Calliope/ Goliath commanders incoming

FYI, to unlock all multiplayer stuff that affects the game (commanders + factions) the total cost will be (with the upcoming commanders) 184,64€.

You judge if the game is worth this much.

Dude no one buys everything at full price. I bought both WFAfor $2 USD and bought all the commanders for 75% off ... cost me $21 CANADIAN dollars to get every commander in the game (minues the British and very recent OKW/USF ones)

No it's not. It's like the relationship between the ML-20 and the Katyusha.

those axis players i remember a year ago when i asked for calliope , they said :

''no no you already have the m8 scott''

(where in the pudding the scott performs like a katyusha or walking stuka ??? ) are u f#$%g serious ?

but hey there we go pershing and calliope are out!!

those axis players i remember a year ago when i asked for calliope , they said :

''no no you already have the m8 scott''

(where in the pudding the scott performs like a katyusha or walking stuka ??? ) are u f#$%g serious ?

but hey there we go pershing and calliope are out!!

1 Year ago the M8 scott wiped squads, by just landing that 1 lucky RNG hit in the middle of the enemy squad, but you dont see that unit anymore in the USF META so i guess Relic "Fixed" it

Dude no one buys everything at full price. I bought both WFAfor $2 USD and bought all the commanders for 75% off ... cost me $21 CANADIAN dollars to get every commander in the game (minues the British and very recent OKW/USF ones)

Not everyone but most people bought CoH2 at launch, then they bought WFA at launch, then they bought UKF at launch and then they bought the associated commanders new commanders for full price, realistically speaking most people have spent around 100 - 120 € on this game but just because they didn't spend it all at once it doesn't magically reduce the money spent (which is still twice or thrice what's this game is worth), this however doesn't excuse that to unlock all the stuff in multiplayer and I want to underline that to have full access to all units/abilities combos available in the game you need to pay 184,64€..

And don't forget this is just for the competitive multiplayer part of the game, it doesn't include all the SP content + optional multiplayer content (skins,faceplates), it's quite frankly unheard of an RTS shipping it's Xpacs not tied with SP campaigns with the most recent example being legacy of the void.



Also you said you bought them on discount, may I point out the irony?

Are you 12 years old and don't get enough allowance money from your parents to spend $8 on new game content?

One quick edit: The price of the factions itself is fine (infact almost 2/3 of the full price comes from commanders), but paid commanders are a cancer that is helping this game to die rather quickly and that is preventing a lot of new blood from joining, that said I strongly encourage everyone to use the script to farm war spoils and use it to farm commanders.

New content is always appreciated, unless it is terribly unbalanced, but it would be nice if Relic would do a few things related to DLC:
1) Make more commander bundles
2) Make more Theater of War bundles
3) Modify existing Ostheer/Soviet commanders that are redundant
4) Update Theater of War missions with patches (still playing with 3 man weapon teams for Wehrmacht)
5) Give us something for duplicate War Spoils or prevent duplicates from dropping

This would appease the competitive players (commander re-work, drops, commander bundle) as well as the single-player/cpu-oriented players (theater of war bundle, commander bundle, war spoils).

These change would make potential buyers of CoH2 a lot more likely to purchase the game. Perhaps having bundles of the core game + faction add-ons shuffled around every couple of weeks on Steam would be a good idea as well. Or just put out a bunch of bundles.
I.e, singleplayer bundle: coh2 base game, Ardennes Assault, & all Theater of War packs.
Competitive bundle: coh2, WFA, UKF, various commanders, 2 skin sets/faction
Allies bundle: coh2, USF, UKF, various commanders, 2 skin sets/faction
Axis bundle: Coh2, OKW, various commanders, 2 skin sets/faction

It's all about expanding the playerbase because coh2 is extremely re-playable with the high volume of Relic maps as well as the incredibly high number of community maps and mods. Relic just has to reduce the cost of some of the dlc for single-player people or cpu-crushes, you know?

Edit: Relic, can I be your marketing strategist pls?
I'm a Canadian citizen so no extra paperwork required.

Hes one of those welfare people. Y'know good for nothing folks.

