Login

russian armor

Conscripts VS Volks?

24 Dec 2015, 18:41 PM
#21
avatar of vasa1719

Posts: 2635 | Subs: 4

Permanently Banned

Merge and Oorah from start, AT nade after upgrade.
Oorah+molotov and oorah+AT nade are very powerful combinations.


Lol !
24 Dec 2015, 18:43 PM
#22
avatar of miragefla
Developer Relic Badge

Posts: 1304 | Subs: 13

Now cons are the worst mainline infantry in the game, all of there upgrades require resources which delays tech and was nerfed in the past year, as well as scaling very poorly into late game. Volks have 2 nades for free and panzershreks with 5 levels of vet


The only change I would make to Conscripts is changing their veterancy so at Vet 3, they would cost 15 manpower over 20 to reinforce their role as cheap meatshields/utility troops. Make their vet 1 be 0.9 received accuracy like Volks.

And Volks are really only a threat to tanks late game. Yes, we all know the shrek is dumb and should get changed, but Volks fold to anything more than Conscripts and the flame grenade is hardly an 'I win' versus MGs if the Allied player, I don't know, screened their MGs with inf like Ostheer has to do every game. The main scary thing is what's behind the Volks.
24 Dec 2015, 18:43 PM
#23
avatar of vasa1719

Posts: 2635 | Subs: 4

Permanently Banned
Do somthing with folks relic:loco:
24 Dec 2015, 18:44 PM
#24
avatar of WhySooSerious

Posts: 1248

How come conscripts are nowhere as useful as volks and the cost difference is only 10 manpower?

Did anybody ever wonder? volks have 5 Vet levels, access to nades, access to Shreks.

What do conscripts do thats as good as volks? the commander PTRS is a weaker version of the call in units, molotov is so slow team can literally wipe before the damm thing finishes throwing.

Only decent thing is the PPSH upgrade but its commander locked.

Whats the current justification in the units large efficiency gap?

After volks got buffed big time, do they still match their cost to stat ratio when compared to conscripts?

Could anybody shed a light for me regarding the facts?

Much appreciated


Cons are still alot cheaper. They cost 5 less manpower to reinforce than volks. What I think Relic needs to do is increase reinforce cost to 28 which will increase the manpower bleed of volks or 27 since 28 may seem a bit too much.
24 Dec 2015, 18:58 PM
#25
avatar of carloff

Posts: 301

Cheap = worst = can't kill = almost useless in late game = mp bleed
24 Dec 2015, 19:05 PM
#26
avatar of The_Courier

Posts: 665

A lot of that is down to WFA power creep. OKW got a buff across the board, while Soviets are left to fend for themselves despite a good third of their roster being intensely mediocre at the best of times, if not outright sucking.

Conscripts aren't terrible, but they are woefully outmatched by a lot of Axis infantry. Their vet 3 makes them quite durable, but they still have crap DPS so late game their primary use is Oooorah into AT nade while probably losing half the squad in the process, and 1v1 they lose to any similarily vetted Axis squad unless they land a molotov.

This is made worse by the fact that the only infantry that can give them help is doctrinal, thanks to Penals sucking.

Personally I'd change their vet; slightly reduce their received dmg bonus at vet 3, and give them one SVT40 (good daame at short and medium range) at vet 2 and another at vet 3. So they end up having decent firepower with veterancy. It also works with the flavor of them being entrusted better weapons as they prove themselves.
24 Dec 2015, 19:33 PM
#27
avatar of Aerohank

Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1

Am I the only one around here who actually thinks Soviets are fine? Conscripts are not the main killers in the Soviet army. Soviets have a lot of things that are very good at killing, the conscripts are there to screen for your other units.
24 Dec 2015, 20:06 PM
#28
avatar of Vuther
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1

Scripts are fine, Penals just not need to be bad and Molotovs (as well as Incendiary Grenades) could use a slight buff to their DoT tick speed.
24 Dec 2015, 20:26 PM
#29
avatar of Domine

Posts: 500

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Dec 2015, 20:06 PMVuther
Molotovs (as well as Incendiary Grenades) could use a slight buff to their DoT tick speed.



Molotovs should get their throwing speed halved as well.
24 Dec 2015, 20:28 PM
#30
avatar of Midconflict

Posts: 204

An Idea I had was to keep the con at 240 manpower and lock merge at vet 2. Then lower the renforment cost to 15, until vet 3 then it get lowered to 10 or so.

