You forgot 222/221 and Pgrens.
ill give u 222, But pgrens can work. granted very situational
ostheer CAS overperforming.
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9 Mar 2015, 20:10 PM
#121
Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2
Permanently Bannedill give u 222, But pgrens can work. granted very situational
There is no recording in all WW2 history of a piat actually knocking off a vehicle. Yes, it was THAT bad.
9 Mar 2015, 21:39 PM
#122
4 
Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2
Generally speaking: yes.
Ostheer is double penalized by it though.
Manpower: high reinforcement costs.
Squad wipes: 4 man squads really ask for being wiped.
Fuel: Most expensive teching and T3 not viable against USF.
map control: unlike every other faction OH has to invest MP into T1 building before even able to build grenadiers which leads to -1 combat unit being on field to any other faction. This amplifies when being against USF since grenadiers have to have some lucky RNG or cover in their favour as well as the USF player no being a complete troll. In Late Game USF single BAR will win 90% of all 1v1 engagement against similar vetted LMG grens not to speak of double bar'd ones - so actually capping with a lone unit is seriously not viable at all as OH.
so at best, they are counter to Ostheer, not this commander.
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10 Mar 2015, 02:07 AM
#123
Posts: 419
Ur wrong..
All Ost units perform well, with the exception of the sniper , mg42, and panzerwrfer.
Tech costs are ost main problem.
This faction will be viable in ones again, simply by making tech cost viable.
Panzergrens do NOT perform well. They are the worst inf ost has now due to cost vs survivablity. The damage they inflict is in the least likely of all ranges and they are soft and squishy with a insane premium cost.
Most would not call stugs performance well.
This is why cas and mech ass is the overwhelming doc choices. Ostheer has a hard time dealing with inf hordes and these docs can somewhat make them more manageable
10 Mar 2015, 07:01 AM
#124
Posts: 2396 | Subs: 1
-Stuka LOITERING strike.
-Some consider Stug-E.
-TWP is op on it's current state.
Stug III E is easy killable by anything except infantry or light vehicles. Add in this the time it arrives and you'll see it's not such a big problem. Related to TWP after nurfing pak 40 ROF what were you expecting at? I'm sure if you ask anyone who use pak 40 to chose between actual TWP and previous ROF, they will chose the previous ROF. Personally while playing ostheer I begun to apreciate schreck pzgrens alot more than pak40.
So stug III E and TWP are debatable, so that leaves you with 1 option which is not enough in order to claim that "ostheer has some OP units".
BeefSurge wrote:
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
10 Mar 2015, 08:34 AM
#125
Posts: 249
Stug III E is easy killable by anything except infantry or light vehicles. Add in this the time it arrives and you'll see it's not such a big problem. Related to TWP after nurfing pak 40 ROF what were you expecting at? I'm sure if you ask anyone who use pak 40 to chose between actual TWP and previous ROF, they will chose the previous ROF. Personally while playing ostheer I begun to apreciate schreck pzgrens alot more than pak40.
So stug III E and TWP are debatable, so that leaves you with 1 option which is not enough in order to claim that "ostheer has some OP units".
You do know there is a bug that allows pak to fire infinite amount TWP stun rounds? Pretty sure he is referring to that.
10 Mar 2015, 09:01 AM
#126
Posts: 2396 | Subs: 1
You do know there is a bug that allows pak to fire infinite amount TWP stun rounds? Pretty sure he is referring to that.
I don't think so. A bug it's a bug, not an OP unit.
BeefSurge wrote:
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
10 Mar 2015, 10:40 AM
#127
Posts: 1740
I repeat my statement from some pages ago.
I love CAS because it offers a playstyle that hasn't been in CoH2 before.
Sure, I have no tanks, but I usually get 2-3 Shreck PzGrens, a mortar, 1-2 MG42, 3 Grens and sometimes even a Sniper. Microed well and in good cover it is a very strong army.
JUST MY OPINION but I think many players complaining about CAS jsut complain because they can't A-move their blobs and kill everything in sight.
Move your units away from each other, seek some cover and dodge the planes. That's it.
