What good is the tiger tank?

Nobody seems to mention that a faust will cause engine damage to an IS-2 like every single time. If you cannot kill a crawling tank then what....
Without smoke or blitz the IS2 has considerably less chances surviving compared to a Tiger or any other german tank.

No one mentions it because it is not true.

Have you tried making a plan to take it out and not just a-move?

Can't do, too much micro.
Imagine how you would feel if you were allowed to a-move for 2 years and suddenly opponent guns can kill you out of nowhere.

Adjusting to something like that takes time, patience and a guidance from psychologist.

You can't just #adapt and #l2p.

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Enter Katitof, the king of internet bullying, puerile fanboyismo, and never contributing anything of substance.
5000 posts and still going strong.

Enter Katitof, the king of internet bullying, puerile fanboyismo, and never contributing anything of substance.
5000 posts and still going strong.

Would it be better if I added another post saying the tiger is fine on the contrast of the army that is behind it?
Would the fanboys suddenly understand that there is a SINGLE tank in game which Tiger loses to?
Would the fanboys suddenly get to their thick skulls that 2 or 3 doctrinal tanks or tank destroyers winning against tiger is not imbalance, but common sense and only logical conclusion?
Would the fanboys suddenly acknowledge that IS-2+ZiS-3 vs Tiger+PaK is decided purely by RNG as time to kill on both sides is about the same as it was proven in another threads?

I'd rather make fun of an idiot and point out his bias then try to reason with one as that always goes nowhere, you can't convinced hardcore fanboy no matter how many arguments you present and how many people will back it up and before you will try to attach that label to me, I was proven wrong multiple times and I have acknowledged it(the prime example of always wrong and never acknowledging anything is certain player whos name starts on A). Ostheerlitz is one of these people who worship their delusions regardless of actual state of balance.

to a point this is mitigated by higher RoF and better vet ability (TWP

Which is mostly theorycraft since paks rarely survive long enough to vet.

Without smoke or blitz the IS2 has considerably less chances surviving compared to a Tiger or any other german tank.

Oh, that ability that makes more smoke come out of the exhaust. Use (pay) for extra smoke. Regular smoke ability is good though.

Which is mostly theorycraft since paks rarely survive long enough to vet.

In 1v1 at least, vetting Paks is quite doable.

Would it be better if I added another post saying the tiger is fine on the contrast of the army that is behind it?
Would the fanboys suddenly understand that there is a SINGLE tank in game which Tiger loses to?
Would the fanboys suddenly get to their thick skulls that 2 or 3 doctrinal tanks or tank destroyers winning against tiger is not imbalance, but common sense and only logical conclusion?
Would the fanboys suddenly acknowledge that IS-2+ZiS-3 vs Tiger+PaK is decided purely by RNG as time to kill on both sides is about the same as it was proven in another threads?

I'd rather make fun of an idiot and point out his bias then try to reason with one as that always goes nowhere, you can't convinced hardcore fanboy no matter how many arguments you present and how many people will back it up and before you will try to attach that label to me, I was proven wrong multiple times and I have acknowledged it(the prime example of always wrong and never acknowledging anything is certain player whos name starts on A). Ostheerlitz is one of these people who worship their delusions regardless of actual state of balance.

Sic. Ahem.
Yes quite frankly, you of all people accusing others of being fanboys is fairly rich, you know. Pot, Kettle and stuff. Be that as it may:
1: You don't play the game much, and it kinda shows. Want an example? IS2/ZiS vs Tiger/Pak might come down to RNG in the sterile theorycrafter environment, whereas in reality, Soviets have ceteris paribus more pushing power even in the lategame and will just drop flamearty on the Paks, flank them with Shocks, etc, just have more varied and more effective tools to take down OH support than vice versa. If you spend a tenth of the time you devote to harrasing people on those forums to actually play, you'd know that. In the competitive Arena, the guy with faction choice goes Soviets...
2. Even if your points had more substance and would actually reflect the way this game tends to pan out in the contemporary meta, even if you were the goddamn second coming of Jesulin, your behaviour towards others would still be inacceptable. Quit being a dick 24/7. If you treated others in a real conversation the way you treat them here, sooner or later you'd be mighty lonely. If you think somebody cannot be convinced for whatever reason, just ignore them. I mean, do you seriously think "making fun out of (alleged) idiots" serves any other purpose than making you feel grand about yourself?

