Partisan SMGs

I know, we'd never thought for once in the entire history of CoH where partisans would actually get a thread on balance because of how they used to be mediocre then garbage for a long while.

But with the recent changes, the partisan DPS seems pretty ridiculous for what you get and when you can get them. It may be my overreaction, but their shock value is insane. If I'm looking at the stats right in the editor, they dish out 21 DPS up to 10m before drastically dropping like most SMGs.

Yes, they form the backbone of that particular doctrine, but a 1CP unit that dishes out more DPS than shocks that spawns from structures for around 210mp and has camo? Did someone paradrop the old UKF commandos onto the Eastern Front and made them dress up as partisans or something?

Unless they become very costly to the point where they become one-trick ponies which is never good for any unit, I think the DPS levels should at least be lowered to 13 minimum or so which is similar to the Guard PPSH given the cost of the unit.

From 7.82 dps to 21 dps. Relic, how does this keep happening?

It should definately be allowed to stay as a shock unit, but that's too high. They should look at the average performance of JLI and Falls, then tweak it from there. Although I don't want the costs to go up too much, because Partisans aren't a fighting force unlike JLI or Falls.

1) You compare them to storms, not shocks.
2) Storms have 0.7 rec acc modifier, partisans don't. This makes partisans die like flies, storms don't.
3) Storms have much stronger AI and AT upgrades that come with ability supporting that weapon choice, partisans don't.
4) Yes, you're overreacting, because partisans up until now were shooting rubber bullets and if their molo haven't done any dmg, then they didn't either.
5) Its early game pressure doctrine, it doesn't have anything except early game power and some minor utility for late game.

1) You compare them to storms, not shocks.
2) Storms have 0.7 rec acc modifier, partisans don't. This makes partisans die like flies, storms don't.
3) Storms have much stronger AI and AT upgrades that come with ability supporting that weapon choice, partisans don't.
4) Yes, you're overreacting, because partisans up until now were shooting rubber bullets and if their molo haven't done any dmg, then they didn't either.
5) Its early game pressure doctrine, it doesn't have anything except early game power and some minor utility for late game.

1. Storms have .75
2. Storm AI ain't stronger at all, Partisan PPSH's have higher DPS than IR StG's which are the highest close range DPS of any hand held weapon in the game.
3. They have literally twice the ROF of shocks.
4. Soviets don't need a doctrine to survive late any more hombre.

I'm getting my wehr 2's rank back up to top 100 again this week. Played some games today vs partisan spammer. Yes its shock value is insane but once you wire/mine doors he just wastes tons of MP and has an army of useless 4 man close combat troops which die in seconds to focus fire.

while partisans have recieved quite a significant buff, the doctrine as a whole is very much an early game all in. they definitely dont scale as well other infantry and the fact that theyre a 4 man SMG squad means that theyll be bled pretty hard on approach after they get spawned. they also cost 26 to reinforce. their shock value is high, as they should be imo, but they do fall off quite hard and once you realize the enemy has gone partisans you know they wont have any heavy tanks or artillery to deal with.

currently 2 volks grenades will burn down one house, and you can use flamers as ostheer to burn down houses or occupy them yourself to prevent spawning.

I'm getting my wehr 2's rank back up to top 100 again this week. Played some games today vs partisan spammer. Yes its shock value is insane but once you wire/mine doors he just wastes tons of MP and has an army of useless 4 man close combat troops which die in seconds to focus fire.

Which can be said to certain Axis units(even more expensive one?) too? LOL

Which can be said to certain Axis units(even more expensive one?) too? LOL

After shock value falls are 500% better than shitty partisans

Stormtroopers could use some love indeed, currently they have to upgrade their STG's which cost a whopping 90 ammo (or even more, haven't played them for a long while) and are just half that good as Party(sans)

After shock value falls are 500% better than shitty partisans

He wasn't probably talking about Fallshirmjägers. Falls are in my opinion way better, eventhough you've to vet them to become strong.

After shock value falls are 500% better than shitty partisans

Which is... 440mp and 3cp unit?

