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Air Supremacy

25 Sep 2015, 20:27 PM
#1
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

It appears Relic reused the old Urban Assault bombing ability without changing it and I think it's resulting in the ability being more powerful than intended. Also it seems to use HE111's instead of Lancasters.





Here's the code for the ability's showing it uses the Ostheer Tac Bombers (HE111's)

| | | | | | | aircraft_squad_name: "tactical_bombers";
| | | | | | | attack_info: {
| | | | | | | | attack_sway_frequency: 1f;
| | | | | | | | attack_sway_width: 1f;
| | | | | | | | attacks_per_aircraft: 1;
| | | | | | | | delay_between_attack: 1f;
| | | | | | | | initial_attack_delay: 0f;
| | | | | | | | target_attack_distance: 100f;
| | | | | | | | target_attack_time_sec: 2.125f;
| | | | | | | | target_lead_in_distance: 40f;
| | | | | | | | target_lead_out_distance: 40f;
| | | | | | | };
| | | | | | | loiter_info: {
| | | | | | | | 0x200C8104: 0f;
| | | | | | | | 0x5543314C: true;
| | | | | | | | 0x6651A0F5: false;
| | | | | | | | 0xB01F66E7: 0f;
| | | | | | | | follow_target: false;
| | | | | | | | loiter_area_radius: 50f;
| | | | | | | | loiter_time_sec: 0f;
| | | | | | | };
| | | | | | | number_aircraft: 3;
| | | | | | | random_direction: false;
| | | | | | | search_attack_target: false;
| | | | | | | source_offset_x: 1f;
| | | | | | | source_offset_y: 1f;
| | | | | | | source_offset_z: 1f;
| | | | | | | target_info: {
| | | | | | | | $REF: "type_ability_target_type\is_position.lua";
| | | | | | | };
| | | | | | | time_range_between_planes_maximum: 1f;
| | | | | | | time_range_between_planes_minimum: 1f;
| | | | | | | use_long_path: false;


| | | | | | | | | aircraft_squad_name: "tactical_bombers_accurate";
| | | | | | | | | attack_info: {
| | | | | | | | | | attack_sway_frequency: 1f;
| | | | | | | | | | attack_sway_width: 1f;
| | | | | | | | | | attacks_per_aircraft: 1;
| | | | | | | | | | delay_between_attack: 1f;
| | | | | | | | | | initial_attack_delay: 0f;
| | | | | | | | | | target_attack_distance: 100f;
| | | | | | | | | | target_attack_time_sec: 2.125f;
| | | | | | | | | | target_lead_in_distance: 40f;
| | | | | | | | | | target_lead_out_distance: 40f;
| | | | | | | | | };
| | | | | | | | | loiter_info: {
| | | | | | | | | | 0x200C8104: 0f;
| | | | | | | | | | 0x5543314C: true;
| | | | | | | | | | 0x6651A0F5: false;
| | | | | | | | | | 0xB01F66E7: 0f;
| | | | | | | | | | follow_target: false;
| | | | | | | | | | loiter_area_radius: 50f;
| | | | | | | | | | loiter_time_sec: 0f;
| | | | | | | | | };
| | | | | | | | | number_aircraft: 2;
| | | | | | | | | random_direction: false;
| | | | | | | | | search_attack_target: false;
| | | | | | | | | source_offset_x: 2f;
| | | | | | | | | source_offset_y: 2f;
| | | | | | | | | source_offset_z: 2f;
| | | | | | | | | target_info: {
| | | | | | | | | | $REF: "type_ability_target_type\is_position.lua";
| | | | | | | | | };
| | | | | | | | | time_range_between_planes_maximum: 1f;
| | | | | | | | | time_range_between_planes_minimum: 1f;
| | | | | | | | | use_long_path: false;


This results in the ability doing 6000 damage over a large area, to put this in perspective each one of those precision bomb strikes from the last 2 planes have a higher AoE than the IL-2 bomb strike.
25 Sep 2015, 20:30 PM
#2
avatar of Jackiebrown

Posts: 657

Words

Maybe they are setting up for all out OP war, they might add Urban Assault if that is the case. :megusta:
25 Sep 2015, 20:53 PM
#3
avatar of dasheepeh

Posts: 2115 | Subs: 1

it costs a whopping 325 munitions, it really needs to do something
25 Sep 2015, 20:55 PM
#4
avatar of Budwise
Admin Red  Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 2075 | Subs: 2

Thats the thing, it shouldnt cost 325 munitions. It should be brought down to something 250ish and it should be properly balanced instead of F-it lets just make it super OP and super expensive.
25 Sep 2015, 20:58 PM
#5
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

it costs a whopping 325 munitions, it really needs to do something


2 IL-2 bomb strikes cost 400 munitions, this ability gives you 2 even more powerful IL-2 bomb strikes as well as 3 more large spread bomb strikes. Even Scavenge at max munitions (700) does 6400 damage which is only 400 more than the Air Supremacy call in does while requiring more than twice as much munitions.
25 Sep 2015, 21:08 PM
#6
avatar of dasheepeh

Posts: 2115 | Subs: 1



2 IL-2 bomb strikes cost 400 munitions, this ability gives you 2 even more powerful IL-2 bomb strikes as well as 3 more large spread bomb strikes. Even Scavenge at max munitions (700) does 6400 damage which is only 400 more than the Air Supremacy call in does while requiring more than twice as much munitions.


i personally find it really easy to dodge, i didnt have any issues with it yet

a quick il2 bomb run with the plane positioned right can hurt you way more in many situations
25 Sep 2015, 21:17 PM
#7
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1



i personally find it really easy to dodge, i didnt have any issues with it yet

a quick il2 bomb run with the plane positioned right can hurt you way more in many situations


