No tech demo just poor design.
23 May 2015, 11:36 AM
#121
Posts: 742 | Subs: 1
Molo's are 15 muni, good thing they are not free from start
23 May 2015, 11:37 AM
#122
1 
Posts: 440
Insane ? Hardly!
All the upgrades you mention require a building or tech. Soviets can build infantry from T0 and plant demos with no building or tech upgrades whatsoever so don't make this a sov vs ost teching debate as that is not the issue.
Most Okw players opt for flak halftrack since the last patch, so blobs are nowhere near as prolific as they once were. Also Obers and shreck blobs have also been nerfed, so why hasn't the counter..
I haven't asked for the demo to be nerfed, rather that some kind of cost / vet be attached to its use.
Soviets are without doubt the strongest faction and as such can endure some small nerfs.
Lets agree to disagree dude, coz neither of us are going to change our opinions. But the poll shows that most of the people agree with me, so
23 May 2015, 11:53 AM
#123
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
Lets agree to disagree dude, coz neither of us are going to change our opinions. But the poll shows that most of the people agree with me, so
The majority actually agree an upgrade should be needed, but personally I find demo's to be a cheesy way of blob countering. I would much rather see the maxim get a buff.
23 May 2015, 12:29 PM
#124
Posts: 611
Lets agree to disagree dude, coz neither of us are going to change our opinions. But the poll shows that most of the people agree with me, so
Actually, last time I checked the poll it's about 50% either way, so.................
I would like demos to be changed in a way that adds to gameplay, makes it more strategic. Thats why I made this post and many of the suggestions have been creative and interesting. All your posts in this thread have simply been staunch refusal to consider any change and you provide no argument to support your position other than soviets need demos to stop OKW blobs. In fact I think you have misinterpreted the entire post and the posts of most people supporting change, because the common point of view is there should be some kind of requirement be met for demos, all of which would arrive well before okw blobs became problematic.
Personally i believe soviets would be just fine without demos since nerfs to any faction always brings a new meta, but that is another discussion.
In 1v1, as Ost i rarely see demos, just as i rarely see plane crashes, but that doesn't mean its not poorly designed.
23 May 2015, 13:14 PM
#125
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
AXIS should be also allowed to place demos!
Why this asymmetrical design?!
Don't know.
Why conscripts can't upgrade LMGs by default?
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
23 May 2015, 17:45 PM
#126
1 Posts: 440
In 1v1, as Ost i rarely see demos, just as i rarely see plane crashes, but that doesn't mean its not poorly designed.
That is what I have been telling too, nein? That I, as a player who used demos heavily, would almost never use demos vs OH in 1 v 1. You rarely see demos as OH,but I assume you see more demos when you play as OKW?
23 May 2015, 18:10 PM
#128
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
Lol wut. Eventhough low quality, i admire the effort put into it this troll acount.
༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つGibe Ketetof artist tag༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ
༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つGibe Ketetof artist tag༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
23 May 2015, 18:17 PM
#129
1 Posts: 440
Lol wut. Eventhough low quality, i admire the effort put into it this troll acount.
༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つGibe Ketetof artist tag༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ
Moi, trolling? nein
23 May 2015, 18:19 PM
#130
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
Moi, trolling? nein
The troll post/account just got banhammered.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
23 May 2015, 18:21 PM
#131
Posts: 80 | Subs: 1
[Post #127, Excessive trolling/ Spam, Gentleman, Please Don't encourage him to continue doing so...]
23 May 2015, 20:17 PM
#132
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
Don't know.
Why conscripts can't upgrade LMGs by default?
Abilities can be mirrored across factions yknow. Both Soviets and OKW lay 30 muni all purpose mines. USF and Ostheer can both lay disabling mines.
Giving demo's to Axis would be fine, I don't see what the argument against it is when it's much easier to spam sweepers as Allies than it is as Axis.
23 May 2015, 20:49 PM
#133
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
And what would soviets and USF get in return?
When 2 sides have equal amount of tools, you can't just give one armies tools to another without giving anything in return.
We've had already this discussion, you didn't produced a valid argument for it then, so please, don't even attempt excusing it again.
When 2 sides have equal amount of tools, you can't just give one armies tools to another without giving anything in return.
We've had already this discussion, you didn't produced a valid argument for it then, so please, don't even attempt excusing it again.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
23 May 2015, 20:58 PM
#134
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
And what would soviets and USF get in return?
When 2 sides have equal amount of tools, you can't just give one armies tools to another without giving anything in return.
We've had already this discussion, you didn't produced a valid argument for it then, so please, don't even attempt excusing it again.
How is giving Axis access to the same abilities as Allies making things unequal? Are you scared of actually being on the receiving end of demo charges for once? Afraid those USF rifleblobs will start literally going up in smoke?
If Allies want access to more stuff, that's fine, but "equality" isn't an argument against the demo charge when mines (Soviets and OKW/USF and Ostheer) being mirrored across factions is already a thing.
Give Axis demos, give Allies the ability to put away sweepers sound fair?
