Is it Always a struggle?

Hi guys, I'm new, and would also like to enjoy participating in this community, but I've been getting really tired of playing as ostheer. I mean, I will also ask 2 questions here (and one would be exactly here).

Is the oberkommando any easier? (I got sniper freakered in a match so I'm quite wary of that)

And, what can be done? I mean, I play the game, and it seems I'm Always waiting to call for the tiger, but then, by then, I'm already overwhelmed by like 3 tanks or more, and seems my resources are always slow. This is being demotivating for me, and this is not only with US but also Soviet.

I've been trying to use the sdkfz 251, as it is extremely helpful, but them I think I also spend a important quantity of fuel which is also slowing my tier. I really need some help. I don't have many commanders, but have the HT Mortar + Tiger, Pak 43 and Railway I think, Elefant TD and Puma OST

First, it sounds as if you play 1v1. If so, stalling for a tiger can be hard to do. Why not go Panzer 4 first, and then wait for the Tiger? And use your paks. They are essential.
A lot of this is just learning. To play on a higher ranking you need to know some tricks, tricks our strategists and other members of this community will gladly help you with

Welcome to CoH2.org

Thanks for the welcome my fellow, indeed I play 1v1, for this is where I can play the faction I prefer, which is Wehrmacht.

Second, when I buy a panzer, maybe I'm extremely bad, but I perform in na unsatisfactory manner with it, and normally, when I get to it, I'm quite in a bad situation =/

I played a match as soviet, just for fun, playing without much care, and it was just, wow so easier. =/

Welcome to coh2.org.

OKW is definitely not easier of the two anymore,id say both axis factions are equally frustrating now. It depends.

You really just have to keep all your stuff in position to support eachother so they dont isolated and focused down.

Mind posting a replay of one of your struggles so we can help you out more?

http://www.coh2.org/replay/upload

Replays are located in your Documents>My Games>Company of heroes2>Playback

Look forward to helping you

Hello and welcome!

As well, for when it arrives I find the tiger can be fairly out classed as you're generally looking at facing a couple jacksons, an IS2 or multiple su85's or 34/85's.

Strategically as the Wehrmacht your success will depend on unit positioning and synergy with each other. Learning capping orders and what parts of the map are crucial to hold can allow you to concentrate your forces. OKW and Wehr lack hard hitting timing based, "impact units" to dictate the battlefield and thus need to use ground itself. Mines, wire and bunkers can all be great to cover flanks as well, again, allowing you to stay as compact and focused as possible with your combat units.

And I tend to agree, at least for the moment, the Wehrmacht have the specific tools they need to win a fight. I always feel like I lack hard counters and I'm forcing my units to do too much as OKW.

And I applaud your desire to improve, which is always a great struggle. It means the system and yourself are doing something right, pushing boundaries and adapting is a struggle and can be really exhausting. It helps to be easy on your self and forgive mistakes (your opponents sure as hell aren't) and remember to have balance, burn out is really easy, especially considering the focus and intensity required for growth, competition can really be a burden.

Indeed it is quite frustrating, I mean, sometimes you put so much effort to win, and then, you get overwhelmed by 3 tanks, once I managed to swap 2 for three (lost the second in a bad way), and yet, couldn't keep against the USF.

From my commanders, what could be better? The Tiger one w/ mortar truck? Pak 43? Elefant TD one? The Puma one?

Also the Puma, is Strong, still I think it underperforms against Soviet as it does with USA.

Soon I'll play and post a replay.

Spearhead has been a stalwart in my load out since the beta.

Mobile defense is a hard counter to USF light vehicles and even to an extent Sov T3, but will require some hard work with Pak's/T3 if a game goes longer than 20 minutes.

I find the pak43 and elefant to be pretty unrealistic in 1v1 terms.

Mechanized Support can be useful for the spotting scope, and I feel like Blitzkrieg is a hidden gem as the 12CP CAS Run is the most devastating in the game, and the PiVC can help bridge the gap to T3 and buff your pak guns.

