UKF - Know your units - Medium armor

Someone has to have the better tanks. And why would we twist history and give it to the British? Just because the 17 pounder shall be a special snowflake?

more people are playing axis more than allies at the moment you ought to look at the search rate percentages. in my time playing against human opponents minimum was around 70% and with the July 21 patch they seem more easy and fun to play. no intense micro involved

It also has a better ROF and a worse armor value. I think it may be marginally faster too (definitely faster with vet).

Random thing, but I could have sworn the Comet also had superior rear armour compared to a Panther. I remember a PIV having issues dealing with the Comet, even when flanking.

more people are playing axis more than allies at the moment you ought to look at the search rate percentages. in my time playing against human opponents minimum was around 70% and with the July 21 patch they seem more easy and fun to play. no intense micro involved

lets say theres 100 games going on at one point. for examples sake, lets just say theyre 1v1s. so there are a 100 axis players, and a 100 allied players playing ingame. now lets say there are...20 people searching at a given time. realistically there arent a lot of people searching at once so this is a somewhat realistic number i think. so if 20 people searching and 70% are axis, that means 14 people searching as axis and 6 as allies.

so lets count how many allied players there are in game and searching. theres 100 ingame, and 6 searching, so a total of 106, and there are 114 axis players playing the game as well. wow, so it seems like that only 52% players are actually playing axis! the ratio searching is definitely not indicative of balance and is a poor indicator of which factions are played more.

Random thing, but I could have sworn the Comet also had superior rear armour compared to a Panther. I remember a PIV having issues dealing with the Comet, even when flanking.

All British tanks have very good rear armor. I think it's a design choice (a poor one at that).

Which is total bullshit. Yes the 17 pounder is a strong gun. Yet the Panthers gun is comparable.

Well it is comparable, the KwK 42 wasn't anything to scoff at, but neither is the 17 Pounder.

Who can tell what stats brits tanks have in alpha ?

Fireflies will make people cry, but it won't be Axis... it'll be us Allies... 12s reload in Alpha... *cries*

12 sec?
#Sturmtigerfeels

lets say theres 100 games going on at one point. for examples sake, lets just say theyre 1v1s. so there are a 100 axis players, and a 100 allied players playing ingame. now lets say there are...20 people searching at a given time. realistically there arent a lot of people searching at once so this is a somewhat realistic number i think. so if 20 people searching and 70% are axis, that means 14 people searching as axis and 6 as allies.

so lets count how many allied players there are in game and searching. theres 100 ingame, and 6 searching, so a total of 106, and there are 114 axis players playing the game as well. wow, so it seems like that only 52% players are actually playing axis! the ratio searching is definitely not indicative of balance and is a poor indicator of which factions are played more.

And if you reverse the numbers? Relic has put in place a really nice tool to watch "live" games, so you can see in live how many games are played, and it is usually not 100. Mostly 10-20 in average with higher pics during week-end.

And it change a lot the result. 10 people playing allied, 10 Axis, and 6-14 looking for a game. 16 Allied vs 34 Axis and you reach 40% / 60%.

Anyway, the real important information is what people want to play, and of course, for couple of weeks, a month maybe, people will want to try Brits so probably the search match will show 90% allied search 10% Axis during that time.

@ Kreatiir, 100% agreeing.

And if you reverse the numbers? Relic has put in place a really nice tool to watch "live" games, so you can see in live how many games are played, and it is usually not 100. Mostly 10-20 in average with higher pics during week-end.

And it change a lot the result. 10 people playing allied, 10 Axis, and 6-14 looking for a game. 16 Allied vs 34 Axis and you reach 40% / 60%.

Anyway, the real important information is what people want to play, and of course, for couple of weeks, a month maybe, people will want to try Brits so probably the search match will show 90% allied search 10% Axis during that time.

Let's get back on topic, we're not getting anywhere with these presumptions .

I´m also a bit curious about the Firefly and Comet.

I don´t see how a Jackson gun with the endurance of a Sherman is going to be balanced. Why would a medium Comet turn out to be similar to a Panther?

A combination of good armor and good gun (Panther) should be beating a vehicle with good gun and lesser armor (Comet/ Firefly). It´s just logic.

I´m almost sure those vehicles will be OP the first patch. Once because people are going "Omg, 17 pounder!", and second because the new factions have always been OP. Seeing how Tigers blow up quite fast these days, I don´t expect the situation to get any better.

give usf pershing

and usf got left in dust.also whats the point of having vet 5 for okw when you are giving british vet 5 bonuses in disguise of vet 3,just jampacked+ in 3 vet instead of 5 vet

I would really like to know your sources, cardboard tank.


The 17pdr was not comparable to the panthers gun, it was comparable and even slightly surpassed the king tigers main gun with APDS ammunition. With normal rounds it was about as good as a pak-40. And a pak-40 was even slightly weaker than the soviet d-5t 85mm or american 76mm M1.


EDIT : Whoops, wrong data, the 17pdr with normal rounds was indeed about as good as a panthers gun. And keep in mind that at close range the panthers APCR round was better than the standart AP round of the kwk 88 l/71. But of course APCR was very innacurate at longer ranges.