Unfortunatly the ZiS-AT gun (although has a lower penetration) does lots more damage to my Tiger, then when I've a IS-2 on the field and run over the damn Paks. A part of this is because of the survivability of the Pak against a ZiS. Bounce die Bounce Bounce...

EDIT: deleted, some people don't even deserve the time to post.

Sic. Ahem.
Yes quite frankly, you of all people accusing others of being fanboys is fairly rich, you know. Pot, Kettle and stuff. Be that as it may:

Everyone is entitled to have an opinion of others. I'm not going to argue to change yours.

1: You don't play the game much, and it kinda shows. Want an example? IS2/ZiS vs Tiger/Pak might come down to RNG in the sterile theorycrafter environment, whereas in reality, Soviets have ceteris paribus more pushing power even in the lategame and will just drop flamearty on the Paks, flank them with Shocks, etc, just have more varied and more effective tools to take down OH support than vice versa. If you spend a tenth of the time you devote to harrasing people on those forums to actually play, you'd know that. In the competitive Arena, the guy with faction choice goes Soviets...

And yet, despite all of this(which I do account for, believe me), there are people like OP who argue 1v1 or 1v2+ doctrinal abilities scenarios in vacuum space in attempt to reinforce their already void point.

Also, soviets(USF as well and even OKW to a point, especially vs USF) allow for more aggression and we all know that aggressive play is always better then defensive as it is the aggressive player who sets the rules in general. Ost isn't as aggressive and in return they have to play in response for what opponent is doing instead of blindly following single BO, which their tech structure and unit selection accounts for. It doesn't mean they can't win, it doesn't mean they are weaker, it just means they are not the ones setting the rules for the skirmish.

2. Even if your points had more substance and would actually reflect the way this game tends to pan out in the contemporary meta, even if you were the goddamn second coming of Jesulin, your behaviour towards others would still be inacceptable. Quit being a dick 24/7. If you treated others in a real conversation the way you treat them here, sooner or later you'd be mighty lonely. If you think somebody cannot be convinced for whatever reason, just ignore them. I mean, do you seriously think "making fun out of (alleged) idiots" serves any other purpose than making you feel grand about yourself?

Well, its not a date forum, you don't have to love or like me. You've ever played against me or seen me on stream chats or even PM discussions, you'd knew my forum side is not an accurate representation of me.
I'm easily enraged by stupid arguments and people trying to push for buffs/nerfs just because its way out of their personal skill to utilize unit properly.
Make reasonable argument, you'll get reasonable answer.
Keep repeating whine thread about single unit regardless of how OP or balanced it is-well, don't expect anyone to treat you seriously and since my work allows me to spend quite some time at forums, engaging in discussions, I'm really tired of telling people the earth is round when they go against all evidence and claim its flat plate on the back of 4 elephants being carried through the universe by giant turtle.

We both know there is nothing wrong with Tiger cost effectiveness, we both know it never fights any other armor in 1v1 or 1vX scenario, unless you have overextended greatly and we both know there is only a single tank in whole allied arsenal, wins against a tiger in 1v1 shoot-out, yet there are still people trying to argue otherwise.

Always the same people.
Periodically.

The tiger is good, but I gave up using it against IS-2s, it will straight up lose with the support of 2 paks, and yes this happened, more than once, an IS-2 going balls deep on a tiger while bouncing shots from 2 paks and the tiger itself and if for some miracle a couple of shots will penetrate it, it can use the incendiary barrage to pull back to safety.

Just use the ele to counter it and yes, talking about 1v1s.

You know theory crafting IS-2 vs Tige ris all very well, but you should never be fighting 1v1 Tiger vs IS-2 (I don't mean the 1v1 game mode), since the game is built around units supporting each other. The IS-2 has higher armour but performs better vs medium armour and infantry,a nd whislt the Tiger has good all round performance it performs better vs vehicles than the IS-2.

