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russian armor

USF superglue on tanks

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8 Jul 2015, 02:21 AM
#61
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1



No it can't. With decent micro, it is slightly more effective than a puma vs. infantry, but a Luchs is infinetly better vs. infantry. Just looking at the units changed stats can tell you that.

"Health increased from 320 to 400
Moving accuracy increased from 0.5 to 0.75
Penetration increased from 45/45/60 to 45/50/65
FOW Scatter multiplier penalty reduced from 300% to 25%"

The patch made it slightly better vs. vehicles, as survivable as a Luchs HP wise, better on the move, and significantly decreased the FOW multiplier which is mainly useful when getting the last shot off on a retreating vehicle behind smoke/ a hedgerow, not infantry. The only change that helps vs. infantry is the on the move penalty, and all that does is make it slightly better on the move. The base accuracy and AOE are very low, and as a result it is more of an infantry sniper than anything else. Even on the move.

There is no way in hell a Stuart is ever going to kill nearly as many models (or be as annoying) as the Luchs, when the Luchs also doesn't have to fear shrecks on half the squads it fights.


The Luchs is better versus enemy infantry because it's anti armor performance is fairly bleh. The Stuart now (Iv seen it done plenty) can kite like it's never been able to before and now that it can actually take an extra it it can make more use of it's anti-armor abilities.

In 3's and 4's it's still shit, in 2's and 1's it works well for it's price. It could still obviously maybe use a little bit more pen or damage but right now its light years ahead of what it used to be.

It can also instantly repair crits on it's self, hop out and repair 1 HP and the vehicle is back and moving.

EDIT: To put things in perspective it's moving accuracy is .75 now compared to the Luchs .25.
8 Jul 2015, 02:41 AM
#62
avatar of BeefSurge

Posts: 1891

The Stuart is the best light tank in the game. Only thing that kinda sucks about it is going Captain.
8 Jul 2015, 02:46 AM
#63
avatar of comm_ash
Patrion 14

Posts: 1194 | Subs: 1



The Luchs is better versus enemy infantry because it's anti armor performance is fairly bleh. The Stuart now (Iv seen it done plenty) can kite like it's never been able to before and now that it can actually take an extra it it can make more use of it's anti-armor abilities.

In 3's and 4's it's still shit, in 2's and 1's it works well for it's price. It could still obviously maybe use a little bit more pen or damage but right now its light years ahead of what it used to be.

It can also instantly repair crits on it's self, hop out and repair 1 HP and the vehicle is back and moving.

EDIT: To put things in perspective it's moving accuracy is .75 now compared to the Luchs .25.


I'm not saying its a bad unit, far from it. I'm merely stating that it has nowhere near the AI damage of a Luchs (yes even on the move). The on the move multiplier relies heavily on the guns' base stats (because its a multiplier), and thus even an on the move Luchs has much more AI power. You can add as many embellishments as you want, but the Stuart is still not anywhere near the T70 and Luchs in this role, because its not an AI vehicle.
8 Jul 2015, 03:12 AM
#64
avatar of mycalliope

Posts: 721

ok can anyone tell me the reason why us have vehicle crew and have no penalty for it while other factions doesn't have this feature what reason did relic gave for it....???
8 Jul 2015, 03:28 AM
#65
avatar of comm_ash
Patrion 14

Posts: 1194 | Subs: 1

ok can anyone tell me the reason why us have vehicle crew and have no penalty for it while other factions doesn't have this feature what reason did relic gave for it....???


I think of it as faction flavor. USF has a repair squad (RE) with 0 combat potential, so vehicle crews give them a way to not use RE except as sweepers. USF also has nothing but 640 HP mediums and bleeds manpower heavily lategame with rifles, so they cannot afford the popcap or reinforcement cost to have extra repair units.
8 Jul 2015, 03:29 AM
#66
avatar of BeefSurge

Posts: 1891

ok can anyone tell me the reason why us have vehicle crew and have no penalty for it while other factions doesn't have this feature what reason did relic gave for it....???


Cookiezandcream and comm_ash literally just explained why on the previous page. Go back and read.

8 Jul 2015, 03:29 AM
#67
avatar of Appleseed

Posts: 622

Whats this,the 6th nerf allies thread youve made.

If they hit the mine on a flank and they get critted,they have to cancel their flank and repair. Mine did its job.

if they hit the mine on the frontline,jumping out to repair a crit is extremely risky under fire,especially with new popular MG42 spam,one burst of suppression or DPS = free sherman. Mine Did its job.

