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Cruzz's The More You Know

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richarddear
25 Aug 2015, 10:58 AM
#301
avatar of richarddear

Posts: 36

jump backJump back to quoted post25 Aug 2015, 08:35 AMCombatWombat
Hi Cruzz,

I'm a little curious about how the Conrete piecing round on the ISU-152 functions. Based on its name, I get the impression that its a shot that should pass through all shot blockers, in the same way the PAK43 round does.

More often than not however the piecing round is stopped by terrian or fails to pass through a building. Is this intended and I'm just mistaken with how the round should function?

Given its cost to use what then is the purpose of the ability if it fails to reliably punch through shot blockers or even just terrian?
From the Coh2Stats I noticed its has a much higher peneration compared to the normal armour piecing shot.

Lastly, does the type of ISU-152 round its currently using (armour piecing or explosive) have an affect on the Conrete Piecing round or is it a purely seperate ability?

Thanks!


Although I'm not Cruzz, I think I can help, it can penetrate structures and to 'some extent' thickets of woodland (depending on the surrounding terrain). However as you said the shell can be intercepted by terrain, which PISSES me off to no end.

Also because it is a 'attack ground' ability as opposed to the 'active' ability of the Jgdtiger, the Isu-152 doesn't actually target a vehicle/squad unlike the Jagdtiger's comparable ability. This can often lead to misses and clipping into the terrain. LELIC is it so hard to make these two abilities universal?
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CombatWombat
25 Aug 2015, 12:23 PM
#302
avatar of CombatWombat

Posts: 98

Ah thanks richarddear

What you said makes sense based on what I've seen.

The fact that the shot gets intercepted by terrian makes the ability somewhat pointless especially considering how much it costs to use (70 ammmo I believe).

The ISU-152 is fustrating enough to use with its ammo switching and normal shots getting caught on terrian. Bit of a shame really that concrete piecing round suffers from the same issue.

I wonder if this was an oversight from Relic or if it was intended to behave this way.
Please bear in mind that I only play team game modes.
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elchino7
25 Aug 2015, 19:16 PM
#303
avatar of elchino7
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Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post25 Aug 2015, 07:27 AMCruzz


You crushed some unfinished wire you had started building


I'm amazed by this little fact :D
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.

Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.

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Nuclear Arbitor
26 Aug 2015, 03:28 AM
#304
avatar of Nuclear Arbitor
Patrion 28

Posts: 2470

jump backJump back to quoted post25 Aug 2015, 19:16 PMelchino7


I'm amazed by this little fact :D


wire lives matter too!
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Alexzandvar
26 Aug 2015, 18:21 PM
#305
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

A fun little fact:

The "sniper" rifles that Pathfinders and JLI use to death crit enemy infantry (40% health for Pathfinders and 75% health for JLI) have inverted damage profiles to your normal guns, with the JLI G43 actually having a positive accuracy modifier at at far and the Pathfinder Scoped Garand having only slightly negative (.93) accuracy at far and very negative accuracy at close (.34).

As far as I can tell it checks for the health of the unit after damage has been applied (with both rifles used by JLI and Paths doing 16 damage) meaning if the one shot hits, takes the model below the health threshold it will snipe it. It only needs to hit to do this btw, meaning model sniping works against enemies in cover or garrison who take reduced damage.

So if you want to play around with sniping models using these infantry units, make sure to keep them at range. The reload on these guns as well as the aim is pretty big, so don't count on any 360 no scopes.

This also highlights why BAR's make Pathfinders so insanely powerful, because the BAR's can chip off enough of a models health pretty quickly (high ROF weapons are much better against units with a large received accuracy modifier) to enable scoped kills. Also pick up dropped weapons with your JLI when ever you can, as it also makes them more deadly for obvious reasons.

EDIT: You should also take from this that standing at range using the Soviet sniper against JLI is an extremely bad idea, as you only need to have one of the models at 30 health for it to be sniped.
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Trubbbel
31 Aug 2015, 09:04 AM
#306
avatar of Trubbbel

Posts: 721

Does fences stop conscripts from throwing at grenades? Yesterday I was to flank a kubel and oorahed to the side, and when I commanded the throw the squad turned around and ran with their fists in the air back around the bushes and straight into the road that I wanted to avoid in the first place, and by then the kubel had reversed. Luckily actually, or they would've joined the first immediately pinned squad on the negative cover road.