If you struggle with the Tiger and you reckon your opponent is getting an IS-2, you can pretty much hard counter it with the Panther, as the IS-2 can't penetrate on a regular basis. It requires mroe attnetion and battle focus to get to this stage in the game, but it might be nice to see people use the counters they have available instead of dumping everything on the Tiger and saying it isn't a good one tank army, because nothing works well when not supported.

I like the Tiger, but I've shifted away from it in 1v1 because I think I can do better with different vehicles or that waiting for it can be a death sentence.

In 1v1 at least, vetting Paks is quite doable.

Ok, yeah I guess. I play all other modes, mostly 3v3 & 4v4 and there the pak generally gets one, maybe two hits if it had not been scouted before, the enemy becomes aware and takes his armor someplace else or pull back to wait for incindiary, mortars and infantry to first kill the pak and then move in. Or just circle around it if that's an option. Paks don't run very fast.

You might get more shots off but that's due to the enemies calculated risktaking. The Pak 43 on the other hand is never disregarded and should say its prayers after having fired and revealed itself unless the surrounding forces are very strong and the enemy lacks arty options.

I like the Tiger, but I've shifted away from it in 1v1 because I think I can do better with different vehicles or that waiting for it can be a death sentence.

I'm sure some of the frustration comes out of bringin the Tiger out just because you can and because it's fun to have (cool unit), rather than tactical merit. It's an option, and doesn't have to be used, like all commander options. That's how I think of it. Yesterday I played a game and was busy fighting and ended up winning and afterwards realised I forgot to pick a commander.

Sic. Ahem.
Yes quite frankly, you of all people accusing others of being fanboys is fairly rich, you know. Pot, Kettle and stuff. Be that as it may:
1: You don't play the game much, and it kinda shows. Want an example? IS2/ZiS vs Tiger/Pak might come down to RNG in the sterile theorycrafter environment, whereas in reality, Soviets have ceteris paribus more pushing power even in the lategame and will just drop flamearty on the Paks, flank them with Shocks, etc, just have more varied and more effective tools to take down OH support than vice versa. If you spend a tenth of the time you devote to harrasing people on those forums to actually play, you'd know that. In the competitive Arena, the guy with faction choice goes Soviets...

2. Even if your points had more substance and would actually reflect the way this game tends to pan out in the contemporary meta, even if you were the goddamn second coming of Jesulin, your behaviour towards others would still be inacceptable. Quit being a dick 24/7. If you treated others in a real conversation the way you treat them here, sooner or later you'd be mighty lonely. If you think somebody cannot be convinced for whatever reason, just ignore them. I mean, do you seriously think "making fun out of (alleged) idiots" serves any other purpose than making you feel grand about yourself?

There isin't any theory crafting really here. Pak 40 with target weakpoint will completely own an IS-2. With incendiary barrage they might be able to force your paks to reposition, twice, thrice or whatever, but the IS-2 will very rarely be able to follow up since it will miss most of its shots and it only takes 1 missed shot for the PaKs to turn around and stun your IS-2. With stuka CAS it's not even a fight. You really don't even need the tiger to deal with IS-2s. PIVs + PAK-40s with target weak point is enough, although harder. Of course this is not the case if the ostheer player is significantly behind in mapcontrol, which is quite easy to do as soviets on most maps, meaning that the soviet player can just pump out 2 IS-2s for your 1 tiger and just stomp you.

And yes, the guy with the faction choice will pick soviets because literally of all the reasons except the IS-2. Gaurd motor with t-34/85s and mark target + guards + 120mm is way better than any IS-2. T-34/85s have significantly more anti infantry firepower, are more mobile, and with mark target + flanking power more anti tank firepower as well. Guards are also better than shocks except on the most close range favoured maps. 120mm is honestly better than the incendiary barrage etc etc.

I dont see how a Pak40 with TWP totally "owns" an IS-2? You stun him, might damage him, then what? He reverses back out. Both sides collect their vet, rep, on to next engagement. Unless OH has a Panther, its not like it can follow up on that. I am not the best player in the world, but in the top 200 environment, I've rarely if ever lost an IS-2 to Paks unless I got really stupid. Not to mention that you need vet 1 in the first place. True about the Stuka, but I acknowledged that before if you read my previous post.

