Relic's Poorest Design: Contrary To All Reasonable Thought

Now, comebacks are likely also easier in CoH2 because resource income is also tied less to map control, but whether it's a big problem, I'm not sure. Additionally, the veterancy system also works to punish comebacks.

But by the same token it's not easier, since it takes more time to take away the opponent's income, since every territory matters, which Marcus pointed out.

Regardless, it often happens that when developers try to reduce the skill gap, or put in rubberbanding, they end up with either frustrating elements, and things that do nothing to reduce the skill gap.
Case in point, Brawl from Melee, and the most heinous example of RNG anyone can ever think of. TRIPPING. Literally Mao (worse than Hitler). And, Smash 4, RAGE MODE (knockback increased as damage goes up. It turns out that this also reduces the ability to combo, certainly not a benefit for rubberbanding.)
Likewise in Starcraft from BW to SC2. While they thankfully haven't introduced frustrating RNG elements, they've changed some of the core micro mechanics to make it easier (pathfinding etc). Yet it turns out micro is just as important when it comes to fighting against spellcasters, and people are woefully unprepared when having to face those things. Likewise, there was no decrease in the massive amount of pure knowledge one has to have about timings, when to spend and how to spend resources in this incredibly macro-intensive game.

Yet, in both examples, the better player will STILL beat the worse players JUST as often. The skill gap, while supposedly reduced, isn't reduced at all to where the worse will more often beat the higher.
Developer efforts to reduce skill gaps have always been massive failures in that department. Nobody benefits.

I am Chinese ._. is that good enough to read the original?

and I can tell you that there is no footnote in there at all.

Greetings from America

Thanks Marcus for that.

This is what I've always meant but been too lazy to explain when I write sardonically, "it's a fun, casual RTS," ie., not meant to be taken seriously. It's what long-departed Dave meant when he coined "for noobs, by noobs."

The strategic options aren't there. The RNG is frustrating and stupid. Instead of entertainment coming from appreciation of high-level skill, we get planes killing entire armies, tanks chased down and abandoned instead of destroyed near bases (I'm 100% sure this is in the code, it happens far too frequently to be chance), random mortar hits sinking tanks, and flame crits out the wazoo.

And a lot has to do with the resource system, the popcap system, as Marcus said. I'd add comebacks were harder but just as rewarding in COH1 because the teching was slower, so you had time to change things around before your opponent could capitalize on a 3-5 minute resource advantage. The game just swung back and forth better and more critically when it did.

I would like someone to explain me how you're supposed to come back and take back your cutoff with only riflesquads if you face a luch or two and have no fuel to invest on hard counter...
If you've been outplayed, the only comeback mechanism that should be available is "watch the replay, learn, improve and rematch".

Comeback mechanism, like rng are bad design that let thinks players they are better than they really are.

Greetings from America

Greetings from Leipzig, Deutschland

I would like someone to explain me how you're supposed to come back and take back your cutoff with only riflesquads if you face a luch or two and have no fuel to invest on hard counter...
If you've been outplayed, the only comeback mechanism that should be available is "watch the replay, learn, improve and rematch".

Comeback mechanism, like rng are bad design that let thinks players they are better than they really are.

You get airborne doctrine and you paradrop 57mm AT guns in your base. Or you build and decrew as many M20s as possible and use the bazookas of the vehicle crews to fight them. Or you get bazookas yourself. Or if you see you are losing you don't get the lt which is generally used to play aggressively and when in advantage and instead you build the captain. Even if you lose the captain it will cost only MP to rebuild it and you would still get access to AT guns that cost only MP.

I don't have any problem with the idea of comebacking in the game, it's a great mechanism in theory if a game is designed to let it happen "naturally" as a consequence of good micro/macro and intelligent decisions (the game isn't over till VPs reach 0 or the enemy base is destroyed), instead of being available to players with so many "artificial" options built ingame that prevent other players from closing games they should be able to close (for example by destroying the enemy base)

They could keep improving the game play as much as people desire it still won't be a big competitive game.

The WW2 scenario is not widely appealing. It is a conflict that people around the world still have many issues with, especially in far east asia. People are also still burnt out from the massive amount of WW2 games that were released at the turn of the century.

It doesn't play like other RTS games, no workers or mining and very hard counters (infantry vs tanks) leads to a very unfamiliar experience to people who are veterans in other RTS games.