Posting the replay, this match I won, but I think it might show how I play and what can be improved.

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  Urbanzorro

  I Love God

  1x1 against USF (Wanting to improve)

  by: I Love God map: Kholodny Ferma

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Posting the replay, this match I won, but I think it might show how I play and what can be improved.

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  VS

  Urbanzorro

  I Love God

  1x1 against USF (Wanting to improve)

  by: I Love God map: Kholodny Ferma

  1

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I hope to have a reviewed by this evening.

Thank you for sharing, again. It takes a lot of courage to put yourself and your play out there wanting to improve, where everyone can pick it apart.

I have a friend that plays as soviet, and always give me a beating, I shall post it, if he doesn't mind, and play with him.

But by playing as soviet, I think, that bulletinless, the Shock Troops are not that Strong (even though they are still Strong), or maybe it was because I was playing against Assault Grenadiers (won the match, it wsant that easy, but wasn't hard, but I'm now wondering how Assault Grenadiers can be good, but I have not the commander )

Ok. First off, again thanks for sharing.

Bit of a shocker that one. I thought your opponent sort of folded like a cardboard box there. He surrendered way too early.

I want to preface my review with a focus on mindset going into the game. All your chat, it was indicative to me as worry and fretting. It is paramount to stay within the present and focus in game. Leave the discussion for forums or afterwards. Getting into your own head will lead to mistakes, fortunately they were minor in this case: a mistake in your capping order and an idle squad.

Before I get into this in earnest, a quick note on your early game Pio harassment. I thought you were too cautious with it, again, maybe that’s revisionist judging by the way your were chatting; but either way, I find the Pio is best utilized full out as a harasser or as vision for your army. This is especially the case now with support weapons where they excel engaging at the longest range, generally where you want to be keeping most Wehrmacht units at anyway, and giving you a precious second to turn and face.

Moving on, I thought you had a superb first engagement, you did a fantastic job getting your troops to cover and focus firing the first rifle squad. Exactly what you want to be doing when I speak about concentrating forces. Perhaps you may’ve retreated early, again, possibly out of the tentative approach you took in the early game, but either way it was not a big deal.

However, this situation could have potentially been avoided all together if you fully utilized the equity of your MG. It seemed like it was an afterthought during this game, sitting in the church for nearly 8 minutes, and as your cutoff was swarmed, and your main attacking section was outflanked, your MG was nowhere to be found, bear this in mind as I will be returning to discuss this in further detail later, because we need to discuss the cutoff: by this time you had 2 sectors producing income, your opponents fuel value tripled yours, which considering the expenses incurred by the Wehrmacht, this ignorance for your economy is simply unsustainable. It's paramount to defend your fuel/cutoff at nearly all cost, and will come down to the positioning of your troops, especially your support weapons, which will be a theme throughout this review.

I did really love love how you responded to his pressure with your own cutoff maneuver however; how you instantly struck back, cutting him off, especially from Kholodny East, which is particularly difficult. I thought you showed great intuition, poise and a feel for the game knowing that he was very weak on that side and you took the great opportunity to strike, and nearly capitalized on it, nearly. Again, your MG was neither supporting the main advance, nor was it covering the flank, you need to be concentrating with a plan and trying to anticipate how your opponent is going to react, which he did by swinging north and mercilessly routing your troops. This maneuver if executed with more gusto and vigor may’ve been the end of you, you reacted… adequately, personally pushing your offensive further south would have linked up with your MG and forced him to run around the map, as well as keeping your map presence and pressure on. Your other option, which you opted for was to fall back, given this, you really should have taken the time to at least run your units to the center and take a safer route back to base, I'm surprised you barely took any damage during the retreat. Again we spoke about the frustrations caused by little mistakes, this is one of them, and like most little mistakes, could be avoided by having and executing a plan.

