Can´t say you are wrong....seems fair.
so volks don´t deserve any AI upgrade as lot of people here wants because you have others AI tools? just asking.
Not quite. Volks are useless as a AI unit. Sherman is not useless as AT unit
USF Sherman 76mm gun upgrade?
3 Dec 2015, 12:29 PM
#61
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Not quite. Volks are useless as a AI unit. Sherman is not useless as AT unit
3 Dec 2015, 12:33 PM
#62
Posts: 228
i agree with you +1
aixe are for real ez to use
allwase see low [LVL] thet just started to play with 400 hours or less, playeing as aixe. how they got used to the game so fast how they got ranked up so fast on the leaderbourds ?
cos aixe need less micro
+8000
3 Dec 2015, 12:36 PM
#63
Posts: 245
What shermann type? Compared to what P4 type?
Because, if you compare an easy 8 with a panzer 4 ausf D for instance, of course it is superior.
I'll try to summarize to keep my sanity, firstly Shermans had better life on tracks, better traverse turret, the utility to use it's main gun as an artillery piece.
Comparing variants for either side is kind of pointless in that There were many many variants for both platforms, which include anything you can think of, massively armored shermans(that of which p4 could not viably penetrate in theory), flamethrower shermans, rocket arty shermans etc..so I will be general.
Aside from that Shermans were more reliable, multiple different engines allowed for both diesel and gasoline. has better overall armor and shermans had a sloped frontal hull which proved effective, accounting for HVAP rounds in the Sherman also makes comparison a no contest the Sherman has every advantage to shoot first and harder.
There is more but I cant be bothered, p4 was slightly inferior in almost every way. Which Is why US thought it would be ideal to mass produce shermans.
3 Dec 2015, 12:52 PM
#64
Posts: 345
Not quite. Volks are useless as a AI unit. Sherman is not useless as AT unit
haha, ok ok, thanks for your reply, I think I have learnt some new things with your kindly answers man. Much appreciated.
I cannot agree with your last one.....imho if volks need AI help to figth late game inf, shermans need help to fight late game Armor. but I have no skills to talk so much about balance....
Thanks for your replies man, really, no joke.
An already muni starved faction (OKW) is now more muni starved and still can't build caches.
3 Dec 2015, 13:13 PM
#65
Posts: 4928
I don't know why you'd want the 76mm Sherman since Relic buffed the 75mm Sherman so much that it's nearly the same thing anyway. 75mm is overall better than the 76mm now because 75mm has better AI and the HE ability.
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII
> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
3 Dec 2015, 13:40 PM
#66
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
I cannot agree with your last one.....imho if volks need AI help to figth late game inf, shermans need help to fight late game Armor. but I have no skills to talk so much about balance....
But Volks don't need AI upgrade to fight only in late-game because they struggle even in early and mid game, while Sherman is perfectly fine when it hits the field and even in late game it has quite nice chance to penetrate tanks
3 Dec 2015, 15:34 PM
#67
Posts: 1216
There's the issue of realism (re what Sherman ought to be compared to how they were in BoB) and the issue of balance, which can utilize realism but in pretty much all cases with Relic does not.
Given that Relic tends to gravitate towards just stat changes that brings desired performance rather than performance you expect in real life, I'd expect a more consistent change towards this issue is simply buffing Sherman;s AT ability...assuming it needs one in the first place.
I mean the results of a 76mm upgrade idea is just AT buff, so all Relic really needs to do is change penetration stats, not add some fancy upgrade for every Sherman tank. It's easier to do, makes handling a common USF unit less micro-intensive, and doesn't require spending more resources to turn a shit unit to actually useful unit.
Then again, I don't have problems with how it performs. If you want a go-to AT unit you already have 57mm and Jacksons, after all. Giving lots of special treatment to a medium tank would risk trivializing those units whose specialty is AT work.
Given that Relic tends to gravitate towards just stat changes that brings desired performance rather than performance you expect in real life, I'd expect a more consistent change towards this issue is simply buffing Sherman;s AT ability...assuming it needs one in the first place.
I mean the results of a 76mm upgrade idea is just AT buff, so all Relic really needs to do is change penetration stats, not add some fancy upgrade for every Sherman tank. It's easier to do, makes handling a common USF unit less micro-intensive, and doesn't require spending more resources to turn a shit unit to actually useful unit.
Then again, I don't have problems with how it performs. If you want a go-to AT unit you already have 57mm and Jacksons, after all. Giving lots of special treatment to a medium tank would risk trivializing those units whose specialty is AT work.
3 Dec 2015, 15:41 PM
#68
Posts: 345
But Volks don't need AI upgrade to fight only in late-game because they struggle even in early and mid game, while Sherman is perfectly fine when it hits the field and even in late game it has quite nice chance to penetrate tanks
well, in early game you have spios too. OKW don´t have a mainline infantery that can win 1v1 engagements with allies mainline infantery in the same way that allies engies can´t beat 1v1 sturmpios....so not sure about that, but hey, thanks for such a good response man, much appreciated. Again my knolegde of game mechanism and stats is not enough to talk properly about balance, just here to learn from others and to improve my performance with this game.
gonna let the thread continue now.....this is not a volks vs sherman thread hehehe.
Thanks australian!
An already muni starved faction (OKW) is now more muni starved and still can't build caches.
3 Dec 2015, 19:05 PM
#69
Posts: 657
Cleaned this up a bit. Let's try to keep this discussion on topic and forgo the ad hominem attacks. eh?
3 Dec 2015, 19:18 PM
#70
1 
Posts: 1276
I think an upgrade for the Sherman would be interesting. USF late game only includes the Jackson to deal with heavy (excluding the Pershing and ez8). Outside of those commanders usf is pretty bad.
Giving them this upgrade should cost like 30 fuel and maybe 200mp but should also lock you out of HE shells? maybe just give them an unlock button that unlocks the 76mm tank that soviets get.
Regardless, discusing OKW early game and how ez germs are is irreverent to the point of these posts. stay on topic and discus USF late game as this would be a way to buff other commanders like mechanized whos late game is garbage.
Giving them this upgrade should cost like 30 fuel and maybe 200mp but should also lock you out of HE shells? maybe just give them an unlock button that unlocks the 76mm tank that soviets get.
Regardless, discusing OKW early game and how ez germs are is irreverent to the point of these posts. stay on topic and discus USF late game as this would be a way to buff other commanders like mechanized whos late game is garbage.
3 Dec 2015, 19:36 PM
#71
Posts: 230
Permanently Banned
There is more but I cant be bothered, p4 was slightly inferior in almost every way.
Even so, p4 could shoot and penetrate almost anywhere on a sherman and penetrate, while the sherman 75 mm struggled to penetrate the inferior flat 80mm at long distances. Better armor doesn't matter if the enemies guns still cut through it like paper and your own guns still have trouble penetrating theirs.
3 Dec 2015, 20:24 PM
#72
Posts: 245
Even so, p4 could shoot and penetrate almost anywhere on a sherman and penetrate, while the sherman 75 mm struggled to penetrate the inferior flat 80mm at long distances. Better armor doesn't matter if the enemies guns still cut through it like paper and your own guns still have trouble penetrating theirs.
They had very similar guns but Shermans had better armor, the low velocity gun did make it worse at longer range though you are correct, but this also allowed for the Sherman to be an effective artillery weapon. And likewise the p4 couldn't sustain the bigger guns that could be added to the Sherman among HVAP and others things I mentioned, overall Sherman was better.
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