I think this would be a cool flavor way of the whole soviet wave/mass in still of war they fought during ww2. I don't think this would be broken, because a. It take micro to do b.non of the infantry the sovets have are that strong, and the con modle dose not get the same armor, and some other stats, and c. It requires skill to first get the con unit to vet 3 and then to keep it alive after. Maby they could also increase the experience need to get to vet 3.
24 Dec 2015, 21:05 PM
#31
avatar of RedDevilCG

Posts: 154

Isn't reinforcement cost tied to total unit cost though?
24 Dec 2015, 21:05 PM
#32
avatar of Aerohank

Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1

Isn't reinforcement cost tied to total unit cost though?


Just loosely.
24 Dec 2015, 21:14 PM
#33
avatar of Vuther
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1

Isn't reinforcement cost tied to total unit cost though?

RoyEs already got a veterancy bonus to reduce reinforcement cost.
24 Dec 2015, 21:16 PM
#34
avatar of miragefla
Developer Relic Badge

Posts: 1304 | Subs: 13

Isn't reinforcement cost tied to total unit cost though?


Yes, but there are ways to modify it such as implementing the changes into their veterancy or adding an upgrade to the player at the start that would bring the unit's cost back to standard levels while keeping the reinforcement the same.

24 Dec 2015, 23:11 PM
#35
avatar of NinjaWJ

Posts: 2070

Am I the only one around here who actually thinks Soviets are fine? Conscripts are not the main killers in the Soviet army. Soviets have a lot of things that are very good at killing, the conscripts are there to screen for your other units.


i think they are okay too, but power creep kinda ruins them
25 Dec 2015, 00:25 AM
#36
avatar of Australian Magic

Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2

I actually think Conscripts perform fine for their cost.

Soviets as a whole is pretty much alright in my opinion. If anything needs to change it's some minor changes to some of the doctrine abilities and maybe a katy-buff to bring it in line with the panzerwerfer in terms of performance.


Oh god, no. We don't need X-Wipe machines. If anything, PzWefer should be brought down to Katy level becasue Katy is in perfect spot. Not a wipe machine but still deadly, can be dodged. PzWefer means death to all kind of crew weapons, katy as well, but it gives you chance to survive.
25 Dec 2015, 00:49 AM
#37
avatar of nodickwilliams

Posts: 230

Permanently Banned
Pwerfer still has inherent disadvantage of being in wehr t4
25 Dec 2015, 00:51 AM
#38
avatar of F1sh

Posts: 521

Cons are fine. Penals, however, should be looked at. 30 more manpower than Conscripts but they perform about the same. Either give them a slight buff, or bring the cost down to 240 MP.

Also, the satchel charge bug needs fixing. Relic, it's been a while...
25 Dec 2015, 02:20 AM
#39
avatar of Blackart

Posts: 344

Conscripts

docrine locked: 3x PPsH-41

docrine locked: 2x PTRS


Rifleman

2x BAR

2x Bazooka

doctrine locked: 2x M1919

Infantry Section

2x Bren

2x PIAT

Grenadier

1x MG42

docrine locked: 2x G43

Volksgrenadiers

1x Panzerschreck

25 Dec 2015, 03:45 AM
#40
avatar of The_Courier

Posts: 665

jump backJump back to quoted post25 Dec 2015, 00:51 AMF1sh
Cons are fine. Penals, however, should be looked at. 30 more manpower than Conscripts but they perform about the same. Either give them a slight buff, or bring the cost down to 240 MP.

Also, the satchel charge bug needs fixing. Relic, it's been a while...


Penals costing the same as Cons wouldNt solve the issue; the unit is simply redundant. The faction already has a fairly cheap, close-range basic infantry with Ooorah that is Ok at clearing buildings. Penals don't do anything Conscripts can't except having a bit more DPS, and they don,t have an AT grenade too.

The unit needs a role change. Either as tough, elite close range infantry (which then plays on the field of Shocks...) or my favored proposal, as Panzerfusilier-esque 6 man, medium-long range infantry, with a flamer upgrade that role changes them to an assault unit by unlocking also Ooorah or something. Or maybe give them lend-lease bazooka upgrade to solve the problem of SU's bad handheld AT. Something.
1 user is browsing this thread: 1 guest

Livestreams

Germany 20
Germany 898

Ladders Top 10

  • #
    Steam Alias
    W
    L
    %
    Streak
Data provided by Relic Relic Entertainment

Replay highlight

VS
  • U.S. Forces flag cblanco ★
  • The British Forces flag 보드카 중대
  • Oberkommando West flag VonManteuffel
  • Ostheer flag Heartless Jäger
uploaded by XXxxHeartlessxxXX

Board Info

979 users are online: 1 member and 978 guests
Brick Top
3 posts in the last 24h
3 posts in the last week
23 posts in the last month
Registered members: 48727
Welcome our newest member, sunwinctcom
Most online: 2043 users on 29 Oct 2023, 01:04 AM