USF tanks are complete paper,but yeah,lets take away the one survivability perk they have going for them.


it is still too cheap, there is many times, my mine or panzerfust did engine damage on USF tanks, and my AT infantry is chasing the tank, USF just hop out tank, my at infantry lost target and start firing at crew man, and 3 sec later they hop back in (maybe lost 1-2 model) and backward full speed and run away from my AT infantry while my AT infantry still loading their shreks because they wasted on fire at crew man. i don't see my mine or panzerfust did its job, if same thing happen to any other factions like OKW, USSR, Osteer it usually means dead tank. also what is the chance of a mine covering by a HMG42? usually mines are covering flanks front line mines usually will blow up by random explosives, which means waste of munition.
8 Jul 2015, 03:36 AM
#68
avatar of comm_ash
Patrion 14

Posts: 1194 | Subs: 1



it is still too cheap, there is many times, my mine or panzerfust did engine damage on USF tanks, and my AT infantry is chasing the tank, USF just hop out tank, my at infantry lost target and start firing at crew man, and 3 sec later they hop back in (maybe lost 1-2 model) and backward full speed and run away from my AT infantry while my AT infantry still loading their shreks because they wasted on fire at crew man. i don't see my mine or panzerfust did its job, if same thing happen to any other factions like OKW, USSR, Osteer it usually means dead tank. also what is the chance of a mine covering by a HMG42? usually mines are covering flanks front line mines usually will blow up by random explosives, which means waste of munition.


I agree, its too cheap, but you are underestimating the risk of repairing under fire. Repairing crews take extra damage, and losing 2 models means that the crew cannot get back in the vehicle. If the bugs are fixed and the crew has to wait the entire ability duration before hopping in, you will have plenty of time to do what you need. 30mu is a good price.
8 Jul 2015, 03:59 AM
#69
avatar of Porygon

Posts: 2779



I think of it as faction flavor. USF has a repair squad (RE) with 0 combat potential, so vehicle crews give them a way to not use RE except as sweepers. USF also has nothing but 640 HP mediums and bleeds manpower heavily lategame with rifles, so they cannot afford the popcap or reinforcement cost to have extra repair units.


RE ARE NOT having ZERO combat potential, my beloved genius strategist.
8 Jul 2015, 04:02 AM
#70
avatar of ClassyDavid

Posts: 424 | Subs: 2

You can order your troops to target the tank with the attack order gent, your AT equipped soldiers will attack the tank while your AI soldier attack the crew. (Crewman also take extra damage while repairing too)

Given the fact that all US medium tanks need at least 3 crew men to operate the vehicle, taking two crew out will mean a free or destroyed tank.

Of course getting out mid combat against high damage Axis troops and repairing is extremely risky and care must be of the utmost to repair and escape. A tiny slip up will mean either a burning wreck or captured Allied tank.

I do like the vehicle crews of the US, it goes with the theme of mobility but Critical Repair should be increased to 30 munitions. Other than the bug, its fine.
8 Jul 2015, 04:06 AM
#71
avatar of BeefSurge

Posts: 1891



RE ARE NOT having ZERO combat potential, my beloved genius strategist.


With vet or bars I agree. But vanilla REs struggle vs pios at medium range
8 Jul 2015, 04:09 AM
#72
avatar of comm_ash
Patrion 14

Posts: 1194 | Subs: 1



RE ARE NOT having ZERO combat potential, my beloved genius strategist.


OK, I used Hyperbole. But riddle me this:

What squad loses to RE?
None

RE are only good as sweepers and as meh AT. They also only defeat pios if they have vet, and they do not gain vet easily because of their low accuracy. You can take issue with that point, but all of my other points stand.

The whole theme of US mobility is dependent on vehicle crews allowing USF medium armor to operate at the flanks of the battle without requiring a dedicated pit crew. USF lacks abilities like blitz, and their armor isn't particularly well-armored, fast, or powerful individually, thus they get the noncombat bonus of self repairs.
8 Jul 2015, 04:33 AM
#73
avatar of BeefSurge

Posts: 1891

America had by far the best logistics in WWII too. It actually makes sense from a historical standpoint for them to repair the most efficiently.
8 Jul 2015, 04:37 AM
#74
avatar of pigsoup
Patrion 14

Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2


...
The whole theme of US mobility is dependent on vehicle crews allowing USF medium armor to operate at the flanks of the battle without requiring a dedicated pit crew. USF lacks abilities like blitz, and their armor isn't particularly well-armored, fast, or powerful individually, thus they get the noncombat bonus of self repairs.


word
8 Jul 2015, 04:56 AM
#75
avatar of Porygon

Posts: 2779

America had by far the best logistics in WWII too. It actually makes sense from a historical standpoint for them to repair the most efficiently.