Where does the fifth echelon dude come from? Off-map or from behind bushes or a hole in the ground? :)
My mommy always said there were no monsters - no real ones - but there are.
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__deleted__
31 Aug 2015, 12:15 PM
#307
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Posts: 4314 | Subs: 7

You must reinfroce to get him.
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Nuclear Arbitor
31 Aug 2015, 19:38 PM
#308
avatar of Nuclear Arbitor
Patrion 28

Posts: 2470

jump backJump back to quoted post31 Aug 2015, 09:04 AMTrubbbel
Does fences stop conscripts from throwing at grenades? Yesterday I was to flank a kubel and oorahed to the side, and when I commanded the throw the squad turned around and ran with their fists in the air back around the bushes and straight into the road that I wanted to avoid in the first place, and by then the kubel had reversed. Luckily actually, or they would've joined the first immediately pinned squad on the negative cover road.

Where does the fifth echelon dude come from? Off-map or from behind bushes or a hole in the ground? :)


fences shouldn't but elevation differences will.
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__deleted__
1 Sep 2015, 18:03 PM
#309
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Posts: 4314 | Subs: 7

Cruzz is there any difference in light cover and heavy cover in tommies bonus that they get when standing in cover ?
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EtherealDragon
1 Sep 2015, 19:48 PM
#310
avatar of EtherealDragon

Posts: 1890 | Subs: 1

+1 to Hector's Question;

Also a few more Brits questions that I've thought of.

1. What exactly is the cover bonus for Tommies (Cooldown/Reload Speed etc?)
2. Does directional cover matter for the cover bonus? (EG if you are on the wrong side of cover do you still get the bonus?)
3. Do trenches give you 360 degree green cover? (I'm trying to figure out why Relic deems trenches 50 MP worthy for Brits when they already bleed MP like no other)
4. What bonus does the "designate command vehicle" ability give?

Thanks!
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Mr. Someguy
1 Sep 2015, 22:59 PM
#311
avatar of Mr. Someguy

Posts: 4928

Is it true that Commandos do 170 DPS?
jump backJump back to quoted post22 Jan 2016, 01:09 AMluvnest
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII

> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
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Vuther
4 Sep 2015, 02:07 AM
#312
avatar of Vuther
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jump backJump back to quoted post1 Sep 2015, 19:48 PMEtherealDragon
3. Do trenches give you 360 degree green cover? (I'm trying to figure out why Relic deems trenches 50 MP worthy for Brits when they already bleed MP like no other)

As garrisoned buildings, vehicles or bunkers provide a different defensive bonus than heavy cover, I'd be hardly surprised if trenches were also a different case.

Also, pretty sure any garrison works from all angles around them.
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Mr. Someguy
4 Sep 2015, 02:25 AM
#313
avatar of Mr. Someguy

Posts: 4928

What PPSh do Guards use?

Is there any reason Soviet Camouflage applies to the USF M3 Half-Track?

jump backJump back to quoted post22 Jan 2016, 01:09 AMluvnest
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII

> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
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elchino7
4 Sep 2015, 22:04 PM
#314
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Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

Shocktroop PPSH unless something changed.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.

Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.

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Cruzz
6 Sep 2015, 14:26 PM
#315
avatar of Cruzz

Posts: 1221 | Subs: 41

Made a small DPS calculator myself as none of the usual suspects have updated yet.

British small arms DPS, near = 10 / mid = 22 / far = 35, includes reload.
Tommy DPS numbers are in cover. Engineer Sten numbers are out of cover. Added the reverse cover states to the end of the list.

Tommy Out of cover penalty: *1.3 cooldown, *1.5 reload (on all weapons)
Sappers In cover bonus: *0.3 cooldown, *0.5 reload (on Sten)

