The OKW conundrum

I still don't like OKW....however,
Having played OKW 1v1 in this patch fairly extensively now, my overwhelming impression is that OKW got overnerfed and is in fact quite hopeless especially against Soviets and US Cpt play. My winrate dropped from about 66 (which was in line with my other factions) to 50 percent in the course of maybe 20 games, all the while struggling against even fairly mediocre players, point being, I honestly doubt it boils down to merely me sucking for whatever particular reason. At the same time it seems hard to actually pin down the main structural problems facing OKW. One that is most obvious appears to be an old one, ie. the call in meta, another is certainly the Guard buff/Ober/Volk nerf that conspire to take away the lategame infantry advantage formerly possessed by OKW. I'll just throw out a few random observations/ramblings, what not.
1. OKW seems generally to be unable to trade cost effectively in the infantry fights over the course of the game instead of just in the early game as in the old patch. Infiltration nades allow for the odd wipe against unattentive opponents, but in general, it seems to have somehow become increasingly difficult to actually wipe inf. Even at vet 5, Volks appear outclassed against upgraded US inf.
2. If you go mech, literally everything seems to hinge upon the Flak HT. Losing it generally equals gg, something that certainly does not apply to Soviet/US light vehicle play. Also, while destructive if well microed, the counters are easily accessible, starting with the humble AT nade. Hardcountered by the US Flak HT and Cpt tier. Transitioning from it seems to be highly problematic, as you need heal, but at the same time, simply cannot fight cost-effectively without SHQ units..
3. Maps: Another old problem. In the 1v1 rotation, there is not a single map I can think of that actually favours OKW, and those that are more balanced, if only because it is so hard to set a triple cap up on them (Langres) are generally vetoed. Even so, I am no longer even sure long range/open spaces generally favour OKW, as PTRS/LMG usage and sniperplay has been on the increase.

Anyways, I guess it is fairly obvious I am at a loss. I'll try and make a more coherent argument out of this eventually, thoughts, comments, perhaps similar experiences?

Addendum: This applies solely to 1v1.

I think it should also be pointed out that OKW's late game power is not much comfort in smaller game modes when your operating on much less resources and are thus normally never able to see said late game units.

Ostheer is much easier to play than OKW, as you get access to every piece of equipment you need to deal with enemy armor AND infantry.

Making the MG34 actually reliable would go a long way towards helping OKW early game and the Kubelwagon getting not shit maneuverability would help to.

OKW is mostly fine. Their infantry are quite durable. And mechanized early vehicles are borderline OP and stupid for coming at 5-6 minute mark. Same with stuka.

That being said. t1 soviets is absolutely brutal against okw and is also borderline OP when used against them. Scout car flame rushes are scary as hell until shrecks, and snipers are some of the most aggravating things to fight as okw.

Obers are good, but mediocre in a sense. King tigers are also in the same boat as obers.

After all this OKW is mostly fine except for the above issues. The other problems stem from other factions, rather than okw.

Poulos, no offence, but this is 1v1 only, and OKW is hardly fine there, at least thats my overwhelming impression playing with and against it.

I hate the dependance on lackluster AT options. Schrecks are good, but will never ever be as effective as an AT gun. Neither is the Raketenwerfer. It´s more like you are totally relying on support AT until a Jagdpanzer/ Panther arrives.

OKW is very risky to play.

You can utilize the Jagdpanzer IV to great effect. You lose it and you are stuck with aforementioned lackluster AT options for quite some time. You can have great success with the Flak HT, but if you lose it, a comeback is hard - as you mentioned. You can wipe a whole army with the Stuka - or get caught without any form of AT and lose the game. Same for the King Tiger, lose it and lose the game.

In fact a single mine can destroy the whole game for OKW.

OKW is very risky to play.

That sounds working as intended to me since they put a munition and fuel penalty on them in exchange for a total cheaper tech with its own bonuses and vet 5.

Of course the game being squad-wipe city right now amps up the risk a lot more...

That sounds working as intended to me since they put a munition and fuel penalty on them in exchange for a total cheaper tech with its own bonuses and vet 5.

Of course the game being squad-wipe city right now amps up the risk a lot more...

Cheaper tech is not actually an advantage with the fuel penalty . and vet 4 and 5 is rare on units besides volks its not even worth mentioning.

To be honest i see no good reason for the okw to have fuel and ammo penalties at the moment. every single unit that once where superior to the allied counterparts have been nerfed to be balanced and several aspects of the okw army where never ever superior to warrant a fuel or ammo penalty. im looking at the puma and aa track.

As far im concerned the okw may as well get 100 % fuel/ammo and just adjust the cost of the trucks

Cheaper tech is not actually an advantage with the fuel penalty . and vet 4 and 5 is rare on units besides volks its not even worth mentioning.

Show me the other factions that can actually get all of their tech then.

(You can't. They won't ever because it costs them even more without the fuel penalty than it does for OKW.)

And vet 5 isn't hard on infantry units, it was fairly easy six months ago until everything on legs gets wiped constantly now. The vehicles are definitely harder though - I'd regard the Jagdpanzer IV as probably easiest of the vehicles to earn it. I'd be pretty happy with reducing the XP requirements on OKW vehicles to make vet 5 a bit more attainable.

I think relic should place the MG34 in the medic truck instead of as a doctrinal unit. Just to give OKW players another option other than going flak HT. And some suppression(not fuel costing) will help out a bit.

It's simple. Haven't u noticed higher skilled players do not play okw in tourney anymore!
Ost used to be the weakest faction but no OKW is not just the weakest faction but unplayable against players of the same or even lower skill. Everyone knows when u play okw u have no chance against a soviet players who knows what he's doing. See how guard mortar is now popular

Show me the other factions that can actually get all of their tech then.