There is no CAS ability that can't be dodged. AI strafe is pretty hard to dodge that's true.
But the AT strafe? Guys, there is smoke, you can see the airplane offmap about 2-5 seconds before it will even start shooting, your units scream something like "AIRPLAAAAANE!!!" and everything is over when you move your tanks away for some meters, which takes about one second.
Don't blob, move your units away from each other and move when you hear an airplane.
Your biggest advantage is heavy armour, use it.
I love CAS because it offers a playstyle that hasn't been in CoH2 before.
Sure, I have no tanks, but I usually get 2-3 Shreck PzGrens, a mortar, 1-2 MG42, 3 Grens and sometimes even a Sniper. Microed well and in good cover it is a very strong army.
JUST MY OPINION but I think many players complaining about CAS jsut complain because they can't A-move their blobs and kill everything in sight.
Move your units away from each other, seek some cover and dodge the planes. That's it.
There is no CAS ability that can't be dodged. AI strafe is pretty hard to dodge that's true.
But the AT strafe? Guys, there is smoke, you can see the airplane offmap about 2-5 seconds before it will even start shooting, your units scream something like "AIRPLAAAAANE!!!" and everything is over when you move your tanks away for some meters, which takes about one second.
Don't blob, move your units away from each other and move when you hear an airplane.
Your biggest advantage is heavy armour, use it.
It is though God by command has withdrawn every other throne.
And God is saying 'No. These people will deal with me alone.'
And God is saying 'No. These people will deal with me alone.'
10 Mar 2015, 15:18 PM
#128
2 
Posts: 2181
I repeat my statement from some pages ago.
I love CAS because it offers a playstyle that hasn't been in CoH2 before.
Sure, I have no tanks, but I usually get 2-3 Shreck PzGrens, a mortar, 1-2 MG42, 3 Grens and sometimes even a Sniper. Microed well and in good cover it is a very strong army.
JUST MY OPINION but I think many players complaining about CAS jsut complain because they can't A-move their blobs and kill everything in sight.
Move your units away from each other, seek some cover and dodge the planes. That's it.
There is no CAS ability that can't be dodged. AI strafe is pretty hard to dodge that's true.
But the AT strafe? Guys, there is smoke, you can see the airplane offmap about 2-5 seconds before it will even start shooting, your units scream something like "AIRPLAAAAANE!!!" and everything is over when you move your tanks away for some meters, which takes about one second.
Don't blob, move your units away from each other and move when you hear an airplane.
Your biggest advantage is heavy armour, use it.
Sure it can be dodged and I dodge the AT strafe 90 percent of the time, but when I don't I lose a full health medium tank in a couple of seconds. What other offmap arrives so fast and has so much killing potential? None
Tone down the damage
And lol about people saying the p47 is better than the stuka close air support. the close air support will do way more damage per strafe and has better accuracy. Compare the first strafe of both factions if you stay put. ridiciolous. After that you're probably out of the radius. first strike damage is much better than prolonged damage
10 Mar 2015, 15:23 PM
#129
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
Stug III E is easy killable by anything except infantry or light vehicles. Add in this the time it arrives and you'll see it's not such a big problem. Related to TWP after nurfing pak 40 ROF what were you expecting at? I'm sure if you ask anyone who use pak 40 to chose between actual TWP and previous ROF, they will chose the previous ROF. Personally while playing ostheer I begun to apreciate schreck pzgrens alot more than pak40.
So stug III E and TWP are debatable, so that leaves you with 1 option which is not enough in order to claim that "ostheer has some OP units".
-Stug-E: IMO it's more about a commander wise problem + unit grouping than the unit itself. If the commander lacked a Tiger i'm sure it wouldn't be use.
Is like having a T70 calling + IS2 commander.
-Pak40: you are talking about a neccesary nerf and not about TwP (Stug-G + TA included). In comparison, we had button (rightfully) and Zis (unneccesary) vet1 ability nerfed.
--.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
Off: i don't like when people talk about absolutes unless it's 100%. So the statement: "OH doesn't have ANYTHING" OP is wrong.