Code

bunker_vickers_hmg_mp:				11.918 / 7.745 / 4.602
sexton_mounted_machinegun_mp:			11.236 / 5.159 / 1.538
universal_carrier_bren_lmg_mp:			8.848 / 10.797 / 11.649
vickers_hmg_mp:		 			28.915 / 19.286 / 12.015
aec_coaxial_vehicle_turret_mp:			7.742 / 5.138 / 3.442
churchill_hull_defense_left_mp:		 	5.822 / 4.716 / 3.176
churchill_hull_defense_right_mp:		5.822 / 4.716 / 3.176
churchill_mk7_coaxial_vehicle_turret_avre_mp:	7.742 / 5.138 / 3.442
churchill_mk7_coaxial_vehicle_turret_mp:	7.742 / 5.138 / 3.442
churchill_mk7_vehicle_hull_mp:			5.822 / 4.716 / 3.176
comet_coaxial_vehicle_turret_mp:		7.742 / 5.138 / 3.442
comet_vehicle_hull_gun_mp:			5.702 / 4.53 / 3.233
commando_bren_lmg_moving_mp:		   	8.529 / 10.634 / 12.289
cromwell_coaxial_vehicle_turret_mp:		7.742 / 5.138 / 3.442
cromwell_vehicle_hull_mp:		 	5.822 / 4.716 / 3.176
sapper_bren_light_machine_gun_mp:		5.794 / 7.352 / 8.658
sapper_vickers_k_machine_gun_mp:		5.512 / 6.906 / 7.912
sherman_firefly_coaxial_vehicle_turret_mp:	 7.742 / 5.138 / 3.442
tommy_bren_light_machine_gun_mp:		5.476 / 6.863 / 7.863
vickers_k_universal_carrier:		 	 5.081 / 4.867 / 4.203
vickers_k_universal_carrier_suppression:	14.168 / 11.373 / 6.042
avre_crew_sten_9mm_smg_mp:			 5.528 / 1.643 / 0.299
commando_sten_mk_vi_silenced_smg_mp:		25.754 / 3.748 / 0.393
engineer_sten_9mm_smg_mp:			5.445 / 1.493 / 0.208
brit_officer_pistol_mp:				 3.513 / 1.24 / 0.613
tommy_lee_enfield_rifle_mp:			4.266 / 3.621 / 2.892
tommy_scoped_lee_enfield_rifle_mp:		2.982 / 2.585 / 2.077
weapon_crew_lee_enfield_rifle_mp:		1.611 / 1.293 / 0.969

Tommy out of cover:
tommy_lee_enfield_rifle_mp:			 3.963 / 3.384 / 2.712
tommy_scoped_lee_enfield_rifle_mp:		 2.589 / 2.262 / 1.825
tommy_bren_light_machine_gun_mp:		 4.485 / 5.699 / 6.643

Engineer in cover:
engineer_sten_9mm_smg_mp:			 8.269 / 2.258 / 0.331
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Olekman
6 Sep 2015, 14:38 PM
#316
avatar of Olekman
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Posts: 208

sapper_bren_light_machine_gun_mp: 5.794 / 7.352 / 8.658
tommy_bren_light_machine_gun_mp: 5.476 / 6.863 / 7.863


Wait a minute, why Sappers do more damage with Bren than Tommies?
Rapid Conscription Rework ||| Recoup Losses fix ||| OKW commander - Desperate Measures ||| AEF commander - Engineer Combat Company
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Cruzz
6 Sep 2015, 14:45 PM
#317
avatar of Cruzz

Posts: 1221 | Subs: 41

jump backJump back to quoted post6 Sep 2015, 14:38 PMOlekman


Wait a minute, why Sappers do more damage with Bren than Tommies?


Sapper one has better accuracy and faster reload, shorter burst. Works out to be better for the sappers.
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Olekman
6 Sep 2015, 15:02 PM
#318
avatar of Olekman
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Posts: 208

So the Bren from the weapon rack changes its weapon profile depending what unit picks it up? I think I missed something in here.
Rapid Conscription Rework ||| Recoup Losses fix ||| OKW commander - Desperate Measures ||| AEF commander - Engineer Combat Company
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Cruzz
6 Sep 2015, 15:05 PM
#319
avatar of Cruzz

Posts: 1221 | Subs: 41

jump backJump back to quoted post6 Sep 2015, 15:02 PMOlekman
So the Bren from the weapon rack changes its weapon profile depending what unit picks it up? I think I missed something in here.


This is nothing new, LMGs picked up by obersoldatens and paratroopers already did this before. Picking up the weapon from the ground will always give you the Tommy version of the gun, btw.

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BrutusHR
6 Sep 2015, 15:16 PM
#320
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Posts: 262

I have two bulletins that increases armor of OKW panzer 4 by 5%, do they stack?
An iron hide is the name of bulletin
In hoc signo vinces!
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