23 May 2015, 23:15 PM
#135
Posts: 1116 | Subs: 1
Permanently BannedAlex has got a point, many a time katitof you have posted arguing when axis was getting nerfs that they didn't need anything to help compensate. How is giving axis (the more munition starved factions at that) access to demos so bad? Nobody is really getting nerfed in this hypothetical situation, so why all of a sudden do we need to buff allies for axis getting demos?
Minesweepers being required to lay demos and given to every faction along with perhaps a 3 second timer upon detonation, and perhaps a cost decrease to 75 munitions IMO would be the best option. Or just be given to ostheer. Not okw, which imo you'd see the least from them due to their munition consumption+muni penalty.
Minesweepers being required to lay demos and given to every faction along with perhaps a 3 second timer upon detonation, and perhaps a cost decrease to 75 munitions IMO would be the best option. Or just be given to ostheer. Not okw, which imo you'd see the least from them due to their munition consumption+muni penalty.
1337 h4X0R, dank memes
axis
23 May 2015, 23:40 PM
#136
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
The point is, how good would it be for Axis to have demos, when they have a lot of useful munition sinks in comparison to Soviets. We don't see as much demos with USF since they do have munition sinks and it's commander locked.
If you want Paratroopers demos, sure have it, and know that the use is so niche that no ones use it.
Give OH demos, and give SU the ability to make bunkers which can heal, reinforce and supress. Hey, you would have demos to destroy them...
I'll say, make demos been able to be seen, so you need to use some clever use of LoS and location to make use of it (and not just in the middle of the road).
If you want Paratroopers demos, sure have it, and know that the use is so niche that no ones use it.
Give OH demos, and give SU the ability to make bunkers which can heal, reinforce and supress. Hey, you would have demos to destroy them...
I'll say, make demos been able to be seen, so you need to use some clever use of LoS and location to make use of it (and not just in the middle of the road).
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
23 May 2015, 23:50 PM
#137
Posts: 1116 | Subs: 1
Permanently BannedThe point is, how good would it be for Axis to have demos, when they have a lot of useful munition sinks in comparison to Soviets. We don't see as much demos with USF since they do have munition sinks and it's commander locked.
If you want Paratroopers demos, sure have it, and know that the use is so niche that no ones use it.
Give OH demos, and give SU the ability to make bunkers which can heal, reinforce and supress. Hey, you would have demos to destroy them...
I'll say, make demos been able to be seen, so you need to use some clever use of LoS and location to make use of it (and not just in the middle of the road).
Alright I'll be the first one to ask, how good would demoes on axis really be? On average allied squad sizes are bigger, therefore have a higher probability of avoiding a wipe albeit slightly. Especially considering that ostheer is very reliant on munitions, moreso thn soviets which imo is the least reliant. Considering that demoes cost 90 munitions, I think requiring them to be hidden is a bad idea, if you think nerfing their camouflage is a good idea then reducing cost needs to be domne.
Bunkers and dp28s for conscripts along with t34/85s would have made a great doctrine imo. But bunkers for soviets is not needed nondoctrinally.
1337 h4X0R, dank memes
axis
24 May 2015, 00:12 AM
#138
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
The point is, how good would it be for Axis to have demos, when they have a lot of useful munition sinks in comparison to Soviets. We don't see as much demos with USF since they do have munition sinks and it's commander locked.
This sentence doesn't make any sense. USF has a fraction of the munition sinks Ostheer and OKW do and you yourself said we see few demo's from them.
If you give Axis demo's (Ostheer standard and OKW in a doctrine); you won't see as many yes but the option will actually be there for players who want to use it. I would much rather have demo charges than useless shit like booby trap point.
Think about like this: What exactly is the argument against demo charges for Axis when people have been just beating around the bush going "b-b-but my asymmetrical balance..." which has been long dead since WFA came out. Allies are much more able to field loads of sweepers than Axis are, and have larger squad sizes as to not be punished as much by it.
The only people scared of demo's for Axis are the usual crowd AKA TAB, Katitof, ect.
24 May 2015, 00:14 AM
#139
Posts: 80 | Subs: 1
[Guys, just a quick notice. I Understand the frustration and emotions revolving around this topic, but please refrain from personal attacks on other people.]
24 May 2015, 02:05 AM
#140
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
This sentence doesn't make any sense. USF has a fraction of the munition sinks Ostheer and OKW do and you yourself said we see few demo's from them.
I think it's clear. You have munition sinks: 1919s, flamers, Bars, Zooks (yeah at least you have the possibility), nades, MG gunner, etc. Therefore you have less munition to expend in demos.
As OH i'll say you'll have a pretty hard time fielding them as you prioritize other things first: medics, LMGs, Tellers.
If you give Axis demo's (Ostheer standard and OKW in a doctrine); you won't see as many yes but the option will actually be there for players who want to use it.
That's exactly my point.
Considering that demoes cost 90 munitions, I think requiring them to be hidden is a bad idea, if you think nerfing their camouflage is a good idea then reducing cost needs to be domne.
My point is allowing a bit more counterplay (paying attention to the battlefield) as a way to balance the power they have. On a similar way on how S-minefield have the signs. If that means reducing the price, it would be ok IMO.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
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