EDIT 2: Disregard the first edit, the 17pdr with standart AP rounds was indeed about as good as the 76mm M1 and soviet 85mm d-5t. Even slightly weaker, about the same as a pak-40.


So yeah, EZ 8 > firefly plz


Anyways, relic informed us that the 17pdr in coh 2 universe has ~230mm of armor penetration at 1000m, which is wayyyy off, considering that even the kwk 88 l/71 only managed such penetration at 100m. So yeah, looks likre relic has their sources


Also, if we would want to go completely historical, then the jacksons M3 90MM gun with HVAP surpassed the KTs 88mm l/71 EVEN if the KT used APCR rounds. Both guns had about ~300mm of pen at 100m. That said, HVAP performance back then was significantly weakened if the armor it hit was sloped.


And who cares about this special snowflake? COH 2 isin't a millitary sim, and neither it is a semi realistic game like war thunder or something. In war thunder or world of tanks, the devs need to pay atleast some attention to what armour and what gun each tank actually had.


In coh 2, relic defines the values. Theres plenty of completely ahistorical stuff, but in game it's completely fine.


We have the luchs with it's real life 15mm of frontal armor having way more health and armor than a t-70 which in real life had over 3 times more frontal armor. We have super fast shooting t-70s despite having a 1 man turret. We have the pumas 50mm gun being stronger than the PIVs gun and easily penetrating shermans and t-34s which they could never actually do in real life.


We have an IS-2 which shoots every 6 seconds and it's 28kg 122m shell has significantly less destructive power than the KTs 7? kg HE shell againts infantry.

We have mg-42/mg-34 incendiary armor piercing rounds which were never actually used, or very rarely and certainly did not have the penetrative power of penetrating t-70s...

So yeah, shut up with your bullshit special snowflake stuff. It's not history that defines how a faction works in coh2, relic takes some inspirations from it, and they they try to make it fun, while also maintaining some authenticity.

I await the mass nerf brit threads soon, the tears will be real

Cant wait for Brits, really enjoyed playing them

British will be OP at the start, I have no doubt in my mind and will be the wet dream of every anti-nazi justice angel wannabe. Then, in 2 months mark or maybe sooner, Relic will start to nerf them. The tears will be real then. Allied tears. Dear fanboys, Relic just want your money therefore will charm you with a superbe allied faction with an "I win" button included. But soon, they will nerf them more and more, untill you will be out of tears.

the sherman firefly with his tulip rockets was hard nerfed in alpha. maybe a little bit too much. But the comet was an awesome tank with cool gimmicks

I´m also a bit curious about the Firefly and Comet.

I don´t see how a Jackson gun with the endurance of a Sherman is going to be balanced. Why would a medium Comet turn out to be similar to a Panther?

A combination of good armor and good gun (Panther) should be beating a vehicle with good gun and lesser armor (Comet/ Firefly). It´s just logic.

I´m almost sure those vehicles will be OP the first patch. Once because people are going "Omg, 17 pounder!", and second because the new factions have always been OP. Seeing how Tigers blow up quite fast these days, I don´t expect the situation to get any better.

What exactly makes you think that the firefly will beat a panther in the first place? The firefly had 12 second reload in the alpha, with 240 damage. It has lower penetration than the jackson, despite the much, much longer reload. It's turret rotation was ridiciluosly slow, about as fast as the KTs. Unless it uses it's 150 muni rocket strike, a panther easily beats a firefly. I'm sure the firefly will be buffed though, at those stats it was completely useless.


Now the comet. 185 fuel, lower armor and penetration than the panther, albeit only slightly, good againts infantry, 50 range (same as panther), faster rate of fire.



Anyways, in the alpha, brits were at a significant disadvantage againts ostheer in a 1v1 scenario. Brad developed 1 effective strategy that worked, however it was due to a unit that was heavily overperforming.


In teamgames brits will be a fun faction to play, and balance there doesn't matter because any kind of balance is not possible to achieve there.

In 2v2 brits will be fine.

British will be OP at the start, I have no doubt in my mind and will be the wet dream of every anti-nazi justice angel wannabe. Then, in 2 months mark or maybe sooner, Relic will start to nerf them. The tears will be real then. Allied tears. Dear fanboys, Relic just want your money therefore will charm you with a superbe allied faction with an "I win" button included. But soon, they will nerf them more and more, untill you will be out of tears.

Much to your delight no less.

I foresee the crackshot Ost sniper receiving a RoF reduction sometime in September. Pumas will likely see some sort of change too.

But Relic's motto is "Who complains, wins" afterall...

Please do not post pictures of the comet, it is very triggering for us Alpha Axis testers

ya I remember....

This is an interesting read on the firefly. While i know world of tanks forums isin't the most amazing thing to be sourcing from, wikipedia seems to be content with using this as a source so whatever

http://forum-xbox.worldoftanks.com/index.php?/topic/17800-the-us-army-tests-firefly/

I'd happily trade the panther for comet