This lack of plan I think was also evident in your build order, your rifle nade usage really set you back on LMG’s, healing and as the Stuart rolled out, fausts. Once again, if your opponent was more aggressive with it, especially noting your use of munitions, he could of really rolled over you right then and there possibly even pushed your base. You were left reacting to the Stuart which when dealing with all light vehicles can be very costly as Wehr, by 7 minutes considering your opponents map control you need to recognize their proximity to acquiring vehicles and be ready with a Pak trap (again, this relates back to your use of the MG and planning) having to build the structure and the gun took valuable time, again, be very thankful your opponent did not press his assault home.

By this point this is sort of emblematic of your opponents play, he really took his foot off the gas pedal, stopped concentrating his forces and, frankly just sort of gave up, you got very lucky by taking down his Stuart, (once more we find your support teams out of position) and for some reason he did not press home his attack, the three rifle squads were more than poised to rush past your out of place MG.

So in closing, I see in a lot of replays a sort of lack of overall strategy leading to a very unclear or muddy tactical plan, “what are my units supposed to be doing right now? What can I expect from my opponent and am I prepared for that?” by asking yourself those questions it will be a lot easier to micro and execute your tactics, you’ll easily start to build that knowledge through experience and you’ll start to gain some anticipation of unit timing, when and where they’re going to appear and you’ll be ready for them. Being really active with your weapon teams, moving them around, supporting your grens you’ll start to see a lot more success, but again you have to be cognisant and aware throughout the game.

Thank you once more for sharing and I hope you and anyone else perusing this thread finds this feedback helpful.

Indeed it really was a good feedback, while the game was quite short, and the opponent gave up too early (I was like, wow), still made me think alot.

More than often, I feel like: Okay, what can I do now? What should I do now? And then many ideas vague from my mind. I had now recently another match using Blitzkrieg as recommended and ihmo it was one of the most interesting matches I've ever had, but, I saw a very ugly mistake in the late game, and found myself, even clueless in a point, where I was like without having any idea. It was before the review, but after seeing the Stuka thing.

Thansk Jesus I learned now that cut-off thing, because I didn't knew that your supplies resources could be cut like that, I think I improved it a bit.

Also, thanks a lot Turbotortoise for taking time seeing it.

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  (BETELGEUSE) Cesargt5

  I Love God

  1v1 intense late game match for me

  by: I Love God map: Bystraya Voda

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Here another match, where I think, longer, could show my horrible late game skills (no joke, I don't know if I should be making grenadiers at that point or just always waiting for Tanks).

Indeed it really was a good feedback, while the game was quite short, and the opponent gave up too early (I was like, wow), still made me think alot.

More than often, I feel like: Okay, what can I do now? What should I do now? And then many ideas vague from my mind. I had now recently another match using Blitzkrieg as recommended and ihmo it was one of the most interesting matches I've ever had, but, I saw a very ugly mistake in the late game, and found myself, even clueless in a point, where I was like without having any idea. It was before the review, but after seeing the Stuka thing.

Thansk Jesus I learned now that cut-off thing, because I didn't knew that your supplies resources could be cut like that, I think I improved it a bit.

Also, thanks a lot Turbotortoise for taking time seeing it.

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  VS

  (BETELGEUSE) Cesargt5

  I Love God

  1v1 intense late game match for me

  by: I Love God map: Bystraya Voda

  1

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Here another match, where I think, longer, could show my horrible late game skills (no joke, I don't know if I should be making grenadiers at that point or just always waiting for Tanks).

^^ my pleasure.

I may have time in the evening tomorrow to do another review unless Australian Magic and/or Cookizncreem beat me to it.