(You can't. They won't ever because it costs them even more without the fuel penalty than it does for OKW.)

And vet 5 isn't hard on infantry units, it was fairly easy six months ago until everything on legs gets wiped constantly now. The vehicles are definitely harder though - I'd regard the Jagdpanzer IV as probably easiest of the vehicles to earn it. I'd be pretty happy with reducing the XP requirements on OKW vehicles to make vet 5 a bit more attainable.

Im not interested to know if you can have all your tech im interested to see when you reach the point when you can start producing your tanks. for most factions its pretty much equal.

It's simple. Haven't u noticed higher skilled players do not play okw in tourney anymore!
Ost used to be the weakest faction but no OKW is not just the weakest faction but unplayable against players of the same or even lower skill. Everyone knows when u play okw u have no chance against a soviet players who knows what he's doing. See how guard mortar is now popular

Yeah hooray for meta callin. You know i predicted that nerfing the obers would eb the final nail in the coffer for the okw. They have no advantages at all any longer and still crippled by the fuel and ammo penalty. way to go relic.

Im not interested to know if you can have all your tech im interested to see when you reach the point when you can start producing your tanks. for most factions its pretty much equal.

Because it's totally useless to be able to get an artillery vehicle or long-range tank destroyer later...try going without AT guns as Allies before you declare backteching as OKW is frivolous (and of course even if you don't build anything from the building, the building still heals+reinforces/repairs/giant flak gun).

Yeah hooray for meta callin. You know i predicted that nerfing the obers would eb the final nail in the coffer for the okw. They have no advantages at all any longer and still crippled by the fuel and ammo penalty. way to go relic.

You predicted the lynch pin of OKW being op severely hurting players!

While it is certainly true that OKW are struggling the most (specifically in the Soviet vs OKW match up) they are no way utterly dead.

as for the tournament scene, yes they dropped off. Highly competitive people do any thing and everything to try to win.Even if factions were perfectly balanced, some view would say one of them is better and there would still be a majority of tournament players using that faction.

i kinda agree that the resource penalties feel unneded now especialy after all the nerfs we encountered
right now okw lacks a solid inf option in the early med game unless you go owith a callin doctrione like pfusiliers to suplement your volks ( rip volks blob ) some might say that we get obers from flak hq but right now rushing it is to risky and to slow against a competent soviet
current meta kinda forces okw to go mech truck ( flak ht is the saving grace vs garrisons )med truck and then flak hq
a solution to this might be moving obers to med truck and nerfing them to smt like a bit better grens for 260-280 ( with lmg ugrade unlocked with flak hq ) this way we vwoould have meat shield volks backed by obers that would be able to hold their ground vs inf while still staying vulnerable to vehicle rushes or any indirect fire like the 120 mortar that currently rapes okw :/

yeah, i wish mech reg units were a touch more durable even if they traded some offensive capability. allow me to use them in support and give me the chance to actually replace something i lose.

the flakht and the luchs are the only units in my mind they have to control the tempo of the game and they are, probably as they should be, fairly easy to counter. what we're left with are defensive units that can't be defensive because they're pushed off the map.

That's the problem, OKW is hard to play in 1s, but better in 2s and OP in 3s and 4s.
My major problem with OKW is lack of medium armor.

I think OKW could definitely do with some love as of the current. As said in a variety of posts, OKW vs Soviet is a nightmarish hellscape currently.

A slightly buffed, non doctrinal MG34, as suggested would go quite a ways to stop the sheer enfilades of conscripts or clown cars that descend upon the OKW player. I've been playing a lot of 1v1 OKW as Luftwaffe recently and have been seeing quite a bit of success with that early MG and some rude positioning, but, oh man, if you fail to keep those Volks or other infantry squads alive(which is no mere task with the Great Wipenings of 2015 upon us), the mid game just falls right apart. Raketens have literally been my saving grace in a number of games, pushing back the T-34s until you can get your own (rather overpriced) tanks out to properly counter them.

I think OKW elite infantry could do with a little readjusting given current meta, maybe reduce the price of Fallshcrimjagers to 400 to provide real doctrinal alternatives to the currently somewhat unremarkable Obers, and allow you to have a fighting chance at flanking the nightmare Soviet weapons teams of the mid-game.

Basically:
-Less harsh resource reduction for OKW(In 1v1s, if that's even a possible adjustment that can be made to the existing client)
-Readjusted elite infantry options
-Non-Doctrinal MG to help with map control and dealing with Cons raining from the sky
-Flak HT is such a lynchpin right now that can be entirely screwed by well placed AT nades, that it's often make-or-break. Same deal with the Luchs.
-V2 rocket call-in to immediately remove the Soviet player from the match upon startup

Buff commanders. Elite Armor is a joke, FJ made of paper, flak emplacement is utter garbage.

Remake obers vet to partially compensate their nerf and reduce reinforcement cost, as unit preforms nowhere near 50mp per model.

Buff ze mighty sturmtiger.

I like OKW because it is the only faction that does not purely rely on heavy Call Ins and gives a lot of gamestyle options because many of them are viable.

You can start with Medic/Mechanized and both are good in my opinion (Yes, I usually start with Medic and love to play like that).

You can use a JP4/Puma/Panther as main AT force.

You can build all 3 HQs and don't suffer from this decision unlike Sov/Ost.

Commanders also offer the most strategic possibilities.

In summary: OKW is IMO the faction you can have the most fun with when trying to find new playstyles. I started playing OKW with Machanized and Flak HT only to realise that Medic fits my playstyle better.

Sadly most OKW players simply build 5 volks with shrecks and Mechanized (and got 2-3 Obers pre patch to form an almighty blob of doom).