Being able to blow up every truck or half the buildings in your base sector is somewhat problematic. But this thread or more to see weather Relic intended it to be so powerful. I assume they didn't because they just copy pasted an old ability.
25 Sep 2015, 21:28 PM
#8
avatar of dasheepeh

Posts: 2115 | Subs: 1



Being able to blow up every truck or half the buildings in your base sector is somewhat problematic. But this thread or more to see weather Relic intended it to be so powerful. I assume they didn't because they just copy pasted an old ability.


thats weird, because the airsupremacy dropped on my med and flak truck in a 1v1 today really didnt damage them much :guyokay:
25 Sep 2015, 21:29 PM
#9
avatar of Cabreza

Posts: 656

Air supremacy is pretty ridiculous, particularly vs OKW atm. I often see it paired with strafing support for a nuke everything around your truck combo in 2s. On larger open maps you can dodge it but on maps such as semoisky there often isn't enough room + pathing issues which prevent you from getting out of the way in time. The strength, and as a result price, of air supremacy need to be reduced to the point that it isn't consistently nuking OKW structures or leaving them with a sliver of health.

It appears Relic reused the old Urban Assault bombing ability without changing it and I think it's resulting in the ability being more powerful than intended. Also it seems to use HE111's instead of Lancasters.


It isn't uncommon for coders to re-use existing code rather than creating all new code. Particularly when the existing code isn't currently being used. It's lazy but probably intended since you never even see the planes. How they thought the ability would be balanced for the Brits when it wasn't for Wher though is beyond me.
25 Sep 2015, 21:34 PM
#10
avatar of adrian23

Posts: 87

I was hoping relic will leave behind this practice of copy pasta abillities from 1 commander to another ... Nope ..
25 Sep 2015, 21:36 PM
#11
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

Tac Bombs:

| | | can_harm_shooter: false;
| | | damage: {
| | | | far: 0.05f;
| | | | mid: 0.35f;
| | | | near: 1f;
| | | };

IL-2 Bombs:

| | | can_harm_shooter: false;
| | | damage: {
| | | | far: 0.05f;
| | | | mid: 0.15f;
| | | | near: 1f;
| | | };


That's the difference in AoE between the IL-2 strike and the Tac Bombing strike.

The ability for this to almost or instantly kill OKW trucks isn't really shared by any other ability in the game, even a direct hit from an IL-2 strike will only almost kill it. Mech Artillery takes 2 uses (360 muni)
25 Sep 2015, 21:43 PM
#12
avatar of DonnieChan

Posts: 2272 | Subs: 1

but
but
but

i thought the brits were so well designed......
25 Sep 2015, 21:44 PM
#13
avatar of Iron Emperor

Posts: 1653

I have already made a post about this, nerf it please
25 Sep 2015, 21:53 PM
#14
avatar of Robbie_Rotten
Donator 11

Posts: 412

I really don't care about them having HE111 models because it doesn't matter. I mean, the Fallschirmjaeger drop out of a stuka...

The point is the ability is so stupid, along with any kind of kill everything alpha strike/ability that the brits have.

The game was fun when it was a challenge to kill stuff...now its just. Lets rush these crazy op units. :foreveralone:
25 Sep 2015, 21:59 PM
#15
avatar of A Cuddly Teddy Bear

Posts: 81

Permanently Banned
I really don't care about them having HE111 models because it doesn't matter. I mean, the Fallschirmjaeger drop out of a stuka...

The point is the ability is so stupid, along with any kind of kill everything alpha strike/ability that the brits have.

The game was fun when it was a challenge to kill stuff...now its just. Lets rush these crazy op units. :foreveralone:
25 Sep 2015, 22:04 PM
#16
avatar of Omega_Warrior

Posts: 2561

I think we all agree it shouldn't kill the OKW buildings outright. But at that cost and delay, it deserves to kill everything else that stupid enough to stay within it's AoE.

Neither OKW base building or UKF emplacements should be killable by a single strike, period.
25 Sep 2015, 22:18 PM
#17
avatar of A Cuddly Teddy Bear

Posts: 81

Permanently Banned
I think we all agree it shouldn't kill the OKW buildings outright. But at that cost and delay, it deserves to kill everything else that stupid enough to stay within it's AoE.

Neither OKW base building or UKF emplacements should be killable by a single strike, period.


Like someone already stated, pathing and cramped maps can make this ability way to effective. Should be nerfed. There is a reason they took it out at first for Axis.
26 Sep 2015, 00:52 AM
#18
avatar of Omega_Warrior

Posts: 2561



Like someone already stated, pathing and cramped maps can make this ability way to effective. Should be nerfed. There is a reason they took it out at first for Axis.
15 seconds is plenty of time to get anything that isn't a crippled heavy tank out of it's AOE. No map or pathing is that bad. It is meant to be the most powerful and expensive call in ability. There is no justification of any unit being able to sit in it's AoE and tank the damage.
26 Sep 2015, 01:59 AM
#19
avatar of Corsin

Posts: 600

If people are not willing to work around a nerf to the ability...

I guess the only solution left is to buff the HP of the trucks.
26 Sep 2015, 02:34 AM
#20
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

15 seconds is plenty of time to get anything that isn't a crippled heavy tank out of it's AOE. No map or pathing is that bad. It is meant to be the most powerful and expensive call in ability. There is no justification of any unit being able to sit in it's AoE and tank the damage.


The problem is that it costs far less but does way more damage. It does only slightly less damage than Scavenge artillery with 700 munitions does and it does it over twice as large an area. It can one shot multiple OKW trucks, you can't even kill 1 OKW truck with IL-2 bomb strike and that's 200 munitions.

As USF to kill 1 OKW truck with call in artillery you need 360 munitions. As soviets you need 400. Why should Brit's have the ability to do far, far more for much much cheaper?
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