And I really don't understand your fondness for the P IV for the life of me. Against IS-2 play that thing is largely dead weight, (and in fact its even more questionable against 85s, since it goes down in a heartbeat with mark target, plus they are fast enough to chase it down) maybe still good for counterharassment where the IS-2/ZiS combo is not, but if you are looking for an AI tank, the Tiger is by a long shot the better choice, its also far easier to keep alive. Sure, PIV builds occasionally works to punish excessive T1+Guards into call-ins cheese, but apart from that, I really see no role for it vs Soviets.

As for Guard Motor vs Shock Rifle, I play both, on urban maps I feel Shock Rifle synergises much better, plus against OKW the KV-8 can be extremely nice to have.

My problem when playing with a Tiger is not the IS-2 or the T34 but the mark target. With this ability a tiger will die from 5 shots from T34/85 and can#t even fight back because its turret turns so god damn slow.

I dont see how a Pak40 with TWP totally "owns" an IS-2? You stun him, might damage him, then what? He reverses back out. Both sides collect their vet, rep, on to next engagement. Unless OH has a Panther, its not like it can follow up on that. I am not the best player in the world, but in the top 200 environment, I've rarely if ever lost an IS-2 to Paks unless I got really stupid. Not to mention that you need vet 1 in the first place. True about the Stuka, but I acknowledged that before if you read my previous post.

And I really don't understand your fondness for the P IV for the life of me. Against IS-2 play that thing is largely dead weight, (and in fact its even more questionable against 85s, since it goes down in a heartbeat with mark target, plus they are fast enough to chase it down) maybe still good for counterharassment where the IS-2/ZiS combo is not, but if you are looking for an AI tank, the Tiger is by a long shot the better choice, its also far easier to keep alive. Sure, PIV builds occasionally works to punish excessive T1+Guards into call-ins cheese, but apart from that, I really see no role for it vs Soviets.

As for Guard Motor vs Shock Rifle, I play both, on urban maps I feel Shock Rifle synergises much better, plus against OKW the KV-8 can be extremely nice to have.

Double PaKs have very significant firepower and they can do alot of damage to the IS-2, if they are both vet 1 and it gets stunlocked, then it is completely dead meat. Even 1 stun will significantly damage an IS-2 and with some lucky RNG it can even kill it. Hell, it's not like you can't make more than 2 PaKs.

And then the lategame combo of LMG grens + tiger can come in and much more easily force away the ZIS-3 guns due to riflenades + tiger being more accurate againts infantry.

And yes, the PIV is bad vs gaurd motor, but it's alright againts the IS-2. Tiger is of course better.

And about OKW, sorry but going shocks vs OKW is just a bad idea. Why get shocks if guards are essentially a free win vs OKW

We'll agree to disagree about Paks. Yes, they are the best of the AT guns in the game, but then again, IS-2 is the most survivable tank, and they can't chase you down.
As for Shock Rifle and OKW, nothing spells massacre like a Shock Flank on a forward heal truck. KV-8 burning down SHQ in what, 10 seconds flat? No Panther for you while the IS-2 eats you alive. Not to mention it operates in a largely snare-free environment which makes getting wipes so much easier and enhances survivability so much. Also, I like to cultivate my inner hipster. Guard Motor gets boring eventually.

We'll agree to disagree about Paks. Yes, they are the best of the AT guns in the game, but then again, IS-2 is the most survivable tank, and they can't chase you down.
As for Shock Rifle and OKW, nothing spells massacre like a Shock Flank on a forward heal truck. KV-8 burning down SHQ in what, 10 seconds flat? No Panther for you while the IS-2 eats you alive. Not to mention it operates in a largely snare-free environment which makes getting wipes so much easier and enhances survivability so much. Also, I like to cultivate my inner hipster. Guard Motor gets boring eventually.

All this kv-8 stuff doesnt matter when you can just get 4 conscripts, spam sandbags everywhere and then hide with your guards behind cover. If the OKW player loses 1 single engagement, he instantly loses the entire game because conscripts sandbag the entire map and 1 guard squad can almost deal with 3 volksgrenadiers if they are behind sandbags. Only OKW choice is to get a flak HT, since thats the only way they can dislodge troops from green cover, but if you make 1 small mistake and it gets at naded you instantly lose the game.

Anyways, im going off topic here, sorry