grenadier/panzergrenadier lack of survivability

What infantry do you build for wehrmacht to play lategame?There is no answer from allied fanboys.

Rifleman didn't really need that buff to its veterancy. The only problem with their scaling was the price of the bar.

right now it feels like the m1919a6 rifleman blob is unstoppable. The dual bren blob is just as overpowered as well. At least conscript lack upgrade except for their PTRS and PPSH.

Please don't let this devolve into name calling.

What infantry do you build for wehrmacht to play lategame?There is no answer from allied fanboys.

You combine them. Instead of spaming 3 gren/pgren, you build 2 + 1 MG42. But thats requires a bit of micro.

Like i said all allied fanboys are silent on what infantry you build as wehrmacht to counter this unstoppable usf/ukf lategame horde.Just 1 sided massacre.

Like i said all allied fanboys are silent on what infantry you build as wehrmacht to counter this unstoppable usf/ukf lategame horde.Just 1 sided massacre.

If you are serious in your request, I tend to have this in late game: 2 Pios (one sweeper, one flamer), 2 LMG Grens, 2 HMG42, 2 Paks, 2 Mortars. If I feels that's not enough ill build some Pgrens, or a aditional LMG Gren squad.

Split the team weapons into two groups of equal size to defend your main battle line and support the infantry while advancing. If you have problems with Rifle or Cons blobbs late game, go get a Panzerwerfer or a Brummbär to punish the horde.

If you are serious in your request, I tend to have this in late game: 2 Pios (one sweeper, one flamer), 2 LMG Grens, 2 HMG42, 2 Paks, 2 Mortars. If I feels that's not enough ill build some Pgrens, or a aditional LMG Gren squad.

Split the team weapons into two groups of equal size to defend your main battle line and support the infantry while advancing. If you have problems with Rifle or Cons blobbs late game, go get a Panzerwerfer or a Brummbär to punish the horde.

Thats alot of units versus 4 riflemen
I would never build 2mgs atm with how many smokes are a avaible and how easy they are overrun

Thats alot of units versus 4 riflemen
I would never build 2mgs atm with how many smokes are a avaible and how easy they are overrun

True thing. Another strategy is to put the second HMG behind the first one. If the smoke blob hits you, it will run into the second HMG after the first one retreated/moved.

BTW Iam talking mostly from my 2v2 perspective.

True thing. Another strategy is to put the second HMG behind the first one. If the smoke blob hits you, it will run into the second HMG after the first one retreated/moved.

BTW Iam talking mostly from my 2v2 perspective.

If you spread them out you can easily smoke the second one, the smoke has a huge range. I really dislike mg versus USF especially, 1 max for the Support of your grens to take one rifle squad out of fight (you should not Focus the Pinned squad because they get a Def Bonus)

Edit: but I see your point, in 2v2 several mgs can be viable

You just don't fight ukf and usf infantry with grens alone, it's meant to be like that. Wehrmacht has really good team weapons that make probably the best combined arms of all the factions. That's asymmetric balance, the very same reason for USF not having a KT (well, yet).

You mean the best HMG of the game? The brits vickers is the best HMG, not MG42. The pak40 is the best AT of the game? NO, the brits 6 pounder AT gun have the same stats with pak but a 50% bonuses accuracy. It's the best. The ost mortars is the best? NO, the brits mortar pit has huge 115 range and 2 mortars cost 400MP/8pop, of counse it's much better than the Ostheer mortars which has poor 80 range and only 1 mortar.

Wehrmacht has really good team weapons that make probably the best combined arms of all the factions?

Faulse.

If you are serious in your request, I tend to have this in late game: 2 Pios (one sweeper, one flamer), 2 LMG Grens, 2 HMG42, 2 Paks, 2 Mortars. If I feels that's not enough ill build some Pgrens, or a aditional LMG Gren squad.

Split the team weapons into two groups of equal size to defend your main battle line and support the infantry while advancing. If you have problems with Rifle or Cons blobbs late game, go get a Panzerwerfer or a Brummbär to punish the horde.

You can hold a battle line with 2 lmg42grens and 2 mg42s basically and a flamer?How can this not get rolled by vetted m1919 blob or is blob lategame?I think you are talking about midgame for which this composition is viable.

You mean the best HMG of the game? The brits vickers is the best HMG, not MG42. The pak40 is the best AT of the game? NO, the brits 6 pounder AT gun have the same stats with pak but a 50% bonuses accuracy. It's the best. The ost mortars is the best? NO, the brits mortar pit has huge 115 range and 2 mortars cost 400MP/8pop, of counse it's much better than the Ostheer mortars which has poor 80 range and only 1 mortar.

Wehrmacht has really good team weapons that make probably the best combined arms of all the factions?

Faulse.

Vickers suppresses slightly slower and has less DPS than MG42 at far range, it also costs 20 more, trading off cost and overall efficiency for garrison performance. MG42 also doesn't have to oppose rifle grenades.

Pak fires faster than 6pounder and has target weak point as a vet ability, definitely not weak, more of an issu with 6pounder cost. Also don't forget that brits don't have a tank snare.

Ost mortar is actually mobile and can't be just rushed with a shitton of infantry and wiped, not to mention the possibility of recrew. It actually has 60 range and is 240 MP. Ost mortar can be used reliably as a component of combined arms, mortar pit cannot due to lack of mobility.