This post does show what kind of people you are

A tube of toothpaste cost more than a commander. Don't get me wrong, I would rather see more versatility in the non-doctrinal armies but "insane?"

I really love this game and i want to see it live very long, that's why i am saying this.
The insane part is, for example you get a new faction "UKF"(a hole new army) + 3 commanders for 10 bucks and then if you like you can get another 3 commanders again for 10 bucks. And to top it off, the + 3 commanders are better then the initial ones (most of them for all factions, not all of them).
If this does feel "right" with you, i don't know. Maybe i am "a good for nothing people" like your country man said earlier.

One question to all, how many people left the game or didn't even buy the game because of this policy?
Imo, to many

Uhm please dont give it cannon.

Then it will need to cost 200 fuel (110 for sherman , 90 for arty) for a squashy unit that can use 50% of it only when in danger and you dont want dont want to take risk with 200 fuel sherman

It doesn't. Only hull MG.

Shouldn't cost anymore than 100 fuel then hopefully.....hopefully....

hummel next plz

I am almost 40, i am working over 20 years.
I know EXACTLY how the companies work, that's why i am saying what i am saying. That's the hole point of what i am saying.
I paid over 120$ and i got many stuff on sales.
Btw I never said that i want free DLC, but 4 bucks every freaking commander every 3-4 months (that affect the multiplayer not in a good way btw). That's insane.
Relic is not a tiny company.
They improving the game? Do they really? Think about it. Its been two and a half years and i see the minimum improvement that is possible, sooooo many issues not addressed but oh look they can produce something (DLCs).
In one sentence, they are fixing the mistakes that they did since release and still keep doing the same mistakes.

Hey look, i am not ungrateful, they do good things too but its always like 1 step forward and 2 steps back in so many ways/areas.

And the milking is still going on

The game is getting better all the time. While they do manage to add in a new horror every patch, they also manage to improve overall gameplay.

Issues that they haven't fixed I believe are down to limited resources. Their team is small for a software company. If they had more money, they could hire more staff. If the game was more monetizable, they'd have more motivation to fix bugs faster to keep the money coming. I wish they'd release more content.


4 dollars every few months... Insane...? That's not even enough to buy a good cup of coffee in Russia. It would barely cover the fluffy caramel cream atop my scrumptious latte. It's absolutely affordable. How can you call that milking? It's a very very small amount of money for a player and even smaller for the company.



They have overheads. They are constantly spending money. If they don't make money, they can't continue to operate, let alone fix bugs.



TLDR - $4 is not insane. I don't think you know how companies work.

It doesn't. Only hull MG.

Shouldn't cost anymore than 100 fuel then hopefully.....hopefully....

Yes thx a god. I think it should be a katty tat fire all its rockets at once , with sherman survivability and with cost of 110 fuel (after OKW buffs i think its balanced when stuka now cot you 100 fuel not 150)

The game is getting better all the time. While they do manage to add in a new horror every patch, they also manage to improve overall gameplay.

Issues that they haven't fixed I believe are down to limited resources. Their team is small for a software company. If they had more money, they could hire more staff. If the game was more monetizable, they'd have more motivation to fix bugs faster to keep the money coming. I wish they'd release more content.


4 dollars every few months... Insane...? That's not even enough to buy a good cup of coffee in Russia. It would barely cover the fluffy caramel cream atop my scrumptious latte. It's absolutely affordable. How can you call that milking? It's a very very small amount of money for a player and even smaller for the company.



They have overheads. They are constantly spending money. If they don't make money, they can't continue to operate, let alone fix bugs.



TLDR - $4 is not insane. I don't think you know how companies work.

+1 to bulgakov

Yes thx a god. I think it should be a katty tat fire all its rockets at once , with sherman survivability and with cost of 110 fuel (after OKW buffs i think its balanced when stuka now cot you 100 fuel not 150)

Yeah sounds reasonable enough. Any more than 110 and its pushing it..

It's not about money nor about supporting the company or not.