-.-.-.-.--.-.-.-.-.-.-
I'm gonna add: it's completely unnecesary for units to get increased range on nades with vet2. This makes Rnades completely stupid at this vet level (OP).
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
10 Mar 2015, 15:25 PM
#130
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
Sure it can be dodged and I dodge the AT strafe 90 percent of the time, but when I don't I lose a full health medium tank in a couple of seconds. What other offmap arrives so fast and has so much killing potential? None
Tone down the damage
And lol about people saying the p47 is better than the stuka close air support. the close air support will do way more damage per strafe and has better accuracy. Compare the first strafe of both factions if you stay put. ridiciolous. After that you're probably out of the radius. first strike damage is much better than prolonged damage
You should clarify: try do dodge AT strafes with Su85 on Trois Point
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
10 Mar 2015, 15:54 PM
#131
Posts: 170
God damn skillplanes one shotting Jacksons is retarded since it's almost unavoidable.
10 Mar 2015, 18:15 PM
#132
Posts: 1595 | Subs: 2
CAS does not need a nerf. The anti-aircraft mechanics need a buff.
The views and opinions expressed in my posts and topics are solely those of the Napalm. These views and opinions do not necessarily represent those of Relic, the developers, The Angry Bears and/or any/all contributors to this site.
10 Mar 2015, 19:12 PM
#133
Posts: 1585 | Subs: 1
CAS does not need a nerf. The anti-aircraft mechanics need a buff.
What do you mean by this it does not make sense to me?
If US you might have an AA HT, but you might not. If you have Shermans they are likely in combat and their MG's (if you have them) will engage inf and tanks not planes.
Soviets are screwed entirely unless they went T3, built a HT, upgraded it, and then kept the HT near their tanks for some reason. Also the planes fire from off map and so cannot be the target before shooting.
The AT strafe is so strong right now. Just look for places where pathfinding is likely to screw up and then call it in. You get to almost kill or kill any medium tank for 110 munitions, and if you are lucky they may shoot it down and you have a chance to crash and kill another tank.
10 Mar 2015, 19:20 PM
#134
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
which leads to -1 combat unit being on field to any other faction.
Explain me, how 1 RE & 2 RF at 0:58 and 1 Eni & 2 Grens at 1:03 is not equal if we are talking about units on the field?
10 Mar 2015, 19:21 PM
#135
Posts: 762 | Subs: 4
USF > AA Halftrack > Vet 1 ability > Anti Aircraft mode = CAS useless
10 Mar 2015, 19:25 PM
#136
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Explain me, how 1 RE & 2 RF at 0:58 and 1 Eni & 2 Grens at 1:03 is not equal if we are talking about units on the field?
Because crushing numerical advantage over these 5 seconds will ensure USF will cap 75% of the map.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
10 Mar 2015, 19:31 PM
#137
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
USF > AA Halftrack > Vet 1 ability > Anti Aircraft mode =CAS uselessJapan faction with kamikaze RNG planes
Fixed that
Also Im not sure if AA will kill anything before strafe.
10 Mar 2015, 19:32 PM
#138
Posts: 1484
USF > AA Halftrack > Vet 1 ability > Anti Aircraft mode = CAS useless
USF AA HT is 60 fuel, that means either BARS/Nades or fast Shermans/Jacksons only to counter skill planes?
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10 Mar 2015, 19:37 PM
#139
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Fixed that
Also Im not sure if AA will kill anything before strafe.
It won't.
While its possible to shoot down the plane, its extremely unlikely that it will be done before it unloads its payload on target.
Even loitering planes, 100% of them deliver first strike.
AA is made to counter these loitering planes, its completely useless against single passes, excluding soviet fuel drop which makes no sense.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
10 Mar 2015, 19:40 PM
#140
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
It won't.
While its possible to shoot down the plane, its extremely unlikely that it will be done before it unloads its payload on target.
Even loitering planes, 100% of them deliver first strike.
AA is made to counter these loitering planes, its completely useless against single passes, excluding soviet fuel drop which makes no sense.
And this is why I said, Im not sure about this, but I was almost certain that AA is useless vs single strafe.
In fact AA units vs CAS give bonus for OST player since he can get kamikaze plane after strafe.
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