Fallschimjager and obersoldaten suck !!

Can you read?

When did I, or anyone else in this thread say anything at all about commandos? They're not even mentioned in the OP and they're not even hinted at in the title. Why bring them up? When did I ever even remotely imply that they were shit?

I stated a fact. Obers, especially when vetted are the strongest single infantry squad in the game. Most EHP, amazing vet bonuses

Of course commandos are good, perhaps even too strong given that they're a call-in and do not require tech like Obers do, but no infantry squad in this game comes close to vet 3+ Obers.

ciez the problem is the large input cost and it takes a while to vet up even then obers i have tested died to 2 bar rifleman...the point is obers are not general unit they are anti infy sepcialist for thier cost they are not performing good they were fine before their post-lmg ajdustment damage they had....lots of people forget that obers were op when all lmgs were op and had 25 % accuracy on move

Obers are fine now.

Fallschirmjäger aren´t super bad by nature. They are just not good either. For a unit that´s locked behind a doctrine, I expect more. For a unit that´s locked behind a doctrine without any other significant features, I expect a lot more.

Having other doctrines available that offer good infantry (Jäger-Infanterie, Panzerfüsilier) and on top better abilites and units (Ostwind or Jagdtiger), I´m not going to choose Fallschirmäger.

For a unit that´s locked behind a doctrine without any other significant features, I expect a lot more.

Popping out of ambient buildings, camo, 2 types of nades, pfaust, effective at all ranges without additional side costs, self regenerating with vet.

Really?

The only infantry with somewhat comparable kit are commandos.

Popping out of ambient buildings, camo, 2 types of nades, pfaust, effective at all ranges without additional side costs, self regenerating with vet.

Really?

The only infantry with somewhat comparable kit are commandos.

oh you mean dirt cheap partisans

Popping out of ambient buildings, camo, 2 types of nades, pfaust, effective at all ranges without additional side costs, self regenerating with vet.

Really?

The only infantry with somewhat comparable kit are commandos.

Super fragile, still high reinforcement cost and price to field. For ??170?? mp less you can get a durable, cheaper to reinforce 6men squad and have the availability to get a JT. I have lost count on the times I lost full Fallschirmjäger squads senselessly due to their fragility. If I lose Panzerfüsiliere it´s usually my fault.

Or you simply build Obersoldaten.

Not worth choosing a doctrine for that.

Obersoldaten and Fallschirmjagers perform very well.

If a player keep losing them constantly against other infantry squads; it is merely because A) He can't micro them properly B) "Yoloes" them as if they were shock troops/conscripts.
Sit them behind cover and witness how amazing they are.

Which brings their achilles heel, and it's a substantial one. Full health squads get insta-wiped far too often by pack howies, scotts, 120mm mortars or other sources of indirect fire. That's over 440 manpower (+60 munis for Obers) drained, quite reliably.

Both units could use a "flack jacket" upgrade that would increase resistance to explosive AoE damage for something like 30-40 munitions.

It's the only reason I prefer to use G43 panzerfusilier blops over them. At least they can survive the constant shelling that blagues the current meta.

i wouldn't buff then with direct numbers but i would love to see fjs, jli, obers and pfuss (maybe?) would benefit from a 20-30% reduction in vetting requrements

Fallsch just suffer from costing to much to deploy versus their actual performance later on. Their veterancy is crap (as in they end up with only slightly more received accuracy than Riflemen do and still less effective health than Cons or Riflemen at Vet 5) when compared to their price resulting in them being useful as Katyusha killer or line breakers and not actually a unit you incorporate into your army.

They also lose so much DPS per dead model member compared to say, LMG Para's (or any other LMG unit) that they just can't really hack it in the current LMG meta.

Fallsch Effective Health at Vet 5: 575

Obersoldat Effective Health at Vet 5: 906

Conscript Effective Health at Vet 3: 738

Riflemen Effective Health at Vet 3: 669

Also Ober's current vet (and the proliferation of building maps and shitloads of cover) makes them much more suited for CQC with IR StG 44's that partially ignore cover than LMG34's because the enemy can pump out more LMG's on more basic/cheaper infantry than you will ever be able to.

I should also mention Fallsch don't actually get offensive vet until vet 4 meaning that for 1-3 they will be putting out as much DPS as they always did.

My suggestion for making Fallsch and Obers more attractive would be to add an extra man onto Fallsch and make them come in by Paradrop (like Paratroopers, just with no scatter and a faster plane) and maaaybe give them a little more survivability. For Obers I would just make them come with regular StG 44's standard and simply convert the StG's into IR ones for free with Spec Op's. Make the LMG34 upgrade function like heavy engineers, you get a fuckload of survivability to small arms but in combat you move slowly.

(like Paratroopers, just with no scatter and a faster plane)

Is that fanboyism at it's best or is there a particular reason why you want them to "drop better" than paras?

obers are fine performance wise with the lmg, with out the lmg they are not worth the 400 mp. they should come out with the lmg as standard or reduce the mp cost of the unit.

the whole fallshirmjager doc is useless, from abilities to the call in units but to be fair for that price mg34 is ok.

falls just suck plain and simple as shown here, http://www.coh2.org/topic/40161/falls-current-performance-replay

Is that fanboyism at it's best or is there a particular reason why you want them to "drop better" than paras?

They currently pop out of buildings with zero warning with perfect accuracy, so I don't know about you but that seems a little bit better than calling in a plane and waiting for them to complete a drop were they might take causalities.

EDIT: They also cost a lot more than Para's do as well.

Falls should be cheaper and come with G41s that have a profile similar to M1 Garand. Then buff FG42 by a lot and make it muni upgrade.

its just -10% reinfocement cost and okw dot have manpower problem the problem is the unist are not performing might as well take back the reinformcent buff....the faction elite should be eilte the rife and cons buff make it a lot harder...everyone here is having a knee jerk reaction......just look at ocf maybe only 2 obers were build wher the okw was facing massive infantry bobs and they get wrecked and the fallshimjagers just got anhiliated in OCF

It was -10mp reduction, not -10%. (-20% for obers actually)