-First of all, this is a fullprice game. Not a F2P with a freemium model.
-It's too much to expect that in an RTS both players have access to equal tools to defeat each other and not because i've the competitive commanders i've an edge over my opponent?
-Charging for recycled things.
-Cost of DLC comparison to base game or factions. I'll could care less if the sum of cosmetics, shortcut bundles or singleplayer experience on an MP based game cost more, but not when, in this case, commanders, cost more than the game itself.

Thing is: how hard it to put everything on a bundle or season pass?

It's not about money nor about supporting the company or not.

-First of all, this is a fullprice game. Not a F2P with a freemium model.
-It's too much to expect that in an RTS both players have access to equal tools to defeat each other and not because i've the competitive commanders i've an edge over my opponent?
-Charging for recycled things.
-Cost of DLC comparison to base game or factions. I'll could care less if the sum of cosmetics, shortcut bundles or singleplayer experience on an MP based game cost more, but not when, in this case, commanders, cost more than the game itself.

Thing is: how hard it to put everything on a bundle or season pass?

this this this this

its not about the money its about the principle.

if i want to play a competitive game ( shooter, moba, rts) then i expect to be on a equal playing ground with my enemy.period.

and like elchino7 said, its not a f2p game its a full price game which locks important/gamechanging content behind microtransactions.

Stop defending p2w bullshit. No commander should be better in every situation than others, especially considering current war spoils system.

I want the goliath to park him behind a corner and drive into the enemy blob. Surprise

I want the goliath to park him behind a corner and drive into the enemy blob. Surprise

Why drive and risk premature explosion, when you can just let the blob walk on top of you, and BOOM! (in b4 Goliath OP, "Get Minesweepers")

Goliath will be OP if used corectly.

I dont know if you remeber but in coh1 there was no LOS system and you canot hide units behind sightblockers because you can see 360 non scope even trought semoskyi church

Now if used corectly it can kill many units (its demo on wheels and you can always put lone volks in front of it to scout for it)


But i think it will be fine because the docttine does not give you nothing else too much special(except maybe radar trucks that can workd greatly in konjuction with goliath) - no call in infantry , no oswind , no supernades , no supression platform , no marktarget panther , no jagertiger , no flamwtreower , no cheesy sturmtiger

Land mattress for UKF next please XD

It's not about money nor about supporting the company or not.

-First of all, this is a fullprice game. Not a F2P with a freemium model.
-It's too much to expect that in an RTS both players have access to equal tools to defeat each other and not because i've the competitive commanders i've an edge over my opponent?
-Charging for recycled things.
-Cost of DLC comparison to base game or factions. I'll could care less if the sum of cosmetics, shortcut bundles or singleplayer experience on an MP based game cost more, but not when, in this case, commanders, cost more than the game itself.

Thing is: how hard it to put everything on a bundle or season pass?

This

Any COH2 veteran capable of critical thinking should know by now ITS NOT ABOUT MONEY but rather the flawed marketing strategy. This go way beyond just some disgruntled COH players and actual goes back 20 years to the former SEGA CEO, Tom Kalinske and how Sega of Japan executives forced him to leave.
SEGA have never recovered after that and now just a shadow of its former self. Tom Kalinske as a innovative visionary was to SEGA as Bill Gates was to Microsoft.

Seriously stop bad-mouthing COH2 fans that criticize the way Relic/SEGA monetize this game. Even the new SEGA CEO Haruki Satomi (son of Hajime Satomi), openly said SEGA/SAMMY Holdings marketing strategy failed and promised fans big change.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sega_Sammy_Holdings

Whatever you believe the new SEGA CEO or not, there is no doubt that SEGA/SAMMY Holdings marketing strategy hasn't done much to earn consumer trust. That can't be debatable, its a fact and we got everything to back this up beyond any shadow of a doubt.
At very least read the comments from the SEGA CEO and get your head into the game what this is about before putting words into our mouth.
Personally, I would be happy paying a monthly subscription to play multiplayer but that marketing strategy won't work for COH2.

Now for aspiring eSport games, quality over quantity/new content.