You're calling partisans are shit?

He wasn't probably talking about Fallshirmjägers. Falls are in my opinion way better, eventhough you've to vet them to become strong.

He was saying mine on the door and focus fire, so I replied like that

1) You compare them to storms, not shocks.
2) Storms have 0.7 rec acc modifier, partisans don't. This makes partisans die like flies, storms don't.
3) Storms have much stronger AI and AT upgrades that come with ability supporting that weapon choice, partisans don't.
4) Yes, you're overreacting, because partisans up until now were shooting rubber bullets and if their molo haven't done any dmg, then they didn't either.
5) Its early game pressure doctrine, it doesn't have anything except early game power and some minor utility for late game.

Yes, you are telling to a much better player than you that he is wrong. Yes, your bias is skyhigh.

while partisans have recieved quite a significant buff, the doctrine as a whole is very much an early game all in. they definitely dont scale as well other infantry and the fact that theyre a 4 man SMG squad means that theyll be bled pretty hard on approach after they get spawned. they also cost 26 to reinforce. their shock value is high, as they should be imo, but they do fall off quite hard and once you realize the enemy has gone partisans you know they wont have any heavy tanks or artillery to deal with.

currently 2 volks grenades will burn down one house, and you can use flamers as ostheer to burn down houses or occupy them yourself to prevent spawning.

If they have similar veterancy as before, they do not fall off hard.
They get -17% rec. accuracy on vet 2.

If they have similar veterancy as before, they do not fall off hard.
They get -17% rec. accuracy on vet 2.

Fair enough for the price.

EDIT: sucks, I clicked the wrong button to answer myself. Sorry.

Are we just going to ignore the fact they are the high close range DPS unit in the entire game.

If they have similar veterancy as before, they do not fall off hard.
They get -17% rec. accuracy on vet 2.

yes, but theyre still a 4 man SMG squad that MUST get into close quarters to deal any form of damage. Once they spawn and retreat back to base, theyll struggle as regular troops on the battlefield. its very difficult for them to close the distance since you can focus them down. -17% honestly isnt very much for a 4 man squad. losing even one model means a whopping 25% decrease in dps.

They should reduce their popcap so you can leave them around shot blockers to ambush enemies without having to worry about them eating your manpower income.

From 7.82 dps to 21 dps. Relic, how does this keep happening?

+1, How can you do something like that?

yes, but theyre still a 4 man SMG squad that MUST get into close quarters to deal any form of damage. Once they spawn and retreat back to base, theyll struggle as regular troops on the battlefield. its very difficult for them to close the distance since you can focus them down. -17% honestly isnt very much for a 4 man squad. losing even one model means a whopping 25% decrease in dps.

This. Seconded.

Take into account that before, when only a handful of people used partisans, no axis player ever felt the need of looking behind their front line apart from the occasional paratrooper landing. But now finally the partisans pack a little more punch the "OP-OP calling" starts, and the worst thing is, a very predictable one at that. So lets take this 'new' situation axis players will find themselves in into consideration.

The "lazy" (before replying watch those quotation marks there) axis never had to deal with troops operating behind the line, having to get real close before doing some damage, otherwise quite unuseful troops before. Even in my earliest (and I have played tons of matches using partisans) use of these guys I had to ubermicro them and not use them as a combat unit to make them work. Back then they could not capture points at all, were (and still are) very fragile. Even a grenadier looking angry at them made them start dropping models. It was very hard to make them useful, only having some limited use in very specific situation only encounterable in 3v3 4v4's. Every partisan fielded behind enemy lines was a missing soviet squad on the frontline.

Their armor still sucks. they die like flies and most people tend to use them incorrectly and inefficiently. They finally do some damage, people use them properly and all axis camp starts barking and throwing in all the numbers to back up their case. While in all honesty, you should look behind the hurts of our collective butts and see that maybe these guys were very underpowered before.

Taking this into consideration I do not mind a small but noticeable nerf in their damage output. for their smg's.

And it's been less than 24 hours. I mean. Really people? Seriously?