There's a massive list of micro transactions DLC which influence game play on top of buying the game itself. Which puts off potential players. If you don't buy during a sale you will have to spend $80 to get all four factions and that doesn't give you any extra commanders.

You need really powerful hardware to get the game to run at a stable and smooth frame rate. Needing more powerful hardware increases the money you have to spend to play the game.

Don't get me wrong I find the vehicle crits and plane crashes frustrating but I think there are much bigger fish to fry with regards to CoH2.

So much drama in COH 2. The story of the Katyusha that survived a 50 kg bomb!!

So much drama in COH 2. The story of the Katyusha that survived a 50 kg bomb!!

welp quinn did say it adds drama

what a perfect example of this great "feature"... lol

I just had a game where an M20 2 times in a row cheated death thanks to main gun destroyed (of course NO engine damage!) instead of dying from my Puma. I can't even tell you how thrilled I was by all that drama.

On a more serious note, if this "feature" finally should be changed/removed, cause of the increased (controlable) leathelity, people would be encouraged to stock for heavies even more. I actually never understood why the HP differences are that significant in this game. Of course heavier vehicles should have more HP then lighter ones, but 2 or 4 times and more...

Units like the Stuart, SU-76, StuG, even the puma, etc. , they already have lower armor and less effective guns, that's why they cost less. But by having such less HP units become obsolete quite rapidly and you will most likely loose em if you try to fight with them. I don't see the meaning of "preservation" here. Well said units are ignored by everone for a reason.

At least to me it feels strange to me that infantry is more durable as most veicles and tanks.

regards
ace

Some small tweaks can change these crits in a way which is both interesting (Dramatic as Quinn likes to call them) and player-influenced. Some of them have been discussed by forum members.


- Crits only happen if the final blow is done by a soft counter, and also increasing the chance of crits for PTRS, Ostheer Panzer Schreck, Soviet Light ATG (Don't remember the name) etc. Hard counters like high caliber ATGs or Tank cannons should not be able to crit, with the exception of "Engine destroyed" crit
- Abandoned vehicles all have destroyed engine.
- If possible, the direction of the shot determines the crit type, frontal shots cause Crew shock, main gun destroyed (and similar) and rear shots cause engine damage
- Nukes (Stuka dive bomb, IL2 precision strike) should not cause death crit if the potential damage is more than the remaining health of the unit (Stuka should always kill the stupid katyusha)
- Multiple crits are not possible (Kuble dying after receiving 4 freakin shots from SU85)
-Abandoned vehicles need fuel to function maybe? (Ardennes assault)
- Just nerf the damage of Kamikaze skill planes, the damage is TOO DAMN HIGH.

--------------
I know these are not gonna happen because Quinn "DramaQueen" Duffy likes the randomness and the EPIC DRAMA of every battle. Well, this RNG separates CoH from other games but right now, it's not fun at all.

Tank criticals fly in the face of the penetration system as an added layer of protection, where expectation would have them not be.

Come on, none of those tanks got abandoned here. Not enough RNG in that video for a highlight Kappa

"It seems as if Relic has employed the dastardly method of ninja patching to return skillplanes to the game during the release of the British Forces.
Dear friends. Let us take up arms once again. This ought not be."

What...?

What...?

In an earlier version of this
http://www.coh2.org/topic/39265/british-trial-ninjas
Cruzz had "Plane crashes are back to 750 damage and 15 radius, Kamikaze lives forever" in the OP.
However, it appears to have been removed.
Combined with the lack of any word on plane crashes from this thread http://www.coh2.org/topic/39437/brits-release-ninjas other than the vague "What didn't get fixed: Pretty much everything else." I'm confused as ever as to whether they're actually returned or not.

I still think plane crashes should only happen outside the bounds of the battlefield. will get to rotate the camera and scream over his co-casters to focus on it during SNF tournaments and we can giggle when it happens, but it won't throw games for players who are playing perfectly and even take steps to counter planes and get punished for it.

I still think plane crashes should only happen outside the bounds of the battlefield. will get to rotate the camera and scream over his co-casters to focus on it during SNF tournaments and we can giggle when it happens, but it won't throw games for players who are playing perfectly and even take steps to counter planes and get punished for it.

My suggestion was to have them explode about 10 meters from the ground and just have the debris hit the ground, since physics in the game have no mass and do not interact with infantry, it wouldn't damage anything. And it wouldn't look too silly because the plane will be exploding in the air, where it won't hurt anyone.

"Every plane crash tells a story" lmao