Vickers suppresses slightly slower and has less DPS than MG42 at far range, it also costs 20 more, trading off cost and overall efficiency for garrison performance. MG42 also doesn't have to oppose rifle grenades.

Pak fires faster than 6pounder and has target weak point as a vet ability, definitely not weak, more of an issu with 6pounder cost. Also don't forget that brits don't have a tank snare.

Ost mortar is actually mobile and can't be just rushed with a shitton of infantry and wiped, not to mention the possibility of recrew. It actually has 60 range and is 240 MP. Ost mortar can be used reliably as a component of combined arms, mortar pit cannot due to lack of mobility.

Pak fires faster? I remeber Cruzz saying all statt are 100% the same except the massive (lol) +50% accuracy. Its massive cheaper too so the vickers 20mp more is irrelevant. And you fight around a mortar put, if you have the same force u will win every fight around your mortar pit. Dont build it some Where Alone and Expect it to face roll they enemy like leigs and howies
Edit: didnt the sniper have a snare ability?! So ukf has a viable even long range snare Option.

If you spread them out you can easily smoke the second one, the smoke has a huge range. I really dislike mg versus USF especially, 1 max for the Support of your grens to take one rifle squad out of fight (you should not Focus the Pinned squad because they get a Def Bonus)

Edit: but I see your point, in 2v2 several mgs can be viable

As wehrmacht you can't realy do much from infantry point of view. Of course you can rely on hmgs and mortars, they are good, but you will lack a very important feature: mobility. Which, can be provided only by the weak core infantry. Wehrmacht mortars are not what they were anymore so it's realy not worth it to have a turtle-like start.

So I prefer to spam grenadiers and back them with an mg OR a sniper. If you are decent at sniper play, this is the best way to go in my opinion. Further, though the Scout car was built to chase snipers, it can't realy chase anything ( and especialy the british sniper who can shot, disable the gun, then scram - woo-haa, what a balanced sniper being able to block it's verry counters lel), because of poor durability so if you don't desperately need it, just don't build it. Anyway against brits it's not worth building any kind of light vehicle because it will be enough to stumble upon a Bofors or take a double mortar hit and it's gone like smoke and you threw a much needed cup of fuel to garbage. From T2 pak40s are still good and if you have enough amo even a squad of pzgrens in order to be upgraded with shrecks. Then, if your opponent it's a noob you can fuck around like this until T4 with some mines in addition, if not, you will probably lose, but anyway go for stugs, they will help you hold the line. For a while.

Pak fires faster? I remeber Cruzz saying all statt are 100% the same except the massive (lol) +50% accuracy. Its massive cheaper too so the vickers 20mp more is irrelevant. And you fight around a mortar put, if you have the same force u will win every fight around your mortar pit. Dont build it some Where Alone and Expect it to face roll they enemy like leigs and howies
Edit: didnt the sniper have a snare ability?! So ukf has a viable even long range snare Option.

I checked the stats (stat.coh2.hu) and the 6poudner's and Pak40's stats are indeed the same, including accuracy. Now there maybe is a hidden accuracy modifier, but if there isn't, the lesser cost is justified by an inferior vet3 ability.

I can't see how vickers 20 mp is irrelevant when brits lack manpower so much. You shouldn't justify UP things (vickers) with OP things (6pounder).

If you fight around a mortar pit, you will indeed win every fight with equal forces, that's what it is supposed to do, and the case is the same for regular mortars.

Sniper has a snare ability... which engine crits only light vehicles of which the only actually dangerous one is the Flak HT. It doesn't really help with tanks, and it is locked behind an optional T2 unit. UKF doesn't have reliable AT besides the 6pounder and Comet (firefly 10 sec reload nfPeter, so it really has to be good (although maybe not that good in the case 6pounder really has +50% accuracy).

So no one has any idea how to make wehrmacht infantry be minimal level survivable lategame still?They are losing ridiculously badly lategame vs tommies and usf infantry.

So no one has any idea how to make wehrmacht infantry be minimal level survivable lategame still?They are losing ridiculously badly lategame vs tommies and usf infantry.

Nerf them.

I checked the stats (stat.coh2.hu) and the 6poudner's and Pak40's stats are indeed the same, including accuracy. Now there maybe is a hidden accuracy modifier, but if there isn't, the lesser cost is justified by an inferior vet3 ability.

I can't see how vickers 20 mp is irrelevant when brits lack manpower so much. You shouldn't justify UP things (vickers) with OP things (6pounder).

If you fight around a mortar pit, you will indeed win every fight with equal forces, that's what it is supposed to do, and the case is the same for regular mortars.

Sniper has a snare ability... which engine crits only light vehicles of which the only actually dangerous one is the Flak HT. It doesn't really help with tanks, and it is locked behind an optional T2 unit. UKF doesn't have reliable AT besides the 6pounder and Comet (firefly 10 sec reload nfPeter, so it really has to be good (although maybe not that good in the case 6pounder really has +50% accuracy).

What if I tell you the 6 pounder fires more faster than the zis3? Yes it's about 1 second faster.And you know how much the zis3 cost right? As I said the 6 pounder is the BEST stock AT gun of the game.It has a 50% bonus accuracy for cheap MP/POP cost.

Then don't protect the brits then.The new faction have got alot of better units and abilities than the old ones.If you really know this game,you will agree with me.

Make it possible to get 5 man squads at T4 and nerf the shrek to vcoh level.

Make it happen Relic.