Yes, their repair was supreme. Able to turn a total fuck up aircraft carrier back into fully operational in matter of weeks.

But doesn't mean they turn a total fuck up tank back into fully operational in 2 seconds is making sense. Especially when they revive IS2/ISU becomes more ridiculous.

When the tank hit a mine, it should be punished, period.
If this is a global upgrade worthing a strategic investment, I am fine with it.
8 Jul 2015, 05:02 AM
#76
avatar of BeefSurge

Posts: 1891



Yes, their repair was supreme. Able to turn a total fuck up aircraft carrier back into fully operational in matter of weeks.

But doesn't mean they turn a total fuck up tank back into fully operational in 2 seconds is making sense. Especially when they revive IS2/ISU becomes more ridiculous.


Once USF gets the alpha changes I agree that muni cost could go up. Also limiting it to USF tanks would make a shit ton of sense. (Just like racks are limited to US troops.)
8 Jul 2015, 05:07 AM
#77
avatar of comm_ash
Patrion 14

Posts: 1194 | Subs: 1



Yes, their repair was supreme. Able to turn a total fuck up aircraft carrier back into fully operational in matter of weeks.

But doesn't mean they turn a total fuck up tank back into fully operational in 2 seconds is making sense. Especially when they revive IS2/ISU becomes more ridiculous.


Just pretend that they have a tech building doing the repairs for free :D

Vehicle crews repair much slower than RE stock, and even with vet (which they get instantaneously in real tanks) they are slower than dedicated repair squads I believe.

USF needs tanks on the field all the time lategame. Vehicle repairs are their only advantage over the other armies' lategame, where Panthers and Tigers require less repairs to stay on the field due to armor and less micro to use due to smaller numbers, as well as vastly more powerful infantry (lmg grens/ vet 5 anything).
8 Jul 2015, 06:49 AM
#78
avatar of JohnnyB

Posts: 2396 | Subs: 1

Wow, an USF nerf thread and allied lovers are jumping of their pants? Guess the allied bias is inexistent ;).

That being said, I am not FOR this ability change / removal. USF armor is shitty enough so it's ok to have a slight advantage (the crews and their wonders). As long as smoke (doctrinal or not) and blitz are existing, critical repair should exist too. I don't know if rising the cost of this ability is required. USF needs alot of amo to equip infantry, to use abilities. Manpower (because of expensive units and expensive reinforcements) and armor icome are its weackest points, I don't think any such cost may be risen.
8 Jul 2015, 06:59 AM
#79
avatar of Porygon

Posts: 2779

Wow, an USF nerf thread and allied lovers are jumping of their pants? Guess the allied bias is inexistent ;).

That being said, I am not FOR this ability change / removal. USF armor is shitty enough so it's ok to have a slight advantage (the crews and their wonders). As long as smoke (doctrinal or not) and blitz are existing, critical repair should exist too. I don't know if rising the cost of this ability is required. USF needs alot of amo to equip infantry, to use abilities. Manpower (because of expensive units and expensive reinforcements) and armor icome are its weackest points, I don't think any such cost may be risen.


I failed to see Blitz / Smoke cannot neglect the punishment of mines.
And Allies have those too.

USF armor being shitty is NOT the excuse of why superglue should exist, I rather they make their armor not that shitty.
8 Jul 2015, 07:00 AM
#80
avatar of comm_ash
Patrion 14

Posts: 1194 | Subs: 1

Wow, an USF nerf thread and allied lovers are jumping of their pants? Guess the allied bias is inexistent ;).

That being said, I am not FOR this ability change / removal. USF armor is shitty enough so it's ok to have a slight advantage (the crews and their wonders). As long as smoke (doctrinal or not) and blitz are existing, critical repair should exist too. I don't know if rising the cost of this ability is required. USF needs alot of amo to equip infantry, to use abilities. Manpower (because of expensive units and expensive reinforcements) and armor icome are its weackest points, I don't think any such cost may be risen.


We are jumping out of out pants? For the most part we have agreed. (go ahead and read)
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