President of Sega Games Finally Realizes That Gaming Quality Is Important
http://www.forbes.com/sites/olliebarder/2015/07/08/president-of-sega-japan-finally-realizes-that-gaming-quality-is-important/

First a bit of context, the company is actually part of Sammy Corporation who bought out Sega a fair few years ago. Sammy has a history of mostly doing pachinko in Japan and while they did a few games over the years, it was never their main line of business.

So the direction of Sega since Sammy took over is not an entirely surprising one, as they’ve almost ignored what made games work and went after what they thought would make money based on their pachinko expertise.

We Betrayed Fans And Want to Be a Brand Again, Says Sega CEO
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/we-betrayed-fans-and-want-to-be-a-brand-again-says/1100-6428680/

Interviews with the most successful SEGA CEO of America, Tom Kalinske

http://www.sega-16.com/2005/02/tom-kalinske-american-samurai/
http://www.sega-16.com/2006/07/interview-tom-kalinske/
https://soundcloud.com/retrogamingreddit/rretrogaming-podcast-episode-07-tom-kalinske-speaks-about-his-time-as-sega-of-americas-ceo?in=retrogamingreddit/sets/the-r-retrogaming-podcast-all

No other president before him ever gave Sega the level of success he did, and none since have ever equaled it. One could even go so far as to say that Sega lasted as long as it did as a hardware manufacturer thanks to Kalinske’s efforts during the 16-bit era.
It sure wasn’t because of Sega of Japan.

Tom Kalinske: Sega's Been Doing It Wrong for The Past 20 Years!
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2015-02-23-is-sega-the-next-atari

To make a long story short, Tom Kalinske came close to secure a partnership with Sony. Sega of Japan said no. If the Japan executives had said yes, then the Playstation would never have existed and SEGA/Sony partnership would have become the primary console manufacturer. This epic marketing failure should speak for itself.

http://www.esportsearnings.com/
There is not one top10 eSport game that use full priced game + DLC whoring with questionable quality. It's either the freemium model/microtransactions, subscriptions or full priced games such as Starcraft with quality DLC expansions. To suggest that the current COH2 marketing strategy is going to work for eSport are just absurd.

Esport is an investment, not a golden goose by itself. If new eSport games such as COH2 can't draw in millions of new players then it's a bad investment. There is not a snowball chance in hell, Relic/SEGA can draw in millions of new COH players with the current marketing strategy. Relic's sister studio, Creative Assembly figured this out years ago and now use the WoT FTP model for their eSport game TW: Arena.

5 Marketing Tricks That League Of Legends Used To Build a Billion Dollar Business
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/5-marketing-tricks-league-legends-used-build-billion-dollar-butkus

Several big eSport games came from humble beginnings without a big marketing budget but they knew how to use "word-of-mouth" marketing that are very cost-effective if done right. It's unlikely SEGA/Relic have a big marketing budget for COH2 so if they are not able and willing to use word-of-mouth" marketing then COH2 eSport are RIP.

http://www.nielsen.com/us/en/insights/news/2013/under-the-influence-consumer-trust-in-advertising.html

Word-of-mouth recommendations from friends and family, often referred to as earned advertising, are still the most influential, as 84 percent of global respondents across 58 countries

Consumer trust and positive brand advocates are everything in "word-of-mouth" marketing. Games such as League of legends encourages you to play with your friends and this results in many players joining through word-of-mouth marketing.
A good FTP model, turn the consumer into the "salesman". League of Legends was one of the first games to show that word-of-mouth marketing + micro transactions can be the primary source of income for a game without sacrificing game quality.

With all the DLC currently in COH2, it's a logical next step to give a taste for free. No one that understand the eSport FTP model is saying that Relic/SEGA should give everything away for free. But there is no reason why one eastern front faction such as Ostheer can't be FTP + 2 week free trial for all Ostheer premium commanders. Then part of the core gameplay would be easily accessible and COH2 would lose its P2W reputation and draw new players in by word-of-mouth.

If the marketing team behind COH2 don't wake up, then new players are just going to start using https://www.g2a.com (resellers) or worse they will try to pirate the game. Also, trolling new players with RNG war spoils only does more harm than good to COH2s online reputation.