As I said, those ideas will come with ease the more you play and the more experience you have. You'll start to recognize similar situations and will probably find muscle memory takes over micro wise. Other replays can often help if you keep an active mind and can draw parallels and connections. Be sure to try and observe similar patterns and behaviors, and learn from how others deal with things. You'll start to notice trends and I think that's what a lot of this game boils down to. Many people like to play almost with a flow chart, and even the most creative players will find that either units have such a broad versatility, or it'll come down to equity maximization, meaning more often than not you'll see similar stuff over and over. Depending on how much work you put in, you may even start to see specific similarities on specific maps.

As far as the late game in concerned, it's interesting as Wehrmacht. I feel as if it's a matter of bitting on to a chunk of land, holding it, and trying to draw out an Allied player with a feigned offense, essentially trying to kite them back into support weapons. For this reason, I feel like 2 Tigers, even two Panthers lose a lot of their equity once you have 2 in an even game. The soviet equivalents are just more cost effective. The key is keeping your support weapons ESPECIALLLLY pak guns alive, with vet and in a good position, force THEM, to come up with the answers and ideas. That's more what I mean when I say dictate the tempo of play by using the battlefield.

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  VS

  (BETELGEUSE) Cesargt5

  I Love God

  1v1 intense late game match for me

  by: I Love God map: Bystraya Voda

  1

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=

ill get on it tommorow mornin'

your capping order was fine

However a key mistake was forgetting about your Pioneers down south when you were fighting up north.

When you want to capture territory automatically and focus on a fight in a different territory:
Open the tactical map
Hold down shift
and while holding down shift click the different points you want captured in order
Your unit will do all the capturing automatically,without you having to watch over them while they do it.
Experiment with the different ways of doing this,its called Shift queueing.
You can also have a unit capture two points,and then retreat after capturing the points.

If you play Americans,you can also shift queue the crew to repair and then get back into the tank when its done. Theres all sorts of ways to use shift queueing.

Because you forgot about your pioneers,you didnt secure the entire south of the map,and you denied yourself alot of resources.

as the game progresses you have good unit preservation.

You built the same tech structure(Heavy panzer korp) twice? Ive done the same thing on accident before,but did you have a reason why you did this? Or was it just an accident? in company of heroes theres no benefit to building the same structure twice.

When you have alot of manpower and you preserved your units, build Caches instead of more units. Dont build moar moar moar grenadiers when you already have 5-6 veteran infantry squads.

Build 1-2 fuel caches.

When you bought two panzer shreks for 120 munitions,you couldve used the Stuka close air support ability(which costs 200) destroy tanks in one pass. You may have gotten both tanks in one passes depending on your luck and the type of enemy tank the plane will target.

Your engagements with the T34s with your panther wouldve ended much better if you used Stuka Close Air support at those moments. Also keep your front armor to the enemy at all times,and try to use the Panthers good range(50 vs the T34/Sherman/IS2/etcs 40) to avoid return fire. Use infantry or Pioneers to spot for your long range units. The only Allied tanks that have more range than the panther are the Soviet SU85,ISU152,and AT guns, and the American M36 Jackson.

If you had spent your manpower on more Anti Tank guns and caches,you wouldve had a much easier time getting more tanks out and engaging the T34/85s.

You already had alot of infantry,dont add more. for every extra grenadier squad you made you couldve basically had another Anti tank gun,or helped your fuel income

I take back what I said about the Stuka close air support,you DID use it,and it did have an impact on this game.

Also notice that all the manpower you spent on weightless infantry squads couldve gone towards making more tanks,as you had plenty of fuel but no manpower.

Command tank purchase made sense with all the conscripts on the field,but you threw it away carelessly and aggressively.

All in all you played well micro,unit preservation and tactic wise for the most part, but also made huge economic mistakes that your opponent did not capitalize upon.
Fix your economy mistakes and youll be on your way. just keep playing and improving,try to learn something new every game.

Thanks, I didn't knew it was a good idea to start building caches instead of adding infantry, sometimes I feel afraid of putting one late in game, considering the damage they receive from tanks.

Indeed I do use shift-capping, but I barely use the tactical map, in last game I played I did, but barely, it's something new for me.

