1890 | Subs: 1
I think a lot of the FRP beef comes from people who play 3s and 4s where the larger maps much more greatly favor factions with FRPs.
Soviets and Ostheer are much more punished for mass retreats in these cases because they sacrifice a lot more map presence in the time that it takes them to run to base and then back.
I don't think it would be terrible if they gave the unupgraded halftracks the option to upgrade into FRPs - say some token MP amount allows them to deploy into a FRP that only works while the vehicle is hull downed or whatever you want to call it.
Soviets and Ostheer are much more punished for mass retreats in these cases because they sacrifice a lot more map presence in the time that it takes them to run to base and then back.
I don't think it would be terrible if they gave the unupgraded halftracks the option to upgrade into FRPs - say some token MP amount allows them to deploy into a FRP that only works while the vehicle is hull downed or whatever you want to call it.
15 Jan 2016, 19:43 PM
#14
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
They are just bad on 3v3+ and maybe on some 2v2 maps (which in general they are not true 2v2 maps).
They were an issue since WFA were released.
They were an issue since WFA were released.
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And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
15 Jan 2016, 19:44 PM
#15
1 
Posts: 2307 | Subs: 4
I always hated them. I suppose the balance is pretty good in 1v1 now, so a lot of the complaining on the forums has turned to 2v2+ problems, where the FRP is a much bigger deal.
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Someone asked what my avatar was from... I really don't know.
Defeated Paula and knocked him out of 2v2 Anniversary Cup
15 Jan 2016, 19:54 PM
#16
Posts: 367
What mean FRP?
15 Jan 2016, 19:56 PM
#17
Posts: 230
Permanently BannedThere have been complaints against FRPs since WFA blobs got famous, which was a while ago.And what were those blobs? Oh right, volks and riflemen. Change those units instead.
15 Jan 2016, 20:08 PM
#18
Posts: 174
15 Jan 2016, 22:34 PM
#19
Posts: 204
FRP need to go. This is one of the few ways that relic can balance 3v3+ with out messing with 1v1 balance. So all the 1v1 balance worrier need to sit down and ask them selves if there is any reason FRP need to stay in 1v1s hell even 2v2. Just give me one good one.
15 Jan 2016, 23:25 PM
#20
Posts: 367
FRP need to go. This is one of the few ways that relic can balance 3v3+ with out messing with 1v1 balance. So all the 1v1 balance worrier need to sit down and ask them selves if there is any reason FRP need to stay in 1v1s hell even 2v2. Just give me one good one.
FRP is a cancer in this game in 3vs3 and 4vs4. Some army just get no pushisement for retrait. Some maps like steepes are no balanced becouse of it
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