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russian armor

New sturm tad too silly

24 Jul 2015, 16:10 PM
#41
avatar of G4bb4_G4nd4lf
Donator 33

Posts: 658

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Jul 2015, 16:07 PMKatitof


Yea, that's going to help you with all the los/shot blockers ST can shoot through.


That's why I said "If it hides behind shot blockers just send a recon plane to see where it is and just don't go there."

If you know where it is you can prepare an assault or simply avoid it.
24 Jul 2015, 16:14 PM
#42
avatar of ElSlayer

Posts: 1605 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Jul 2015, 11:50 AMKatitof

M-42 crews +1 that post.

At least M-42 has finally got buff to gun durability (if you don't let opponent decrew it) :guyokay:
24 Jul 2015, 16:15 PM
#43
avatar of Draje

Posts: 68

Even if you use recon 100% of the time, you cannot keep sight of the sturmtiger as there will be lapses in coverage. Thats an unrealistic situation, and doesn't counter the sturm simply slightly delays its impact.

If it keeps this damage/aoe/range, it needs to lose its rocket phasing through objects (firing over small objects fine), if it doesn't it needs to lose one of its buffs.

As i've said there's 2 units that already have mechanics to deal with this, no reason why the sturmtiger couldn't adapt similarly
24 Jul 2015, 16:18 PM
#44
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8


At least M-42 has finally got buff to gun durability (if you don't let opponent decrew it) :guyokay:

If it only lasted longer then 10 seconds to LMG grens/pair of volks :foreveralone:
24 Jul 2015, 16:29 PM
#45
avatar of AchtAchter

Posts: 1604 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Jul 2015, 16:15 PMDraje
Even if you use recon 100% of the time, you cannot keep sight of the sturmtiger as there will be lapses in coverage. Thats an unrealistic situation, and doesn't counter the sturm simply slightly delays its impact.

If it keeps this damage/aoe/range, it needs to lose its rocket phasing through objects (firing over small objects fine), if it doesn't it needs to lose one of its buffs.

As i've said there's 2 units that already have mechanics to deal with this, no reason why the sturmtiger couldn't adapt similarly


One ability costs 90 munitions and can be planted by the most basic units in the game, able to wipe your squads under the 5 min mark. The other unit costs 160 fuel arrives in late game and is doctrinal and is risky because a panther / p4 /kt might have been better.

Since the Sturmtiger requires a large amount of resources it should also take a significant amount of resources to counter it.
You don't need to have a Recon plane permanently flying around, all you need to is to recon before doing a push.

On map arty wipes squads all the time without warning and costs less. Always those double standards.
24 Jul 2015, 16:41 PM
#46
avatar of Draje

Posts: 68



One ability costs 90 munitions and can be planted by the most basic units in the game, able to wipe your squads under the 5 min mark. The other unit costs 160 fuel arrives in late game and is doctrinal and is risky because a panther / p4 /kt might have been better.

Since the Sturmtiger requires a large amount of resources it should also take a significant amount of resources to counter it.
You don't need to have a Recon plane permanently flying around, all you need to is to recon before doing a push.

On map arty wipes squads all the time without warning and costs less. Always those double standards.


The demo can be swept, the sturmtiger cannot be avoided. There is no double standard here as while both wipe units, one can be countered and the other can't. As well the sturmtiger gets to select who and when. It's too good to be as safe as it is
24 Jul 2015, 16:41 PM
#47
avatar of mycalliope

Posts: 721



One ability costs 90 munitions and can be planted by the most basic units in the game, able to wipe your squads under the 5 min mark. The other unit costs 160 fuel arrives in late game and is doctrinal and is risky because a panther / p4 /kt might have been better.

Since the Sturmtiger requires a large amount of resources it should also take a significant amount of resources to counter it.
You don't need to have a Recon plane permanently flying around, all you need to is to recon before doing a push.

On map arty wipes squads all the time without warning and costs less. Always those double standards.

This.allied fanboys are trying hard to nerf every german unit to death hmg,sturm,falss u just name it its seriously annoying at this point.
24 Jul 2015, 16:47 PM
#48
avatar of AchtAchter

Posts: 1604 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Jul 2015, 16:41 PMDraje


The demo can be swept, the sturmtiger cannot be avoided. There is no double standard here as while both wipe units, one can be countered and the other can't. As well the sturmtiger gets to select who and when. It's too good to be as safe as it is


Same things can be said about Katty, panzerwerfer, stuka, ml20, b4, lefh, priest & unlucky mortar hits.
The Sturmtiger can be played around by using Recon something that you can't say about on map arty.

And still you are ignoring costs, time of arrival & risk and reward. So yes, still double standard.
24 Jul 2015, 16:55 PM
#49
avatar of Draje

Posts: 68



Same things can be said about Katty, panzerwerfer, stuka, ml20, b4, lefh, priest & unlucky mortar hits.
The Sturmtiger can be played around by using Recon something that you can't say about on map arty.

And still you are ignoring costs, time of arrival & risk and reward. So yes, still double standard.