The second heavy panzer was by mistake, I was like, oh man. I don't remember how I did that.

Hmmm, I need to do some developing on my economical skills, besides DoW2 I think (and even so), since Sc2 I'm bad at economy issues and taking attention to more than 1 place at the same time.

How can be the tactical map utilized? I can see enemy units? I think I will search for it in the site if there's something about.

Edit: Also I've been liking a lot the Bliztkrieg Doctrine, at first I didn't like it and would find it subpar, but now, I see how monstrous can it be*.

Thanks, I didn't knew it was a good idea to start building caches instead of adding infantry, sometimes I feel afraid of putting one late in game, considering the damage they receive from tanks.

Indeed I do use shift-capping, but I barely use the tactical map, in last game I played I did, but barely, it's something new for me.

The second heavy panzer was by mistake, I was like, oh man. I don't remember how I did that.

Hmmm, I need to do some developing on my economical skills, besides DoW2 I think (and even so), since Sc2 I'm bad at economy issues and taking attention to more than 1 place at the same time.

How can be the tactical map utilized? I can see enemy units? I think I will search for it in the site if there's something about.

Edit: Also I've been liking a lot the Bliztkrieg Doctrine, at first I didn't like it and would find it subpar, but now, I see how monstrous can it be*.

Put caches on points closer to your base or your main force so the enemy has to overextend to destroy it. and they should last long enough to pay for themselves.

if youre struggling with fights on multiple fronts the tac map might help a ton,but then again it may not. Depends on personal preference. tap spacebar to flick to different events hapenning ingame

I have a friend that plays as soviet, and always give me a beating, I shall post it, if he doesn't mind, and play with him.

But by playing as soviet, I think, that bulletinless, the Shock Troops are not that Strong (even though they are still Strong), or maybe it was because I was playing against Assault Grenadiers (won the match, it wsant that easy, but wasn't hard, but I'm now wondering how Assault Grenadiers can be good, but I have not the commander )

Shameless self-promotion:

http://www.coh2.org/guides/29278/mechanised-assault-guide


What Commanders do you have?

I have many, I don't remember which ones germany start with, but, well, listing them:

Festung Armor and Support, Blitzkrieg, German Infantry and Mechanized, Jaeger Armor, Mobile Defense and Spearhead.

I'm using at the moment Blitzkrieg, Spearhead and Mobile Defense.

Edit: Also found importante to say the Bulletins I'm using:
+3 Acc For Grenadier, -3% Reload I think and 4% Faster Reload Pak 40

Hi, welcome to the forums!

I watched your replay and one thing I noticed is that you didn't really utilize your MG42 HMG very much. The MG42 is a must have really in most early engagements as Ostheer because it makes up for your lack of numbers compared to the allies. And while building control in the center zone of that map is important, you paid the price for having 240 manpower sitting idle in the middle of the map. you could have suppressed 2 squads at once most of the time as well since he had them running around in pairs.

there were also several engagements, most notably one against Rear Echelon with a Grenadier squad that you should have won or took minimal loses but ended up trading unfavorably because you let your units stand in red cover. this is a pretty simple mistake to fix, however, and once you become more comfortable with the game this will be a non-issue.

also another tip I find useful as a fellow lower skilled player is to look at people's bulletins and commanders before the game starts. obviously if he runs the generic "give cons/rifles/etc. blah blah blah" they won't tell you much, but sometimes people telegraph what tactics they enjoy with their bulletins. for example, I played a match against a soviet player with ostheer the other day and he had two sniper bulletins, so I had a pretty good hunch that I would see a sniper in the game. sure enough, he actually opened double sniper, and I was much more prepared than if I hadn't paid any attention to his bulletins. again this won't work at higher levels, but I find it helpful in my games sometimes.

other than that what everyone else has already said was spot on. playing Ostheer has definitely been a challenge for me but winning feels that much more rewarding. don't give up!