No, the katty, panzerwerfer, and stucka can all be heard and do not have 100% wipes. The Artillary pieces are static, and you can move out of them when they fire.

The sturmtiger, when well placed, is a complete and instant wipe and can retreat back to safety. It is by far and away the best unit in the game at causing instant, unretreatable wipes, and is too hard to counter considering you can hide it behind large structures/forests. To kill it you have to flank with multiple tanks, and work your way through its fairly generous healthpool. Its significantly harder to take out than any of the other rocket trucks, and is much much more impact.

There is no double standard because no other unit is as good as it is, while being as safe as it is



This.allied fanboys are trying hard to nerf every german unit to death hmg,sturm,falss u just name it its seriously annoying at this point.


If you check my player card you can see i'm a 100% axis player. I'm the one using it and I've never used a unit thats so easy and safe at wiping anything i want
24 Jul 2015, 17:01 PM
#50
avatar of Napalm

Posts: 1595 | Subs: 2

Remember when the B4 had direct shot but was nerfed because it would kill stuff? Welp, now there is a B4 on wheels. Nice!
24 Jul 2015, 17:18 PM
#51
avatar of AchtAchter

Posts: 1604 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Jul 2015, 17:01 PMNapalm
Remember when the B4 had direct shot but was nerfed because it would kill stuff? Welp, now there is a B4 on wheels. Nice!


Exactly, because the Sturmtiger has the range of the B4, costs only mp and mark vehicle + FMR allow it to one shot 1200 hp units.

edit: and btw. the b4 can still one shot medium tanks with its direct shot ability. But that is simply not op enough and therefore butthurt allie boys say its trash now.
24 Jul 2015, 17:20 PM
#52
avatar of Draje

Posts: 68



Exactly, because the Sturmtiger has the range of the B4, costs only mp and mark vehicle + FMR allow it to one shot 1200 hp units.


And the b4 is super accurate and can move!
24 Jul 2015, 17:21 PM
#53
avatar of 5trategos

Posts: 449

I haven't tried it yet but judging by the patch notes, I can easily see this unit becoming very cost-efficient.


And still you are ignoring costs, time of arrival & risk and reward. So yes, still double standard.


I think most of the time-related and economy disadvantages can be mitigated by delaying the game and playing conservatively thus forcing the allied player to play more aggressive and be drawn into unfavorable engagements. These are all things that the OKW do very well by design (and also make them such a bore to play in 1v1).

Judging by early impressions of the patch however, the attrition effect of the ML-20 will eclipse the Sturm this patch.
24 Jul 2015, 17:24 PM
#54
avatar of AchtAchter

Posts: 1604 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Jul 2015, 17:20 PMDraje


And the b4 is super accurate and can move!


Make the b4 cost 160 fuel and then it can move from moscow to berlin for what I care. Direct shot still can one shot 640 hp units and has also 1000 pen.
24 Jul 2015, 17:52 PM
#55
avatar of CookiezNcreem
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 3052 | Subs: 15

It's like 1 billion CP and costs 240? Fuel now??
It's in a shitty doctrine and costs as much as a KT, with a long as fuck micro intensive reload.
Which means if you get it over a KT it BETTER be 420 wiping everything.
not understanding the fuss here.
24 Jul 2015, 17:56 PM
#56
avatar of CookiezNcreem
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 3052 | Subs: 15

Kappa i take back th 240 fuel part, it still better be worth it if you spend 160 fuel on it
24 Jul 2015, 17:56 PM
#57
avatar of Hogman512

Posts: 168

It's like 1 billion CP and costs 240? Fuel now??
It's in a shitty doctrine and costs as much as a KT, with a long as fuck micro intensive reload.
Which means if you get it over a KT it BETTER be 420 wiping everything.
not understanding the fuss here.


This.
24 Jul 2015, 18:20 PM
#58
avatar of Butcher

Posts: 1217

One T-34/85 or Jackson counters it. At that price with the fuel penalty don´t expect superior anti tank support for it. Just short range Pisswerfer and Panzerschreck.

Catch it with its pants down while reloading. It´s not as hard as some people here make it sound like.
24 Jul 2015, 19:02 PM
#59
avatar of Jaedrik

Posts: 446 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Jul 2015, 11:50 AMKatitof
Except reverse is applied by axis in this very thread.

Suddenly huge explosion that can be shot without any warning, can't be swept, can't be heard in advance and can be used from FoW or from behind shot/LoS blockers is a skill, but sweepable demo you can prevent or anticipate is evil.
but--but
blobbing is evil :foreveralone:
24 Jul 2015, 19:37 PM
#60
avatar of Draje

Posts: 68

It's not easy to catch it reloading if you support it properly.

A unit shouldn't exist that destroys whatever it aims at without reaction. The b4 is inaccurate until vet, artillery is random, and demos can be swept. The sturm shouldn't be able to do what it does and remain as safe as it is. Hide it behind structures, kill anything in range, and put mines/reketens on the side.

I maintain either it's aoe far multiplier needs a nerf or it needs to have shot blockers work if the objects are tall enough
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